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Do you want to know the truth about 911?

Kathy

Well-known member
Why Indeed Did the WTC Buildings Collapse?

By Steven E. Jones
Department of Physics and Astronomy
Brigham Young University
Provo, UT 84604

The views in this paper are the sole responsibility of the author (not Brigham Young University)

DRAFT 2.2

FOREWORD

"We are apt to shut our eyes against a painful truth... Is this the part of wise men, engaged in a great and arduous struggle for liberty? Are we disposed to be of the number of those, who having eyes, see not, and having ears, hear not..?

For my part, whatever anguish of spirit it might cost, I am willing to know the whole truth; to know.. it -- now."

- Patrick Henry, 1775.


"Neither let us be slandered from our duty by false accusations against us, nor frightened from it by menaces of destruction to the Government nor of dungeons to ourselves. Let us have faith that right makes might, and in that faith, let us, to the end, dare to do our duty as we understand it."

- Abraham Lincoln, February 27th, 1860


Video clip of an interview with Prof. Jones can be seen here: http://kutv.com/topstories/local_story_314234334.html

ABSTRACT

In writing this paper, I call for a serious investigation of the hypothesis that WTC 7 and the Twin Towers were brought down, not just by damage and fires, but through the use of pre-positioned explosives. I consider the official FEMA, NIST, and 9-11 Commission reports that fires plus damage alone caused complete collapses of all three buildings. And I present evidence for the explosive-demolition hypothesis, which is suggested by the available data, testable and falsifiable, and yet has not been analyzed in any of the reports funded by the US government.

Let’s start with the collapse of the 47-story WTC 7, which was never hit by a jet. I ask you to take a minute to look at the collapse of this building as a basis for discussion.

If you're going to tell people this is all my idea, you had better give them the links to the webpages and others, including American Scientists for 911 Truth (including Prof. Steven Jones, BYU analysis of collapse of WTC 7), etc. So that readers can do their own investigation, and make up their own minds.

http://www.physics911.net/resources.htm

9/11 Links
The websites described below were selected from a much longer list that was compiled through a thorough search of the internet. The sites were selected according to two main criteria, namely quality of research and bona fides of operators. Other criteria included whether the website in question featured a LIHOP (let it happen on purpose) or MIHOP (made it happen on purpose) approach. In view of the mountain of evidence now unearthed, the LIHOP approach is no longer a valid option. We also refused to list websites that were unable to distinguish between Judaism (an ancient & honorable faith) and Zionism (a fascist ideology).

The websites are listed in alphabetical order under two headings: 911 Investigative Sites and News & Information Sites with a 911 Emphasis.

Below each site we have listed either the name of the individual or group responsible for the site or we inserted the word "anonymous." Some presenters prefer not to list their names for reasons of personal security.


You can now listen on your computer to the "Alex Jones" radio program any time of the day. It is being rebroadcast in a continuous loop:

Link: http://www.infowars.com/listen.html

For more information go to http://www.infowars.com or his other webpage http://www.prisonplanet.com

You can even download free, many of his documentaries about how governments have used "false flag" operations to instill fear in the public, so that governments, USA in this case, can move forward with their "global leadership agenda" (documented in the Project for a New American Century - PNAC document).
 

Happy go lucky

Well-known member
First off many died that day!!!! Secondly I wish I had a dime for every crack pot that comes up with a "theroy" that Americnas caused or had anything to do with this tragic day or that george Bush wanted and new of this so he could go in to get saddam. It makes me sick to think we have such hatred for a president or the people of the U.S. to think we would kill our very own for other gains. Until someone has hard fatcual evidance to proove any of this ridiculous theorys out, There nothing but trash talk that needs not to be.
 

Steve

Well-known member
once again a crack pott, with no engineering ability and a few cut and pastes attempts to educate US on her theories of how we Killed ourselves....

World trade center building number 7 or WTC #7 was built over a Con-Ed substation...to accomplish the feat it utilized cantilevers to span and connect the building, and any one who has put up a building understands that if the support or counter weight is removed the building will collapse...so inadvertantly when the steel and concrete supports holding up the cantileverd section failed, it came down...

to understand this, look at any adddition added to a building, and you will either see a sag in the roof line or a slight differance, this is an inherant weakness caused by the supports not being able to distribute the weight. while this in seldom a problem until disaster hits it is still evident,


add in that the Fuel tanks were the Weight required to keep the cantilevered beams from failing and any person with engineering knowledge could see that it failed due to an inherant design flaw...

Cantilever_visualization.png


"speculation is that the building's unusual architecture may have contributed to its collapse. Theoretically, cantilevers and structural members, required to transfer building weight off of the pre-existing Con Ed electrical substation that 7 WTC was built over, may have failed in the fire leading to the internal mechanism of collapse."
 

kolanuraven

Well-known member
Even I gotta say....NO BUILDING was EVER built with the notion that a plane " might" fly into it!!! Now that's a consideration...but not then when the towers were built.

Yeah, those were a big buildings....and a BIG plane(s) with full loads of fuel burning @ lordy knows what temp......such internal destruction ANYTHING made @ that time in history, hit in the right spot...yeah it will fall!!

It just happend that all the right factors came together at just that right moment in history!!!
 

Kathy

Well-known member
None of you have read anything at the links I've posted; but you have an opinion on everything, anyways.

I don't blame all Americans for this. I do suspect(!!) that GW Bush and insiders conceived and delivered this "New Pearl Harbor" (referred to in Project for a New American Century) for their own selfish motives. VP Dick Cheney ordered NORAD not to stand down and not to shoot down the wayward planes (this is even in the 911 commission report).

The canteliver theory does not explain how building 7 fell into its own footprint in less than 7 seconds. The canteliver theory would have the building fall over sideways. It does not explain the "squibs" and explosive charges seen going off, in an upward direction, on the building. etc. etc. etc.

As for the two trade towers, they WERE indeed built to specifications at the time, for impact by - not one, but two airplanes (each) (the largest of the time) I'll have to look it up - but they were large commercial airliners).

The temperatures of the burning fuel, and carbon based material never reached high enough temperatures to melt the steel, let alone vapourize it (documented in 911 commission also) Read Dr. Jones' paper, and educate yourselves. Don't talk about something you have never actually examined.

As for Dr. Steven Jones, you dare not slam his credibility. He is a top USA scientist. He has been employed by the USA government to work on "cold fusion" on their behalf. He is a very intelligent and responsible scientist, one of many who have joined the "American Scholars for 911 Truth movement". He is standing up for truth! What are you doing?

Don't be so scared to look at the truth.

"We are apt to shut our eyes against a painful truth... Is this the part of wise men, engaged in a great and arduous struggle for liberty? Are we disposed to be of the number of those, who having eyes, see not, and having ears, hear not..?

For my part, whatever anguish of spirit it might cost, I am willing to know the whole truth; to know.. it -- now."

- Patrick Henry, 1775.
 

Murgen

Well-known member
Kathy, I have done a lot of reading on the "911" colapse. Everything I have read leads me to believe their were explosives planted.

I believe that they were also planted by terrorists. As a backup plan, if you will.
 

Kathy

Well-known member
Do you know who's company was in charge of security at the WTCs?

Do you remember, hearing/reading Larry Silverstein state they "decided to PULL building 7"?
 

Happy go lucky

Well-known member
Yep Kathy our President was a cold blooded SOB that for his own gain said, It;s a noce day to loose a few 1,000 people for my own agenda!!!! Your a fricking weirdo and I don't care what scientist you have on board to further your distrust,hatred or whatever up in the clouds thinking you have!!!!! AS for everyone you get to agree with your theory and that is all it is, you will find one that can blow it all apart as well.

Look at the JFK assination and years and years of spectulation and 2nd and 3rd gunners, because some people didn't want to beleive Lee Harvey could pull it off on his own accord.

Why do we need to look at every tragidy and find blame where there is none? Exspecially when it is in our own backyard and from all places the Whitehouse???? Get real, better go read your horiscope and pic your powerball numbers.

This is just typical liberial reporting at it's best, just like we feel sorry for the poor innocent Lebanon people and those dirty Isreials for bombing them, OK though for lebanon to just throw bombs helter skelter???? It is all a joke and very disgusting that a group of people could allow the mindset they have cloud vision.

Did anyone ask Mr Cheney why he didn't want the planes shot down????? In the middle of one of the most crowded citys in the US?
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Murgen said:
Explosives could have been planted by terriorists, not necessarily as part as any conspiracy theory.

Do you know how many months of installing (planting) explosives in the right locations and wiring for timed delay explosions it would take to get buildings to implode like that...It would take a professional demolition team months- working out in the open...

And some nuts are saying this was all done on the QT, without anyones knowledge- by a bunch of hired terrorists :roll: :???:
 

Liberty Belle

Well-known member
Wow! We sure attract the weidos don't we? I found this little item today after reading what Kathy posted:

9-11 Conspiracy Cereal: A Few Nuts and a Bunch of Flakes
Posted by Bobby Eberle

August 8, 2006

In almost every event of world significance, whether it is man-made or natural, there are those who will never accept the official or logical explanation for those events, but instead will put on their tin foil hats and deduce a far-reaching cover-up or conspiracy. As we draw near to the fifth anniversary of the terrorist attacks of September 11, 2001, those conspiracy theorists are in full bloom and are certain that the attacks which killed nearly 3,000 people on American soil were organized by our own government.

As the Washington Times points out in Academics provide clout to 9/11 theorists, “Five years after the terrorist attacks, a community that believes widely discredited ideas about what happened on September 11, 2001, persists and even thrives. Members trade their ideas on the Internet and in self-published papers and in books. About 500 of them attended a recent conference in Chicago.”

As noted in the story, the 9-11 Commission concluded that “hijackers crashed planes into the Twin Towers.” The National Institute of Standards and Technology “filed 10,000 pages of reports that found fires caused by the crashing planes were more than sufficient to collapse the buildings.”
However, far be it for these moonbats to believe the obvious. Instead, groups such as the Scholars for Truth contend that the World Trade Center was “almost certainly brought down by controlled demolitions” and “the government not only permitted 9/11 to occur but may even have orchestrated these events to facilitate its political agenda.”

Even my own experiences on 9-11 have been called into question by conspiracy nuts.

As many of you know, I was in Washington, DC on September 11, 2001 and saw American Airlines Flight 77 fly overhead and hit the Pentagon. I was closer to the aircraft than I was to the Pentagon, and within seconds of it racing past me, it exploded in a deep red fireball. My original account from that day can be found here: Eyewitness to Tragedy.

However, as noted in How It Was Done, I was simply a media shill and part of a cabal that would properly “spin” the events:
The “cleaners and plumbers” As event broke, quick and hard media spin via planted sources. Rapid response for any foul-ups, both physical teams and media spin. You never know what might go wrong (see: Pennsylvania, Pentagon, WTC7… ) Think Tenet and Clarke’s “this has al-quada fingerprints on it” within minutes. Think Bobby Eberle, Gary Bauer, other media shills. If you spin CNN, NYT, etc, fast enough, hard enough, those strange first-hand doubt accounts fade into obscurity. Try to let the CNN media ‘discover’ the story. Nudge it in right direction. Suppress the ‘wrong’ story. Ignore, delay, obfuscate, misdirect.

After quoting my description of the events at the Pentagon, one left-wing conspiracy theorist noted:
The author of these fine eyewitness statements? Bobby Eberle, President and CEO of GOPUSA. I have speculated that at least some of the witnesses to the crash of Flight 77 into the Pentagon were ringers planted by the conspirators. What are the chances that Eberle … was an eyewitness to the crash? Those who are so certain that the testimony of eyewitnesses means that Flight 77 must have crashed into the Pentagon, despite the enormous amount of physical evidence to the contrary, just might want to give their heads a shake and rethink things.

One of my favorites from a liberal blog site calls into question my experience because the circumstances and my background seem a bit “too perfect” for the situation. In other words, I must have been some kind of plant or simply made it up:
It’s always seemed to me that the main problem with the highly tinfoil theories about Flight 77 was the large number of eyewitness accounts. But many of those eyewitnesses were people who were at some distance, looking from hotel windows, or otherwise limited in their perspective.

There were only a few people who claimed to have seen the crash in detail and close up. And only one of those was a pilot, an aerospace engineer, and riding as a passenger in a convertible with the top down, giving him an absolutely unobstructed view.

And that one cream of the crop witness was Bobby Eberle?

Where’s that (tinfoil) hat?

You can bet that over the next month, we will hear more and more from the fringe who think the 9-11 attacks were caused by our own government. Despite the humor in reading some of their ramblings, it is tragic and sad to realize that these people believe that America would attack it’s own on a horrific scale simply for political purposes. The war on terror is real. The consequences are real. There will be but one winner, and it must be the United States of America.
 

Steve

Well-known member
Kathy wrote:
As for Dr. Steven Jones, you dare not slam his credibility. He is a top USA scientist. He has been employed by the USA government to work on "cold fusion" on their behalf. He is a very intelligent and responsible scientist,

from a reliable source on Dr Jones:

Most of the reviewing physicists indicated that he was a careful scientist. Critics insist, however, that his results stemmed from experimental error.
Science. The New York Times. Retrieved on 2006-07-14.



Since Jones' paper has not been published in a scientific journal, there are many academicians, including some from Jones' own university, who question whether the article has been properly vetted by other experts in the field.
The Chronicle of Higher Education. Retrieved on 2006-07-27.


Jones thoeries are questioned, as well as his methods.....

just because he recieved research funding does not make him any less of a nut then you are......

but from Jones himself on how he came to this scientific conclusion:
He explained that his conclusions were based solely upon on-the-fly back-of-the-napkin analysis extrapolated from the Kingdome implosion data done during the commercial break.
Ross, Dave, "A Conversation with 9/11 Researcher Prof. Steven Jones", 710 KIRO, 2006-08-07.

yep thats sound scientific research,,,once again America gets ripped off by a con man with a degree.....
 

Steve

Well-known member
Kathy wrote:
The canteliver theory does not explain how building 7 fell into its own footprint in less than 7 seconds

"Seven hours after the two towers fell, the 47-story WTC 7 collapsed."

seven hours not seven seconds......

Kathy wrote:
The canteliver theory would have the building fall over sideways.

"WTC 7 was an example of "progressive collapse," a process in which the failure of parts of a structure ultimately creates strains that cause the entire building to come down. Videos of the fall of WTC 7 show cracks, or "kinks," in the building's facade just before the two penthouses disappeared into the structure, one after the other. The entire building fell in on itself, with the slumping east side of the structure pulling down the west side in a diagonal collapse."

Kathy wrote:
I don't blame all Americans for this. I do suspect(!!) that GW Bush and insiders conceived and delivered this "New Pearl Harbor"

Last I checked to be President of the USofA, you had to be an American, and who and where are the insiders from? Mars? if thats not "blaming it on Americans, then we are being led by a foriegner in violation of our constitution.......which is another thoery altogeather that is even more compelling then your last disproved thoery......
 

Frankk

Well-known member
When WTC 7 started falling it took seven seconds to fall, not seven seconds after 1&2 fell as implied by Steve.
 

Steve

Well-known member
These claims are the only points where the theorists’ elaborate conjectures make contact with the real world. Without these foundations, the theories crumble. In every case we examined, the key claims made by conspiracy theorists turned out to be mistaken, misinterpreted, or deliberately falsified.

11148562.jpg


Journalists, the 9/11 Commission, Congressional investigators, academic researchers, and others have reconstructed these terrible events in extraordinary detail. Much of what we have learned has been frustrating, even infuriating. Anger can be healthy when it spurs a commitment to change. But it is corrosive and dangerous when it curdles into paranoia and suspicion.

Blaming some conspiracy within our government for the horrific attacks of September 11 mars the memories of all those lost on that day. There were errors and missteps in our government's response, to be sure, but the performance of our public servants was on the whole heroic, not destructive. For their service--for their lives--we are indebted, and we are obliged to pay our debts to those who sacrificed. To blame not a gang of terrorists but some conspiracy for September 11 insults the police officers and firefighters who raced into the burning towers; the men and women who left for dangerous, distant lands to fight our enemies; and those who have fought in all the wars of our history.

Any explanation for the tragedy of September 11 must start and end with the facts. The evidence, the data, the facts must be gathered, compiled, analyzed, and then--only then--can conclusions be drawn as to what happened. That is precisely what the various investigators have done, and in so doing they have performed a great service to our nation. And yet still the conspiracy theorists peddle their wares.

They ignore the methods of science, the protocols of investigation, and the dictates of logic. The conspiracy theorists chase any bit of information, no matter how flimsy, and use it to fit their preordained conclusions. They ascribe to the government, or to some secretive group, powers wholly out of proportion to what the evidence suggests. And they ignore the facts that are present in plain sight.

We cannot let these tales go unanswered. The 9/11 conspiracy movement exploits the public's anger and sadness. It shakes Americans' faith in their government at a time when that faith is already near an all-time low. It traffics in ugly, unfounded accusations of extraordinary evil against fellow Americans. And, as we have seen recently in the Iranian president's bizarre letter to President Bush, it has even entered the currency of international affairs.

The conspiracy theories are a distraction from the proper lessons of 9/11, from what is truly important to this country. And so it is imperative to confront them with the facts. The authors of this book, through their extensive reporting, disprove these tales of conspiracy. They show that, without exception, the stories are based on misconceptions, distortions, and outright lies. The CIA was not involved in 9/11. Our military did not bring about the destruction of the World Trade Center. Bombs or missiles did not fell the towers. A white jet aircraft did not shoot down Flight 93.

Popular Mechanics stands for an old-fashioned approach to facts. It relies on reporting, evidence, and eyewitnesses, and rejects speculation, falsehoods, and conspiracy. In confronting the various theories head-on, Popular Mechanics shows that evidence and logic matter, and they matter critically. We have much to learn about September 11, 2001, about what happened and about the many lessons it holds for our country. That is the debate we need to have in America. By refuting destructive beliefs in fanciful tales of mayhem, Popular Mechanics has produced a valuable work that will be an important resource for years to come. It represents the innocent thousands who perished on that terrible day--those innocent thousands who deserve to be remembered with honor and truth.

John McCain
Washington D.C.
May 2006

Kathy....Don't be so scared to look at the truth.

"We are apt to shut our eyes against a painful truth... Is this the part of wise men, engaged in a great and arduous struggle for liberty? Are we disposed to be of the number of those, who having eyes, see not, and having ears, hear not..?

For my part, whatever anguish of spirit it might cost, I am willing to know the whole truth; to know.. it -- now."

- Patrick Henry, 1775.
 

memanpa

Well-known member
if indeed there were a conspericy how many thousands of people would need to have been involved, not only in the actual act itself but in the cover up of the act?

things just do not add up kathy,
i do believe they need to change the pads on your cell because you are butting your head against the wall again causing more and more brain damage
 
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