Well that was a major brain fart when I took the course with ann I'm sure it was just called Bud Williams marketing school. If you aren't pumped up and motivated after a weekend with Ann I don't know what to think-I'd reccommend it for everybody. At that time i asked ann if she'd let 4H kids take course for free and she said she would which I thought was a nice gesture-would be a good project for the senior members I think. When I was a leader I hardly ever did projects out of the 4H books-I had the seniors sort and grade some fat cattle-then I got carcass data back and we cross referenced-the kids were pretty accurate. Another time I gave them a budget and materials cost sheet and had them design a calving /handling facility. They came up with some pretty practical plans and stayed within budget. Speaking of budgets I got a quote to do my barn roof with tin-this week in the western producer there's a bit bigger hip roof barn already tinned walls and roof for 1/3 the cost of my roof quote-I could move it and pour a new foundation and still be a tad under budget.