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Cowboy Hat Or Baseball Cap?

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webfoot

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Google Nevada Buckaroo style cowboy hat. You will find pictures of wide flat brim, flat top hats. You will find some of them around here. Go to southern Idaho and Oregon and down into Nevada and you will find it is a real popular style of hat worn by cowboys and cattlemen all over that region.
I tried to copy a picture of one but couldn't make it work.
 

Mountain Cowgirl

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All this hat talk makes me smile. The flat brim hat was originally seen in Spain. Later in Mexico and then the USA. Southwest American Indians wore flat-brimmed hats but used full domed crowns. The Spaniards of wealth and breeders of fancy horses had the crowns of their hats flat and lower.

Hollywood got in on the hat shaping thing for their early westerns. We remember some of the old characters because their hat shape gave them their look. Most of these shapes were seen at early rodeos. The size of brims had a lot to do with the climate. A wide flat brim knocks off more sun than a rolled-up one. Rodeo had a bearing on hat shapes because of the way the rider picked up his hat off the ground. The front crease was developed because of the old-time manners of a man tipping his hat when a lady walked by, etc. He grabbed the front of his hat and over time a crease developed.

I laugh about all the discussions about the Montana crease. Look at all the old photos of Montana working cowboys. There is no consistency to how their hats are creased, especially the crown. The shape referred to as the Montana crease is based on the Canadian Mountie just a higher crown. What many internet cowboy hat experts today are calling the Montana crease and on occasion the Wyoming crease was first seen in the late 1800s in Wickenburg, Arizona, and even Tom Nix had his hats copied from that shape and later after the Lonesome Dove movie came out, Montana and Wyoming fashion-based business-oriented "cowboys" most newcomers from California, decided to claim this crease. Make it a fashion statement and part the rodeo drug store cowboys from some flat green Franklins. Ease the burden on their overstuffed wallets.

Buckeroo is just the American term for vaquero. When I think of buckeroo I think of the stick pony and that little flat crown and brimmed red hat with the chin cord dangling down and some Hollywood kid prancing around his famous mama's million-dollar living room and him telling the maid, "I buckeroo, I buckeroo," and the Spanish speaking maid saying in broken English, "No, you no vaquero, no buckeroo, you loco in the cabeza."

I really don't give a fat pack rat's tail or a possums puke about how anyone creases their hat or what the toe shape of their boots is, but I do get my skivvies in a painful twist over all the profiteers and western hat stylish that drop names and use states and regions to give their "cowboy" hat shapes American validity.

"Listen, sir, I know this hat is uglier than sin, but it is the shape Pecos Bill wore when he rode Old Faithful back in 1807 on his way to Montana. It has the mountain peak high altitude crown"

"But sir salesman, I am headed to Nevada to buy a ranch, not Montana."

"Sorry, my mistake."

The salesman throws the hat down, stomps on the hat crown, rolls the brim backward, beats the hat against the counter, dumps coffee on it, and drys it with a hairdryer as he flattens the crown and brim.

"There you go my Nevada Buckeroo only $300 for this zero X China-made hat and I will wavier the $100 reshaping charge."

And that my friends is how the Buckeroo hat of today was invented hahaha!

Webfoot is correct that the flat brim and flat crown hat is popular in Oregon, Idaho, and Nevada. I do see it popular with us ladies. It is starting to grow on me but first I must disassociate it with the buckeroo poo poo. If I had $1000 to spare I would have the Salem, Oregon maker make me a 100X. I am thinking a dark gray would go well with my hair.

I had a black one back in the 1960s-80s. It was flat 3 1/2" brim and flat crown patterned after the Jerez Spain vaqueros. I and a friend were coming back from a trip up the Snake to a remote ranch where we had helped bulls with their gender conversion when a powerful thirst overcame her. She pulled into the Huntington, Oregon tavern and we went in and sat down. I left my hat on since everyone else was wearing one. A couple of guys looking like urban cowboys (tourist no doubt), with no stains or signs of use on their hats, boots, or clothes, started cracking jokes about my hat and saying I looked more like Tim Shawn (Lee Marvin) than Cat Ballou. An old and rather large weathered local rancher stood up and went over and calmly explained to them that they best turn around finish their beer and leave. He had his hands in the hollow of their shoulders so they obliged. He didn't know either of us but knew what we had been doing as the bloodstains were a giveaway. He assured the two drunks that he was doing them a favor because should either or both of us ladies lose our cool, he would be making pine boxes for them and he hated doing carpentry. My friend had to rib me about not changing into very tight jeans and not having another real cowboy-looking hat for such occasions. I assured her I wasn't fond of traitor Jane and Fonda was the last person I wanted to look like. I was glad I was wearing my relaxed and dirty bareback Lawman jeans and not my very tight slim-fit Lawman with the big rear pockets. I loved those jeans, but for corral work tight jeans, especially heavyweight ones like the old Lawman, don't work. All of you ladies of age before lightweight stretch jeans know what I am saying.

Photo from Jerez, Spain and Crow Camp Ranch in Oregon and Cat Ballou
 

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Cody-n-Nancy

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Google Nevada Buckaroo style cowboy hat. You will find pictures of wide flat brim, flat top hats. You will find some of them around here. Go to southern Idaho and Oregon and down into Nevada and you will find it is a real popular style of hat worn by cowboys and cattlemen all over that region.
I tried to copy a picture of one but couldn't make it work.

Just looked at some "Buckaroo" style cowboy hats online and some actually are not flat at all. They look like the regular Resistol or Wrangler hats.
Anyway, I've never seen a rodeo cowboy or cowgirl wearing one of these "flat brim" hats in the arena. Wife and I did see a few young ladies (rodeo fans) wearing them, last night at the San Angelo, Texas rodeo on the Cowboy Channel.

One thing for sure, these "flat brim hats" aren't going to put the regular cowboy hats out of business!
 

Cody-n-Nancy

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I also remember, in the movie Billy Jack, he wore an Indian type hat, that definitely looks like the "flat brim" of today.

No matter how popular they may be in parts of the U.S., we will stick with our Resistol "George Strait" style hat aka Cattlemen's cowboy hat. I absolutely love how my wife looks in her straw or felt one!
 

Faster horses

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Thanks for the explanation Mountain Cowgirl, I enjoyed it. We don't have many flat-brimmed hats in our area, but there
are some. People that are wearing them are making a statement, I do believe. They look great on some people that aren't 'dudes' because you can spot that a mile away. I like seeing them on those (Vaqueros) that use the fancy bits, although I am not a fan of a spade bit. We had a good friend in Montana that rode his horse with a spade bit and I convinced him not to (finally) because the horse wasn't that well broke and certainly not spade-bit broke which takes YEARS. When he tied his horse by the bridle reins to a metal panel leaned against the fence and the horse spooked and drug the panel, I figured it was time to convince him....it might be different now, but at one point I didn't know anyone in Montana that was horseman enough to ride a horse in a spade bit.

Gosh, I got off on a whole different subject. Please forgive me.
 

Mountain Cowgirl

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Thanks for the explanation Mountain Cowgirl, I enjoyed it. We don't have many flat-brimmed hats in our area, but there
are some. People that are wearing them are making a statement, I do believe. They look great on some people that aren't 'dudes' because you can spot that a mile away. I like seeing them on those (Vaqueros) that use the fancy bits, although I am not a fan of a spade bit. We had a good friend in Montana that rode his horse with a spade bit and I convinced him not to (finally) because the horse wasn't that well broke and certainly not spade-bit broke which takes YEARS. When he tied his horse by the bridle reins to a metal panel leaned against the fence and the horse spooked and drug the panel, I figured it was time to convince him....it might be different now, but at one point I didn't know anyone in Montana that was horseman enough to ride a horse in a spade bit.

Gosh, I got off on a whole different subject. Please forgive me.
No problem! Go back and read my post again with the new addition of my Huntington, Oregon story. Huntington is just before Webfoots Durkee. It is just off the freeway and now I read that part of the town burned in 2019. Did you ever wear Lawman jeans? I loved those jeans but that heavy denim and the bareback high waist style lost popularity. I still wear high waist relaxed thigh jeans because I love the freedom they allow. The lower waist pinch into my back nerve. The story involves my Vaquero-style custom-made hat.
 

webfoot

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It was just the tavern that burned down. Some idiot was mad at his girl friend so he took 5 gallons of gas to a 100+ year old historic building. Well he now has some time to think about it. I forget how many years but more than one.
Take a look at the first picture in those last branding pictures I posted. The young man coming in for the heel shot is wearing one of those flat hats. His dad wears that style too. They have a ranch down around Unity. They are both darn sure hands. That hat style and the whole Vaquero thing do not necessarily go hand in hand. Most of the people I see with those hats don't have Vaquero gear on their horse. The majority of the people I see with those hats are just plain for real cowboys and cattlemen and women.
Back when I was first riding in rodeos the younger guys mostly had 3 inch brim hats. There were older guys with 2 1/2 inch and even 2 inch brim hats. Now there are lots of 4 inch brims and some that look to be 5 inch. Styles change. Everyone wore cowboy cut Wranglers. Now you see lot of Chinch jeans and other brands. One of the best cowboys I have known always wore one of those striped railroad engineer caps. I see a lot of drug store cowboys dressed to the 9's in the cloths they think cowboy should wear. It is not what you are wearing that makes you who you are.
 

leanin' H

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Lots of flat brims in this country too. Met some New Mexico hands with the Taco style hats. Plumb ranchy guys who could do it all. How a hat is shaped makes no difference to me. What’s under said hat does. And you can pick out a duded up city boy playing cowboy from a mile away. Now I will draw the line at cinch jeans! I’m a wrangler guy myself and I do not kind folks who wear Levi’s. But then new styled cinch things may as well have a giant neon sign that says FROM THE CITY on them. Nada!!!!
 

Cody-n-Nancy

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It was just the tavern that burned down. Some idiot was mad at his girl friend so he took 5 gallons of gas to a 100+ year old historic building. Well he now has some time to think about it. I forget how many years but more than one.
Take a look at the first picture in those last branding pictures I posted. The young man coming in for the heel shot is wearing one of those flat hats. His dad wears that style too. They have a ranch down around Unity. They are both darn sure hands. That hat style and the whole Vaquero thing do not necessarily go hand in hand. Most of the people I see with those hats don't have Vaquero gear on their horse. The majority of the people I see with those hats are just plain for real cowboys and cattlemen and women.
Back when I was first riding in rodeos the younger guys mostly had 3 inch brim hats. There were older guys with 2 1/2 inch and even 2 inch brim hats. Now there are lots of 4 inch brims and some that look to be 5 inch. Styles change. Everyone wore cowboy cut Wranglers. Now you see lot of Chinch jeans and other brands. One of the best cowboys I have known always wore one of those striped railroad engineer caps. I see a lot of drug store cowboys dressed to the 9's in the cloths they think cowboy should wear. It is not what you are wearing that makes you who you are.
"Drug-store cowboys" meaning, the nightclub types? Then again, myself and my "heeler" use to go to a nightclub in Temecula, California and play around on their Lap-n-Tap/Rollo Roper. He was actually able to rope the rear legs, that were on wheels, when released. The Club put the Lap-n-Tap/Rollo Roper in a storage area of the Club when The Coors Roping Arena was installed into the Club. All electronic, where two guys could rope. Spot for the "header" and spot for the "heeler". One of the "heeling" legs broke, so the Lap-n-Tap/Rollo Roper was brought back out. Actually seen a Lap-n-Tap/Rollo Roper at Cowboy Christmas in Vegas during the NFR some years ago.

After both Friday and Saturday evenings PRCA Temecula Rodeo, the nightclub (Stampede) was full of rodeo contestants. Both rough stock riders, on the mechanical bull and timed-event guys (ropers) on the Lap-n-Tap/Rollo Roper.

And, I remember, at most So. California rodeos, there was a rodeo dance after the go-around, that some of us went to. Two of the biggest were Temecula and Norco. Left the horses in the trailers and headed over to the dance, after the rodeo was over. Heck, there were even some barrel racers at the dance.

Actually, my wife got to see me on the Lap-n-Tap/Rollo Roper as well as in the arena. Yep, those were the "good ol' days" of team roping action!
 

Mountain Cowgirl

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Urban cowboy is in reference to the western dressed nightclub rodeo enthusiast. Drugstore cowboy is in reference to one that dresses western in clothes Hollywood tells us are cowboy but has no real enduring ranch experience. Both are stereotypical "cowboys" with little or no similarity to the working ranch owner or hand. Being just a rodeo performer, nightclub or arena doesn't make one a cattle person I.E. cowboy or cowgirl.

Also, drugstore cowboy has another meaning and that is one that loiters around town in western clothes. New urban meanings include those taking chances selling illegal drugs. In many cases, the term cowboy is used derogatorily. In movies when you see guys that are either messing up something simple or maybe just big egos and doing stupid things, you might hear, "What a bunch of cowboys."

Groups like "The Cowboy Way" and many others glorify the ranch lifestyle and they have a huge following of enthusiasts that identify in some way as cowboys or ranchers. I was removed from one of those groups because I spoke the truth and said what most members love is the stereotype of the ranch life and horses. They would hate the real thing day in and day out. Cattle ranching isn't a fad and it isn't a rodeo.

Having horses just for recreation doesn't make you a wrangler. A wrangler is a horse person that works with horses so they can become skilled at working cattle. Dressing western means nothing to working ranch folks. There is no one way of dressing on a ranch. You dress for the job at hand. You wear knee-high rubber boots to irrigate. I would never wear a belt with a buckle if I was operating a swather for 16 hours. No rancher wants a fancy belt buckle digging into their belly all day. Lace-up boots with a substantial heel replace slip-on if a lot of walking might be involved. Caps replace hats for equipment operating or windy conditions. I have seen more "cowboys" riding the range in caps than hats in windy areas of Eastern Oregon.

I hate the saying, "cowboy up" meaning to get tough. I was invited to join one of the Facebook groups when I had my FB account active. I did and took one look and the admin's continual admonishing for those not agreeing with her was "cowboy up." I had to leave before I vomited. There were a few real working ranchers there, but most were just following a fad and trying to be part of something they didn't understand.

Even Ed Bruce didn't get it. "Mama don't let your babies grow up to be cowboys, don't let them pick guitars and drive them old trucks...."

I play guitar and formally drove only old pickups, but that was only just a short part of my day and wasn't what made me a cattle person hahaha! Now I am just an old has been with memories and proud of it.

I am considering opening a cowboy dance studio. I will use the method these "cowboys" demonstrate. I will love saying, "Dance cowboy, dance," hahaha! I will brown up those greenhorns.
 
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Cody-n-Nancy

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Urban cowboy is in reference to the western dressed nightclub rodeo enthusiast. Drugstore cowboy is in reference to one that dresses western in clothes Hollywood tells us are cowboy but has no real enduring ranch experience. Both are stereotypical "cowboys" with little or no similarity to the working ranch owner or hand. Being just a rodeo performer, nightclub or arena doesn't make one a cattle person I.E. cowboy or cowgirl.

Also, drugstore cowboy has another meaning and that is one that loiters around town in western clothes. New urban meanings include those taking chances selling illegal drugs. In many cases, the term cowboy is used derogatorily. In movies when you see guys that are either messing up something simple or maybe just big egos and doing stupid things, you might hear, "What a bunch of cowboys."

Groups like "The Cowboy Way" and many others glorify the ranch lifestyle and they have a huge following of enthusiasts that identify in some way as cowboys or ranchers. I was removed from one of those groups because I spoke the truth and said what most members love is the stereotype of the ranch life and horses. They would hate the real thing day in and day out. Cattle ranching isn't a fad and it isn't a rodeo.

Having horses just for recreation doesn't make you a wrangler. A wrangler is a horse person that works with horses so they can become skilled at working cattle. Dressing western means nothing to working ranch folks. There is no one way of dressing on a ranch. You dress for the job at hand. You wear knee-high rubber boots to irrigate. I would never wear a belt with a buckle if I was operating a swather for 16 hours. No rancher wants a fancy belt buckle digging into their belly all day. Lace-up boots with a substantial heel replace slip-on if a lot of walking might be involved. Caps replace hats for equipment operating or windy conditions. I have seen more "cowboys" riding the range in caps than hats in windy areas of Eastern Oregon.

I hate the saying, "cowboy up" meaning to get tough. I was invited to join one of the Facebook groups when I had my FB account active. I did and took one look and the admin's continual admonishing for those not agreeing with her was "cowboy up." I had to leave before I vomited. There were a few real working ranchers there, but most were just following a fad and trying to be part of something they didn't understand.

Even Ed Bruce didn't get it. "Mama don't let your babies grow up to be cowboys, don't let them pick guitars and drive them old trucks...."

I play guitar and formally drove only old pickups, but that was only just a short part of my day and wasn't what made me a cattle person hahaha! Now I am just an old has been with memories and proud of it.

I am considering opening a cowboy dance studio. I will use the method these "cowboys" demonstrate. I will love saying, "Dance cowboy, dance," hahaha! I will brown up those greenhorns.

I completely disagree and I'm sure there are many multi-PRCA World Champions that would feel the say way. And, what about those ranch rodeo cowboys? Ranch rodeo is rodeo also!

I've asked you this before, what about rodeo stock contractors that run a ranch, brand their cattle, etc.. Are they cowboys? To me, they sure are!

All I'm saying is, I don't put down ranch cowboys and I don't think people should do that to rodeo cowboys either.

Actually, I didn't know there was that much controversy between rodeo and ranch types. To me, my wife and some others, they are both cowboys and will always be a cowboy.

I know about the dudes that dress up in a flashy Garth Brooks or Kix Brooks shirt on a Friday or Saturday night and go dancing. And, I don't think a guy or girl has to work a ranch to be a cowboy or cowgirl. I knew how to 2-step, saddle/bridle my horse and handle a rope. My "heeler" and myself were announced in the rodeo arena as "cowboys" and we both loved it. Neither of us had ever worked a ranch, but we were still cowboys.........the "rodeo" type.
 
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Texan

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This has been the strangest thread. I've thought about the term webfoot and Mountain Cowgirl mentioned - drug store cowboy - several times while reading it. I can't help but think this thread would have been a lot more fun in the old Bull Session. LOL

That said, I wear what I want and I don't give a **** what anybody thinks. At the same time, I don't care what anybody else wears. I choose a hat or cap for the day based on the weather of the day and it never occurred to me that anybody else cared.

I rarely go to town, but if I do, I still don't care. I try to be as neat and clean as possible, but other than that, I just don't care what anybody thinks. I'll have on a hat or cap based on the weather of the day and don't care if anybody thinks I look like a cowboy or not. I wear a sloppy-looking t-shirt two sizes too big everywhere I go because concealed means concealed and I don't care how it looks to anybody else.

The number one cowgirl here wears tennis shoes when she's not wearing rubber boots, but she might have on one of those dreaded 'flat brim' hats in the worst of the summer to try to keep her face from burning up even more. She wears shorts in the summer and bibs in the winter, but dresses a little nicer if she goes to town - kinda like ladies do. Still, though, in most cases nobody would be able to look at her and tell she can sew up prolapses or pull nuts out of cutting bulls with the best of the cowboys.

Bottom line, we don't care what people think about us based on what we wear and we sure don't judge others based on what they wear.
 

Cody-n-Nancy

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This has been the strangest thread. I've thought about the term webfoot and Mountain Cowgirl mentioned - drug store cowboy - several times while reading it. I can't help but think this thread would have been a lot more fun in the old Bull Session. LOL

That said, I wear what I want and I don't give a **** what anybody thinks. At the same time, I don't care what anybody else wears. I choose a hat or cap for the day based on the weather of the day and it never occurred to me that anybody else cared.

I rarely go to town, but if I do, I still don't care. I try to be as neat and clean as possible, but other than that, I just don't care what anybody thinks. I'll have on a hat or cap based on the weather of the day and don't care if anybody thinks I look like a cowboy or not. I wear a sloppy-looking t-shirt two sizes too big everywhere I go because concealed means concealed and I don't care how it looks to anybody else.

The number one cowgirl here wears tennis shoes when she's not wearing rubber boots, but she might have on one of those dreaded 'flat brim' hats in the worst of the summer to try to keep her face from burning up even more. She wears shorts in the summer and bibs in the winter, but dresses a little nicer if she goes to town - kinda like ladies do. Still, though, in most cases nobody would be able to look at her and tell she can sew up prolapses or pull nuts out of cutting bulls with the best of the cowboys.

Bottom line, we don't care what people think about us based on what we wear and we sure don't judge others based on what they wear.
Well, first Texan, to a certain point, we do "judge" and many, many people do, but just don't want to admit it. And, what a person wears and what they talk about can really depend on where they live. I've got more experience in "living in the wrong place" and "talking about the wrong things" than I would like to admit.

To a point, wife and I do "care what folks think". We have never lived in a truly Western area, like Cody, Wyoming. Where we've lived, basically nobody wore a cowboy hat on a daily basis and nobody talked rodeo, ranching or farming. Even businesses around the livestock auction we attend, don't even know it's there, care less or even, with the ones that know the auction is there, would like to see it close/move. Obviously, there is a certain amount of livestock smell that comes from the outside of the auction. To us, the smell is ok, but to businesses close by, definitely not that way. We don't sell or buy livestock, but just like to watch. Like, going to a horse auction, just to watch.

During our summer months, except when going to/at a rodeo, the livestock auction, or out to dinner at a country-western nightclub, we are in shorts, t-shirt and tennis shoes. That is especially true when we are on our boat. We just happen to love our western attire, but nothing fancy/flashy looking.

In fact, we bought two ProRodeo face masks to wear. They say "ProRodeo" right on the front. I miss my old "competing" days, but, with age/health, some things just have to end. Wife and I don't just wear our western clothes to hit a nightclub on Friday and/or Saturday nights, we wear them for much more than that.

Places we've lived, where wearing western attire was so-called "out of place", except when attending a local rodeo or nightclub: Orange County, California, Jacksonville, Florida and somewhat here where we live now. But, where we live now, people don't look at a person wearing a cowboy hat and boots, like where we lived before. It's much more accepted here, but a lot of young folks here look like they just left living in Los Angeles, California. Seriously.
 

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