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Denny
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Postby Denny » Wed Sep 29, 2010 6:06 am

I like the definition of a (Ranch Gelding) that sums up my horse he's really fresh most mornings and the cool windy ones you best be ready when you step aboard. He cost $2300 I think, He's a pretty good horse other than he's real rammy all the time it takes 10 miles before he starts getting tired and thats if you ride him hard. We bought a kid broke black QH mare and she cost $2500 kid horses are normally duds as far as I'm concerned this mare is bred to run and a friend bought her to calf rope off of but she can't run fast enough to scatter her own poop.

You have less money in a Broke 5 year old gelding paying $2500 than raiseing one from conception.Raiseing them you have no garantees of a useable horse.I'm no bronc stomper so I don't even try to pretend.
If your dreams don't scare you there not big enough!

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Justin
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Postby Justin » Wed Sep 29, 2010 6:36 am

flyingS wrote:Let me rephrase "lifetime" to solid guarantees. Does that help anyone get by the terminalogy. I was trying to drive home the point of a solid well represented sale that would cater to customer satisfaction. If you want I will go in and edit the post so that you don't even see the word lifetime if it will make you feel better. Some of you people can sure get narrow minded, broaden your minds a little. Give a person an idea or two instead of putting them on the choping block. Dog gone are you all always so negative.



i'm not going any further on this topic....there is no point. i may end up saying something that would hurt someone's feelings and we wouldn't want that.
you can't fix stupid.
-Ron White-

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gcreekrch
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Postby gcreekrch » Wed Sep 29, 2010 6:44 am

Denny wrote:I like the definition of a (Ranch Gelding) that sums up my horse he's really fresh most mornings and the cool windy ones you best be ready when you step aboard. He cost $2300 I think, He's a pretty good horse other than he's real rammy all the time it takes 10 miles before he starts getting tired and thats if you ride him hard. We bought a kid broke black QH mare and she cost $2500 kid horses are normally duds as far as I'm concerned this mare is bred to run and a friend bought her to calf rope off of but she can't run fast enough to scatter her own poop.

You have less money in a Broke 5 year old gelding paying $2500 than raiseing one from conception.Raiseing them you have no garantees of a useable horse.I'm no bronc stomper so I don't even try to pretend.


In this area the need for the kind of horse you are describing is getting less and less. When a person had the need of long circle horses that would lope or trot 40 miles in a day and use any excuse to buck, transportation was limited.
Most people now will load into a trailer and haul to the far side of where they want to go and then wonder why their perfect ranch horse won't settle down until they are nearly home.
I have been fortunate enough to ride a lot of good horses when I was younger. The few that we sold through a sale were represented for exactly what they were. The last few years my 2 old faithfuls and a few worthless colts were transformed into bear bait. It was more cost friendly than hauling them to a sale.
Don't tell people your problems, half of em' don't care and the other half are glad you got em' We can all run the neighbors better'n our own

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Soapweed
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Postby Soapweed » Wed Sep 29, 2010 7:36 am

Back in the late 1960's, a local boy joined the army. He had a young green-broke horse at the time, and my uncle bought the horse for $160. He told the boy going to the army that when he got back home in a couple years, he could buy the horse back for the same $160. The young man got home from the army but didn't need the horse as he left to live in Texas for several years. Meanwhile back at the ranch, the horse turned into a nice gentle using horse. Probably ten years went by, and the value of horses increased substantially. Weigh-up horses were bringing close to a thousand dollars, and gentle broke horses sold for considerably more. All of a sudden this man decided he wanted his horse back, for the $160 originally agreed upon. My uncle, being an honorable guy, sold the horse back. It wasn't quite the way it was supposed to be, but human nature is human nature. I was at an impressionable age and did sit up and take notice. All through the years I've tried to represent horses or anything else as honestly as possible, but I sure try not to get into situations that might come back to bite me on down the road.

One time I was dealing on a nice roan mare from an older gentleman. He wanted to sell her to me quite cheap, but he wanted her first colt. Even a deal such as this it's best to stay away from. I ended up buying the mare for his "cheap" price, but got out of any further obligation. I only owned the mare for about a week anyway. :wink:

flyingS
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Postby flyingS » Wed Sep 29, 2010 7:50 am

Gcreek wrote:
In this area the need for the kind of horse you are describing is getting less and less. When a person had the need of long circle horses that would lope or trot 40 miles in a day and use any excuse to buck, transportation was limited.
Most people now will load into a trailer and haul to the far side of where they want to go and then wonder why their perfect ranch horse won't settle down until they are nearly home.

Gcreek, it's unfortunate but true. People don't ride like they did 20yrs ago. Unfortunately someone's word and a hand shake do not mean anything anymore. There is a bit of a corrilation between the two in my opinion. Things are changing fast and not always for the good.

Justin, good ahead and give your opinion, no one expects any less. Your not going to hurt my feelings.

Heck Dodge even offers a guarantee. You can ride a Ram for 60 days and if you don't like the way she handles you can take her back. :D

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per
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Postby per » Wed Sep 29, 2010 8:10 am

Flying S, I can see a short try it out guarantee, but not the long term until the horse dies of natural causes one. Like a week or so giving the purchaser a chance to do some work that is expected of the mount. An agreement must be also made as far as the sale expenses etc. Also it would be good to have insurance on the horse for the tryout period. The horse would have to bring a pretty good premium for all the hassle.

High Plains
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Postby High Plains » Wed Sep 29, 2010 8:33 am

Flying S, the nature of the transaction that you're trying to promote is exactly what many people would like to participate in. Forget, for a moment, the exact terms of the deal. People want to buy from someone that they trust and they want the product to be as it was advertised. This is true of the horse business, bull business or any other. If I were spending $3,500 or more on a horse I'd like to know that it was "as advertised". I'm small potatoes, but that's a lot of money to spend in my little world while risking that the product might be a fake. I don't think anyone could disagree with the honest and forthright approach that you're laying out here.

Heck, one of the reasons that people shop at Wal Mart is because they know that they can take back almost any product without a bonafide complaint. Not exactly apples to apples with the horse deal, but the trust factor is the same.

HP

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Faster horses
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Postby Faster horses » Wed Sep 29, 2010 9:39 am

The problem is, it takes a long time to earn the trust of people;
to build a reputation that you are an honest person who
will back what you say. That doesn't happen overnight.

Again, good luck to you.
"All the Democrats know how to do is lie and “forget.”--Trey Gowdy

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Northern Rancher
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Postby Northern Rancher » Wed Sep 29, 2010 1:17 pm

Just don't sell to guys with quad ramps in the pickup. :wink:

curdogs
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Postby curdogs » Wed Sep 29, 2010 2:36 pm

It seems to me that you're wanting the benefits of a private sale with the prices of an auction. That's just not going to happen. If you want to have a trial period you're going to have to pay a premium. The reason sale horses are cheaper is because of the risk factor; nobody is going to bid as high on an unknown entity (unless they're in a pissing match with another bidder). It is also a lot more convenient to take a horse to a sale and have it gone that day than deal with buyers and no shows. Somebody who sells their horses at a sale isn't going to want to deal with buyer problems whilst taking less for their horse. Equally the sale barn won't want anything to do with warranties on horses they've never seen until sale day. Something else that comes to mind is that a seller that is going to try and deceive someone is not the type to hang around to hand out refunds!

This is why I will never buy a riding horse from a sale barn. I'm no Chris Cox, I know I can't turn around a dangerous horse so i'm not going to increase my chances of buying something that I can't handle. If you have the ability, you get the bargains. If you know your limits, you spend more. Private sales are enough of a crap shoot as it is. I honestly believe that you don't know what you've bought until you've owned it for several months.

I've been on the other end of a trial period. The owner had me sign a contract stating that if the horse was injured while in my possession I would buy it. That didn't bode well when the horse had broken her halter and was pacing the trailer just 10 minutes after leaving. She hadn't been ridden in a while, and I was so concerned that i'd lame her and end up having to buy a horse I may not want that she spent two weeks in our pens. I understand the need for a seller to protect themselves. I have only offered horses on trial if they are vetted here before leaving and upon their return. I don't want someone to cripple my horse then return an unsellable animal.

The sale that a few other posters have referred to I believe is the WYO horse sale in Thermopolis, WY. They offer a 30 day warranty in the form of a credit for the next sale if a buyer is not happy. I have never been but they do have an excellent reputation. This is because they know the horses they sell; they are not open to all consignments like most sales. These are their terms:

AGREEMENT
If the horse is returned for the reasons stated in the guarantee and is in
the same condition as he left, then the buyer may receive credit, no cash
returns, for the purchase price at the next fall or spring sale. The horse
will be guaranteed sound and as represented for 30 days following the
sale date.
GUARANTEE
The Wyo Quarter Horse Ranch Sales guarantee these horses to
be as represented.
What is stated about the horse the day of the sale takes
precedence over the catalog footnotes.


This is the one sale I would consider buying a horse from, simply because they do know their horses. 30 days to guarantee a horse as represented is risk enough, i've seen enough morons cause a good horse to act stupid within ten minutes of getting on them that i'd guarantee the horse but not the buyer!

BAR BAR 2

Postby BAR BAR 2 » Wed Sep 29, 2010 4:24 pm

I like to buy and sell a few horses here and there. I'm lucky in that I live in an area where there are quite a few good horses available broke on the ranch, and we have the coalminers with their 40 acre ranchettes. Its taken me a while but I've learned a few things. If I'm going to a sale with a horse and I advertise him, I will have him checked for any soundness or health issues by a vet. Next I will describe him to the best of my ability, and then I will give my name and phone #. This way you can call and I will give you referrences, or you can set up a time for you or your representative to come and try him out. Once the horse goes thru the sale though, he is yours. This is the best I can do. I don't know your ability, your setup at home or your feeding program. Here's a couple of "for instances". Before I left to go to the sale in Clovis, NM last year, the "Native" tells me to watch and see what a certain horse brought as she liked his bloodlines. It so happened I was able to get him fairly cheap. Well, after a couple of days in the pens, he got kicked out with the geldings. A few days go by and I went out to jingle in the horses with the intention of riding the new one. I was ashamed of how he looked. Come to find out, he was raised in the feedlots and didn't know how to get out and hustle. He had dropped some weight and I ended up having to feed him all winter. All my other geldings didn't get a hatfull of grain and very little hay all winter and stayed mudball fat. This problem wasn't the sellers fault, nor was it mine, its just two different ways of keeping and raising horses. The next scenario happened with an old trader I know from here and it was private treaty. He had a beautiful buckskin gelding that I just had to have. I asked about the horse and any holes he may have. The old man said, "well my daughter has just started him and he'll crowhop a couple of times and then quit". What he didn't tell me was that no one had ever managed to stay on past that second hop. I got him home and a couple days later decided to get him in and see what's what with "Ol Beautiful". Everything is going good until a dog 100 feet away barks. There was the excuse he needed and I was ready, chin tucked, toes out and a deep seat. By the second "crowhop" Ol Beautiful is wondering why I'm still there. By the third hop, he aint doing nothing but gatherin' steam. The fourth hop, I'm lookin' goooood. The fifth hop my left rein breaks. Now I'm off center and the seventh hop sends me skyward. Looking down at the saddlehorn and knowing this is my next landing spot, I'm gettin scared. The eighth hop is the clincher. As me and the "Native" pull up at the St.Onge, SD sale (she's driving as both of my arms are broke) every trader there runs up and wants to know the story on Ol Beautiful. All I said was "I hope that sorry SOB makes some good glue". That was enough of a description I thought. He ended up as high selling loose horse, and even went better than most ride thru's. The old man didn't lie. As soon as I came off he quit hoppin. I once sold a horse to an overweight weekend warrior friend of mine. I was honest and told the good and the bad about this little horse. Well, he just had to have him so we made a deal. Six weeks later he called and said things just weren't working for him and this little horse. Six weeks is a long time, but he was a friend. I tried to make it right and he said he'd trade for a little grey I had. I was taking a beating, but he was a friend. When he unloaded the original horse I had to look twice because I didn't think a horse could be that poor and still stand up. I stuck by my word and went ahead with the trade, but I let him have a good cussin. After I got the pounds back on him I went to try and work him and realized he had completely ruined this horse. I called and asked what happened and he told me that his dog was nippin at this horses heels and he got to kicking whenever something or someone come up behind him. Then he said when the whip wouldn't take it out of him, he drylotted him. Now when I sell private treaty, I get paid up front and you have a week to try him out. I take pics and video, and if he don't come back the same way, then you own the horse. I'm not a fan of the Billings Sale, but they will give you till Monday morning following the sale, I believe, to inspect the horse. Sorry for being longwinded, but I think there are way too many variables with horses and horsesales to offer much in the way of guarantees. as I've always heard, BUYER BEWARE !!!

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katrina
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Postby katrina » Wed Sep 29, 2010 4:59 pm

I love the stories guys.... Some good stuff..... :nod:
Don't sweat the small stuff.


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