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Canucks - a Question

A

Anonymous

Guest
I thought Canucks had told us that RFID tagging- and their National ID and the tag operation was a voluntary rancher organization ran operation....Now I see on Agri-Ville where the Canadian government is charging people with criminal acts and assessing fines for no or lost tags :???:


Sawbones posted Sep 14, 2009 21:56


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A Macroie SK rancher was served notice in early Sept by the CFIA of Notice of Violation of Section 176 of the Health of Animals Act under the Monetary Penalties Act
This was as a result of 7 cows out of and allotment of 29 that had did not have their RFID tags when they arrived at a community pasture in May. The rancher drove 100 miles to retreive tags and place them in the animals ears before they were turned out that day. Despite his efforts, he faces the probability of a $500 fine. He will be contesting this action by the CFIA. What do you think??

http://www.agri-ville.com/cgi-bin/forums/viewThread.cgi?1252979779
 

Big Muddy rancher

Well-known member
It was a program initiated by the industry to ID our cattle for health reason. Since ranchers in Canada are just like the ones in the US it was made mandatory so all would comply. It is also moving forward to include age and tracking of cattle.
 

Kato

Well-known member
ID is mandatory. I don't remember anyone saying it was voluntary.

The rancher run part is that the program and database is administered by the CCIA, which is not a government department. The government can only access information in the system in the case of a disease outbreak.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Kato said:
ID is mandatory. I don't remember anyone saying it was voluntary.

Oh I do-- I remember the Big Muddy's and the Tams of the Canadian world telling us how they had to "voluntarily" do it- and how it was set up and ran by their own producer/rancher controlled so called cattle organizations--- so it wouldn't be government controlled----(just like NCBA and their RFID multinationational corporate buddies tried here)

BUT now it looks like is all that the CCA's, SSGA's, and and the ABP's did is sell their producers down the tubes to a government mandate that will tell them how they can move their cattle- and criminally and financially prosecute them for all the defects and faults in the system- even if a few cows lose their government tags in the trucks :( :( :( ...
 

Big Muddy rancher

Well-known member
Oldtimer said:
Kato said:
ID is mandatory. I don't remember anyone saying it was voluntary.

Oh I do-- I remember the Big Muddy's and the Tams of the Canadian world telling us how they had to "voluntarily" do it- and how it was set up and ran by their own producer/rancher controlled so called cattle organizations--- so it wouldn't be government controlled----(just like NCBA and their RFID multinationational corporate buddies tried here)

BUT now it looks like is all that the CCA's, SSGA's, and and the ABP's did is sell their producers down the tubes to a government mandate that will tell them how they can move their cattle- and criminally and financially prosecute them for all the defects and faults in the system- even if a few cows lose their government tags in the trucks :( :( :( ...

Never said it was voluntary and it never has been. We wanted an effective program so it had to be mandatory. It was initiated be the cattle industry and they have control of the data base. The Alberta government mandated age and premise ID but they don't have access to the data unless a animal health concern arises. The next step is age and tracking and tracability. Not all producers are happy about it but food producing is heading down that road and Canada will be ready .
Will the USA?
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Big Muddy rancher said:
Oldtimer said:
Kato said:
ID is mandatory. I don't remember anyone saying it was voluntary.

Oh I do-- I remember the Big Muddy's and the Tams of the Canadian world telling us how they had to "voluntarily" do it- and how it was set up and ran by their own producer/rancher controlled so called cattle organizations--- so it wouldn't be government controlled----(just like NCBA and their RFID multinationational corporate buddies tried here)

BUT now it looks like is all that the CCA's, SSGA's, and and the ABP's did is sell their producers down the tubes to a government mandate that will tell them how they can move their cattle- and criminally and financially prosecute them for all the defects and faults in the system- even if a few cows lose their government tags in the trucks :( :( :( ...

Never said it was voluntary and it never has been. We wanted an effective program so it had to be mandatory. It was initiated be the cattle industry and they have control of the data base. The Alberta government mandated age and premise ID but they don't have access to the data unless a animal health concern arises. The next step is age and tracking and tracability. Not all producers are happy about it but food producing is heading down that road and Canada will be ready .
Will the USA?

So in other words you- and your CCA/SSGA backed a big socialistic government mandate on the cattle producers of your country-- but tried to bull sh*t them by telling them they were doing it to themselves- - and now they are being prosecuted and fined for any infractions :roll: --------

This kind of reminds me of what happened in Australia- and what the NCBA/USDA tried to do to US producers for the last few years --until they stood up and told them where to stick it....
 

burnt

Well-known member
You really should be a little better informed before you make such a fool of yourself.

What's the matter - you got your backside booted out over on PB so now you are back to picking on the Canadians again?

You really are a sad, mean old man.
 

Kato

Well-known member
Sure, it's not nice that this guy was charged with not putting in tags. But it's also not nice if people like us get a load of feeders delivered to our yard and find some that are not tagged either. Why should we have to put our tags in someone else's cattle? We didn't raise them, and we shouldn't have to do the job of the other guy.

If there is going to be mandatory ID and traceability, then there will be enforcement of the rules. That's just the way things work in the real world. You can't have traceability without responsibility. Traceability means being able to track that animal back to the source. If the source refuses to acknowledge their involvement, then it's not traceability is it? You can't call it a tracking system while hiding your identity and location.

We've been put into such a corner that we're going to do whatever we can to access markets other than yours. If Europe wants ID, then it will get it. IF Japan wants to know how old they are, then they will get that. Desperate times require that we do whatever we can to survive. If that means getting light years ahead of you guys in doing what it takes to replace you in other markets, then we will do it.

We have been left with no choice.
 

Broke Cowboy

Well-known member
Oldtimer said:
I thought Canucks had told us that RFID tagging- and their National ID and the tag operation was a voluntary rancher organization ran operation....Now I see on Agri-Ville where the Canadian government is charging people with criminal acts and assessing fines for no or lost tags :???:


Sawbones posted Sep 14, 2009 21:56


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
A Macroie SK rancher was served notice in early Sept by the CFIA of Notice of Violation of Section 176 of the Health of Animals Act under the Monetary Penalties Act
This was as a result of 7 cows out of and allotment of 29 that had did not have their RFID tags when they arrived at a community pasture in May. The rancher drove 100 miles to retreive tags and place them in the animals ears before they were turned out that day. Despite his efforts, he faces the probability of a $500 fine. He will be contesting this action by the CFIA. What do you think??

http://www.agri-ville.com/cgi-bin/forums/viewThread.cgi?1252979779

Schitte happens

It sounds like he was sloppy - I suspect he will not be fined - although it might happen - after all he did tag them up - but the drive was expensive.

Other than that OT why you stirring the pot? Bored and ornery?

Fact is the tags are now mandatory and will be forever on. Just the way it is - whether a person likes it or not - it is now the standard.

So - you can continue to be the person you have become if you choose - or you can just recognize our rules are different than yours.

Try to be a bit nicer old boy

Cheers

BC
 

I Luv Herfrds

Well-known member
Just wondering about these ID tags.
What happens if your cattle are out in brushy country and they lose their tags?

We have some cows you can just about not put a tag in their ears because they have torn the tags out.
 

burnt

Well-known member
Placement is the ticket. We used to have trouble with tag retention and have learned that the tags must go deep in the ears. Both the RFID tag and the dangle tag.

They are harder to read, but you can't read a tag that ain't there. Of course, you use a reader wand for the RFID tag anyway, so it doesn't matter if it is hard to see, as long as it is there.

Since I have been putting them deep in the ear, our tag losses have pretty well stopped.

And for what it's worth, our greatest tag loss was around the bale feeders. Cuz that is where I would find them laying on the ground . . . . :mad:
 

katrina

Well-known member
burnt said:
Placement is the ticket. We used to have trouble with tag retention and have learned that the tags must go deep in the ears. Both the RFID tag and the dangle tag.

They are harder to read, but you can't read a tag that ain't there. Of course, you use a reader wand for the RFID tag anyway, so it doesn't matter if it is hard to see, as long as it is there.

Since I have been putting them deep in the ear, our tag losses have pretty well stopped.

And for what it's worth, our greatest tag loss was around the bale feeders. Cuz that is where I would find them laying on the ground . . . . :mad:

Would you mind snapping a picture for us to see??
We have some tag lose and I would be very interested in seeing yours..
 

burnt

Well-known member
Ohhh man, now you're asking a lot! I don't mind cameras and computers but when it comes to hooking them together, I am scareder than a rabbit in a fox den.

My sons are wearied of showing me how to . . .

But I will try to do it cuz I also want to put up some pictures of our new barn.

I guess that means getting up close and personal with a few calves as well, but that could just ahppen when we process them in a week or so WHEN WE RUN THEM THROUGH OUR NEW PROCESSING ALLEY ON THE NEW CONCRETE!! Wow! Can't wait!
 

Big Muddy rancher

Well-known member
I Luv Herfrds said:
Just wondering about these ID tags.
What happens if your cattle are out in brushy country and they lose their tags?

We have some cows you can just about not put a tag in their ears because they have torn the tags out.

We checked 275 yearlings at the yards and didn't lose 1 tag. :)
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Broke Cowboy said:
Oldtimer said:
I thought Canucks had told us that RFID tagging- and their National ID and the tag operation was a voluntary rancher organization ran operation....Now I see on Agri-Ville where the Canadian government is charging people with criminal acts and assessing fines for no or lost tags :???:


Sawbones posted Sep 14, 2009 21:56


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
A Macroie SK rancher was served notice in early Sept by the CFIA of Notice of Violation of Section 176 of the Health of Animals Act under the Monetary Penalties Act
This was as a result of 7 cows out of and allotment of 29 that had did not have their RFID tags when they arrived at a community pasture in May. The rancher drove 100 miles to retreive tags and place them in the animals ears before they were turned out that day. Despite his efforts, he faces the probability of a $500 fine. He will be contesting this action by the CFIA. What do you think??

http://www.agri-ville.com/cgi-bin/forums/viewThread.cgi?1252979779

Schitte happens

It sounds like he was sloppy - I suspect he will not be fined - although it might happen - after all he did tag them up - but the drive was expensive.

Other than that OT why you stirring the pot? Bored and ornery?

Fact is the tags are now mandatory and will be forever on. Just the way it is - whether a person likes it or not - it is now the standard.

So - you can continue to be the person you have become if you choose - or you can just recognize our rules are different than yours.

Try to be a bit nicer old boy

Cheers

BC

No-- I just wanted to show what has happened in every country that has started out with a "voluntary" or producer run ID- that the government has then mandated and taken over...UK, Australia, Canada, etal-- and how the producers are made criminals often by the failings and inadequacies of the technology currently available....

This appears to be what a few in the US want here now.... :???:
 

Northern Rancher

Well-known member
In 2002 I bought a 100 tagged heifers to breed and keep-I don't know how many tags I've had to replace but wayy to many-I have no problem with the I'D part of the equation as long as we find a bretter way of delivering it. also as not industry wide benefit but as a nationwide benefit the tagging costs SHOULD NOT have been downloaded totally onto the cow calf man no ifs ands or butta on that one.
 

S.S.A.P.

Well-known member
Placement is critical. This year we left the heifer calves until branding. If we do that again, we will stress the importance of putting them in deep. We've had good retention on the steer calves (done at birth) and the chute applied on older animals. Even the breeding bulls, who after scrapping have nothing much left but a waffled mass still have the RFID - no dangle but the button is still there.

I've seen them applied in not the best spots - even out on the end of the ear where consequently the ear-tip bends and hangs. One can't expect a good retention in these cases. We put them in as deep as the plier allows at about the 1:00 - 2:00 position

.... we don't have bush - like a dangle ID, I'm sure that's an additional challenge for those that do.
 

Northern Rancher

Well-known member
Any losses aren't acceptable in my opinion-even up north we know how to put in an eartag. I still think there is no way that the cow/calf man should bear the total cost.
 
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