Wonderful logic. I guess we should enjoy funding embryonic stem cell research even though there has never been a benefit to man or beast. Sounds like money well spent. You liberals are soooooo smart. Man I don't see how I was wrong on this issue all these years. Since we've allowed someone to flush theirself, we should now allow these embryos to be cloned and killed. Right you are sir. I realize there really isn't a benefit but we can give people false hope can't we? What would the people with these awful diseases hang their hopes and dreams on? Oh yea , I realize that adult stem cells might actually work BUT , that doesn't give a legitimate excuse and self justification to abortion, these stem cell promises do! Perfect.Bullhauler said:So has your wife adopted any of these excess embryoes yet Cal? These embryoes are never going to see life. They are leftovers at fertility clinics. More are washed down the drain every day then have been adopted total. Where is your outrage about that? I guess it is OK to flush them down the drain just make sure they aren't used for research.
Red Robin said:Wonderful logic. I guess we should enjoy funding embryonic stem cell research even though there has never been a benefit to man or beast. Sounds like money well spent. You liberals are soooooo smart. Man I don't see how I was wrong on this issue all these years. Since we've allowed someone to flush theirself, we should now allow these embryos to be cloned and killed. Right you are sir. I realize there really isn't a benefit but we can give people false hope can't we? What would the people with these awful diseases hang their hopes and dreams on? Oh yea , I realize that adult stem cells might actually work BUT , that doesn't give a legitimate excuse and self justification to abortion, these stem cell promises do! Perfect.Bullhauler said:So has your wife adopted any of these excess embryoes yet Cal? These embryoes are never going to see life. They are leftovers at fertility clinics. More are washed down the drain every day then have been adopted total. Where is your outrage about that? I guess it is OK to flush them down the drain just make sure they aren't used for research.
Name the diseases that have been cured by embryonic stemcell research?Bullhauler said:Red Robin said:Wonderful logic. I guess we should enjoy funding embryonic stem cell research even though there has never been a benefit to man or beast. Sounds like money well spent. You liberals are soooooo smart. Man I don't see how I was wrong on this issue all these years. Since we've allowed someone to flush theirself, we should now allow these embryos to be cloned and killed. Right you are sir. I realize there really isn't a benefit but we can give people false hope can't we? What would the people with these awful diseases hang their hopes and dreams on? Oh yea , I realize that adult stem cells might actually work BUT , that doesn't give a legitimate excuse and self justification to abortion, these stem cell promises do! Perfect.Bullhauler said:So has your wife adopted any of these excess embryoes yet Cal? These embryoes are never going to see life. They are leftovers at fertility clinics. More are washed down the drain every day then have been adopted total. Where is your outrage about that? I guess it is OK to flush them down the drain just make sure they aren't used for research.
Your ignorance is truly astounding. It is only trumped by your arrogance. Abortion has never had anything to do with this issue. Just because the right-to-life mafia thinks it does doesn't make it so. So I guess you haven't adopted any of these embryoes either? Where is the outrage about the excess embryoes being flushed?
kolanuraven said:Why don't you answer bullhauler's question instead of trying to change gears?
Where is the outrage about the excess embryoes being flushed?
been known to flush excess embryo's from some of my cows for yrs!!
what would you have done with them?
No one here has been able to answer it?
You are using the failed logic of saying I have to know what to do with embryos to be against the killing of them. Childish reasoning. You are also ignoring the Pandora's box problem of killing the embryo isn't different in your mind than aborting a baby. You say that they are both just tissue. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize that you and your crowd of baby killers not only would be in favor of killing an embryo to "cure" a disease of a loved one but you'd also be in favor of killing a baby predelivery to "cure" the disease of a loved on. My personal opinion is that you'd also be in favor of anything that helps YOU without regard to other human life. The argument is flawed even before it gets to this stage because there NEVER has been a cure for any disease using embryonic stem cells. Never! Once you can demonstrate a cure in laboratory animals then we'll visit the issue of whether it's morally and ethically right , which it's not.kolanuraven said:Why don't you answer bullhauler's question instead of trying to change gears?
Where is the outrage about the excess embryoes being flushed?
No one here has been able to answer it?
You can't have one sided answers. But then again, this is Ranchers and the world is flat with four corners!!
http://entomology.ucdavis.edu/courses/hde19/lecture1.htmlMajor Points:
* In many cases of abortion, the death of the fetus is precisely what the woman is seeking;
* It is the death of the fetus rather than the mere removal of the fetus from her womb that secures the benefit for the woman. So that it would seem that the appeal to a right to bodily self determination is frequently no more than a pretext for securing the death of the fetus;
* When medical technology gets to the point that it can produce an artificial womb, we will be faced with a more pressing question, "Does the woman have a right to the death of the fetus?"
Nope...don't care to! Thanks for asking anyway!
Some scientists have already moved beyond experimenting on embryos in petri dishes. Using a variety of methods, they are developing animal and humans into later and later stages of development before killing them.,...Scientists have created prototypes made out of cells extracted from women’s bodies. Embryos successfully attached themselves to the walls of these laboratory wombs and began to grow. . . . “We hope to create complete artificial wombs using these techniques in a few years,” said Dr Hung-Ching Liu of Cornell University’s Centre for Reproductive Medicine and Infertility. . . . Liu and her colleagues grew layers of these cells on scaffolds of biodegradable material which had been modelled into shapes mirroring the interior of the uterus. . . . “Finally, we took embryos left over from IVF programmes and put these into our laboratory engineered tissue. The embryos attached themselves to the walls of our prototype wombs and began to settle there.” The experiments were halted after six days. However, Liu now plans to continue with this research and allow embryos to grow in the artificial wombs for 14 days . . . “We will then see if the embryos put down roots and veins into our artificial wombs’ walls, and see if their cells differentiate into primitive organs and develop a primitive placenta.” . . . If that works, we shall ask to take our work beyond the 14-day limit now imposed on such research.”
As shocking as these developments have been, there is still another biological bombshell waiting in the wings - and this one provides the context for all the others and changes forever our concept of human life.
Researchers are working to create a totally artificial womb. Several weeks ago,a team of scientists from Cornell University's Weill Medical College announced that they had succeeded, for the first time, in creating an artificial womb lining.
With your viewpoints , the republicans I know would be equally ashamed of you. If embryonic stemcells hold as much promise as you say, private enterprise will prevail. There is no need for federal funding. Once private enterprise shows cures through animal experiment, we'll revisit the issue. Until then you are just wanting me to spend my money stupidly.Bullhauler said:This was one of the first issues that made me ashamed to be a Republican.