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Economy- New Poll

Do You think the US Economy is Heading into or in a Recession--or a Depression?

  • No-the Economy is doing Fine

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Yes- a mild short Recession

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Yes- a prolonged Recession/Depression

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Economic Collapse

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    0

Goodpasture

Well-known member
aplusmnt said:
.... any person who wants an education can get one.
My feeling exactly. the goal is an educated society. The one thing that made us the great nation,post WWII, that we were was the tremendous numbers of men and women who took advantage of the GI Bill for their education. Turned us from an agrarian society to a modern middle class society. It made the construction and growth possible. Every time a student drops out due to lack of funds the nation is damaged.
 

Mike

Well-known member
OT wrote: Funny how those Wall Street bankers/investors can play loose and wild with our money- and government under GW bails them out with taxpayer bucks- believing you can borrow forever without paying it back- but these local bankers have some little fixation on wanting guarantees they're going to get paid

You're either a GD liar, or you're totally ignorant to the workings of government and the FED. :roll:

The Pres has less control over the FED than Congress does. Actually the Fed is not a government entity. It's run by the bankers/investors and they set the rules of lending practices.

With a little research you will find that Greenspan contributed greatly to the subprime meltdown by encouraging Adjustable Rate Mortgages.

Especially to unqualified "Subprime" borrowers. :roll:
 

Goodpasture

Well-known member
Mike said:
You're either a GD liar, or you're totally ignorant .........

If you are going to call someone names, lets do it right..........

Try something like "Mike, you are grimy, squalid, nasty and profane. You are foul and disgusting. You're a fool, an ignoramus. Monkeys look down on you. Even sheep won't have sex with you. You are unreservedly pathetic, starved for attention, and lost in a land that reality forgot. And what meaning do you expect your delusionally self-important statements of unknowing, inexperienced opinion to have with us? What fantasy do you hold that you would believe that your tiny-fisted tantrums would have more weight than that of a leprous desert rat, spinning rabidly in a circle, waiting for the bite of the snake? "

I'm not going to indulge in the name calling, myself, but you can keep it a little more civil.......calling a respected member of this community a GD liar is even more repugnant than what I referred to you as being.
 

Goodpasture

Well-known member
Mike said:
With a little research you will find that Greenspan contributed greatly to the subprime meltdown by encouraging Adjustable Rate Mortgages.

Especially to unqualified "Subprime" borrowers. :roll:
And with a little more research and creativity you would have discovered that the subprime mess was a deliberate effort at shoring up a faltering economy post the dot com meltdown. It was an effort, initiated and encouraged by the administration, to insert lots of extra money into the economy. Rather than do things like support livable minimum wages, the administration encouraged the liquidation of equity in private residences. With 20,000 homes a week going into foreclosure it is obvious that the mismanagement of the current administration extends beyond the nation building (so called war) in Iraq, and has infected the economy as a whole. Again another example of incompetence on the part of this administration.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Mike said:
OT wrote: Funny how those Wall Street bankers/investors can play loose and wild with our money- and government under GW bails them out with taxpayer bucks- believing you can borrow forever without paying it back- but these local bankers have some little fixation on wanting guarantees they're going to get paid

You're either a GD liar, or you're totally ignorant to the workings of government and the FED. :roll:

The Pres has less control over the FED than Congress does. Actually the Fed is not a government entity. It's run by the bankers/investors and they set the rules of lending practices.

With a little research you will find that Greenspan contributed greatly to the subprime meltdown by encouraging Adjustable Rate Mortgages.

Especially to unqualified "Subprime" borrowers. :roll:

Are you saying GW isn't the current leader of our government- supposed to lead the way :???: Are you saying GW isn't the leader of what used to be the strongest economy in the world :???: Are you saying GW and his policies of non-oversight haven't allowed much of this greed and corruption to spawn and grow in our business world- that the FBI now figures will take years to investigate all the frauds and crimes in the lending industry alone :???: Are you saying that it isn't billions of taxpayer dollars that are backing up this Bear Stearns buyout :???:Are you saying the President doesn't appoint the Members of the Fed Board of Governors and the Fed Chairman :???: Are you saying that Greenspan wasn't FED chair under GW and reappointed under GW :???:

(All current members of the Board of Governors have taken office during the presidency of George W. Bush.)

Check your facts Boy- Just because you refuse to recognize/admit the lousy leadership GW has done with our economy that most can now see- don't take it out on me....
But thats right- the new neocon Repubs don't accept responsibility for the bad things that don't work....And if you don't think that will be a #1 election issue than you got your head buried in the sand....


The Buck Stops Here
Harry S. Truman
 

MoGal

Well-known member
Here, here, instead of you two arguing read this and then fire off letters to your congressional leaders and tell them NO taxpayer bailout of Bear Stearns or any other institution and NO to giving the federal reserve more power......... (or if you're for putting the taxpayer on for trillions of dollars then tell them yes but at least get involved). The federal reserve is manipulating the markets and when they get done, NO ONE will have any pension fund left.............. just wait and see.

I read the comments as well.............

http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/

http://elainemeinelsupkis.typepad.com/money_matters/2008/04/paulsons-fix-fo.html

(good Mike Whitney article)
-----------------------------------
http://elainemeinelsupkis.typepad.com/money_matters/2008/04/de-leveraging-d.html
 

MoGal

Well-known member
Now don't forget .... WHEN Fannie Mae goes belly up, taxpayers will be on the hook for 2.2 trillion.......... can we stand for them (the federal reserve) to keep inflating..... are we going to starve out main street so wall street can survive??

article with graphs and charts: http://www.financialsense.com/fsu/editorials/andros/2008/0404.html

Now here’s a closing thought for you: The housing market represents approximately 11 trillion Dollars of mortgages, 1 trillion Dollars of them are in trouble. Approximately 220 billion up to $1 trillion Dollars of losses have been recognized by the financial and banking system. Consumer finances are crumbling; securitized credit card and car loans are now falling into arrears and are problems on the near horizon. Taxes and regulation are set to rise in excess of the abomination that we currently have in the G7. So, wealth creation and capitalism are set to suffer another withering blow at the hands of our PUBLIC servants. And over 100 trillion Dollars of unfunded obligations remain throughout the G7. There is only one solution which leaves the G7 financial, political and banking system in place: They will print the money as now it is, INFLATE or DIE!
 

Steve

Well-known member
MoGal
Now don't forget .... WHEN Fannie Mae goes belly up, taxpayers will be on the hook for 2.2 trillion...

Now here’s a closing thought for you: The housing market represents approximately 11 trillion Dollars of mortgages, 1 trillion Dollars of them are in trouble. Approximately 220 billion up to $1 trillion Dollars of losses,...

Now here’s a closing thought for you:,...
"less then 10%" of the market is in trouble,... then only 10% of fanny mae might be in trouble.. even if you took the absolute worse case scenario,... that fannie mae owned "every" in trouble mortgage, it would still only be one trillion... sure it's alot of money, (and alot of Ifs, mights and maybe ifs) we as a country can't afford, but clearly it is not even half as bad as you tried to imply.. :roll: :wink:

Now don't forget .. that more then likely it is less then 10% of $220 billion in loans held by fannie mae.. or a really small percentage of 2.2 trillion in loans that might be in trouble if the people fail to maintain their loans..
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
April 8, 2008, 5:29 pm
Recession Is Here, Greenspan Says

Former Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan said the U.S. is “in the throes of a recession and continued to publicly defend his legacy Tuesday in an interview with business-cable network CNBC.
---------------------------

As for the financial sector, “it’s fairly obvious that for the first time in my memory, we have both the banking system and the securities markets in trouble.”

http://blogs.wsj.com/economics/2008/04/08/recession-is-here-greenspan-says/?mod=WSJBlog
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
$4 Gasoline May be Just Around the Corner

David Frazier
Tuesday, April 8, 2008


Oil prices rose $2.74 yesterday to close at $108.97 on reports that OPEC doesn't plan to increase its production of crude oil anytime soon.

Meanwhile, U.S. gasoline prices rose to their highest level ever, with the average price of a gallon of regular unleaded gasoline rising to $3.34.

With the value of the U.S. dollar continuing to fall against other world currencies and China's demand for petroleum products continuing to rise, my research suggests that gasoline prices could advance to $4.00 per gallon by the end of August. Keep in mind that the summer driving season in the U.S. begins in less than a month and the Atlantic hurricane season officially begins on June 1.
http://moneynews.newsmax.com/money/archives/articles/2008/4/8/134351.cfm
 

aplusmnt

Well-known member
Oldtimer said:
$4 Gasoline May be Just Around the Corner

David Frazier
Tuesday, April 8, 2008


Oil prices rose $2.74 yesterday to close at $108.97 on reports that OPEC doesn't plan to increase its production of crude oil anytime soon.

Meanwhile, U.S. gasoline prices rose to their highest level ever, with the average price of a gallon of regular unleaded gasoline rising to $3.34.

With the value of the U.S. dollar continuing to fall against other world currencies and China's demand for petroleum products continuing to rise, my research suggests that gasoline prices could advance to $4.00 per gallon by the end of August. Keep in mind that the summer driving season in the U.S. begins in less than a month and the Atlantic hurricane season officially begins on June 1.
http://moneynews.newsmax.com/money/archives/articles/2008/4/8/134351.cfm

Bad news for sure, but what do you propose anyone does about it?
 

backhoeboogie

Well-known member
aplusmnt said:
Bad news for sure, but what do you propose anyone does about it?

If you need 10 lag bolts, buy 20. That's cheaper than spending $15 on fuel if you are short or break one.

If you need a half gallon of milk, buy a gallon. Drink it before it expires or pour it to the dogs.

Clean out the freezers and fill them with food you use regularly.

When you drive home from work get everything you need as you pass through town. That includes take-out if neccessary. Store plenty of TP, paper towels, and other non-perishing things. Refuse to drive any more than you absolutely have to.

Tell your congressfolks to lighten up on the fuel restrictions. There's no reason for diesel to be higher priced than gasoline except for the restrictions. Collect a balloon of sulfur gas out of your well water as it aereates in the holding tank. Mail it to your congressman and give him the message that the unrealistic low sulfur emission garbage is garbage.

You are dealing with ignorant tree hugging liberals solely influenced by Roseann or the other fat ladies out there like the one they finally threw off of the View. No logic. Think about it. You can legally ride a motorcylce with no helmet and certainly no seat belt, legally ride in the back of a truck, but if you crawl into the cab, you have to put on that seat belt or get fined $200. Sulfur regulations are not much different. Should we give them a vacation to Sulfur Springs?
 

aplusmnt

Well-known member
Backhoe all good ideas, but what I was wondering what OT thinks can be done to get gas prices lower? He did not mention it in the above post, but as all his message are motivated with blaming and hating Bush.

So I am interested in exactly what OT would do if he was President to stop oil prices from rising and especially gas prices?
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
aplusmnt said:
Backhoe all good ideas, but what I was wondering what OT thinks can be done to get gas prices lower? He did not mention it in the above post, but as all his message are motivated with blaming and hating Bush.

So I am interested in exactly what OT would do if he was President to stop oil prices from rising and especially gas prices?

Well A+ I'm not sure there is much that can be done right now...We're about 7 years too late...

7 years of a secretly negotiated energy policy that oilman Cheney did with assistance of the oil company executives, which centered almost entirely around the oil industry and their tax subsidies and profiteering- instead of looking at and focusing on alternative sources have helped put the costs at where they are- as well as leading the way for the downfall of our current economy....

I do know one thing I would do....Instead of the US taxpayers paying all the bill of rebuiding Iraq's oil infrastructure- and then charging us full whores price for it- I would make them use the 100's of Billions of dollars in oil money they have stuffed away in world banks ($200 Billion in the US alone) to do the rebuilding and then require the sale of the oil to the US at greatly reduced prices- until they have repaid the US taxpayer for the total $520 Billion we have spent there (which increases at a rate of $2.3 Billion a week- while the entire Iraqi budget last year was only $12 Billion- much of which they didn't spend, because GW just kept giving them US taxpayer dollars instead :shock: :( :mad: )
 

aplusmnt

Well-known member
Oldtimer said:
aplusmnt said:
Backhoe all good ideas, but what I was wondering what OT thinks can be done to get gas prices lower? He did not mention it in the above post, but as all his message are motivated with blaming and hating Bush.

So I am interested in exactly what OT would do if he was President to stop oil prices from rising and especially gas prices?

Well A+ I'm not sure there is much that can be done right now...We're about 7 years too late...

7 years of a secretly negotiated energy policy that oilman Cheney did with assistance of the oil company executives, which centered almost entirely around the oil industry and their tax subsidies and profiteering- instead of looking at and focusing on alternative sources have helped put the costs at where they are- as well as leading the way for the downfall of our current economy....

I do know one thing I would do....Instead of the US taxpayers paying all the bill of rebuiding Iraq's oil infrastructure- and then charging us full whores price for it- I would make them use the 100's of Billions of dollars in oil money they have stuffed away in world banks ($200 Billion in the US alone) to do the rebuilding and then require the sale of the oil to the US at greatly reduced prices- until they have repaid the US taxpayer for the total $520 Billion we have spent there (which increases at a rate of $2.3 Billion a week- while the entire Iraqi budget last year was only $12 Billion- much of which they didn't spend, because GW just kept giving them US taxpayer dollars instead :shock: :( :mad: )

What does tax breaks or subsidies have to do with the price of oil on the open market? How would cutting these things to the Oil companies help lower the price of crude oil?

And if you are talking about alternative sources should not that have started say 15 years ago, or maybe 30 years ago? Why all of a sudden is it GW's fault that the American people have abused the oil source with our Hummers, SUV's and over sized cars. And now when other countries are becoming industrialized like China and India now we complain that prices have went up.

I do not agree that ethanol is the answer to the oil problem, but under Bush's presidency there has been more done to develop alternative fuel than under any other presidency.

How does Bush control the free market of Crude oil? Is it Bush fault that China and India are buying oil more, is it Bush fault that the population of the world is growing and so would the demand for its natural resources?

Go back 7 years in time and play President and give some specific answers that you would have done to keep crude oil from reaching record prices of today??????? If you are going to criticize you must have the answers!
 

TSR

Well-known member
aplusmnt said:
Oldtimer said:
aplusmnt said:
Backhoe all good ideas, but what I was wondering what OT thinks can be done to get gas prices lower? He did not mention it in the above post, but as all his message are motivated with blaming and hating Bush.

So I am interested in exactly what OT would do if he was President to stop oil prices from rising and especially gas prices?

Well A+ I'm not sure there is much that can be done right now...We're about 7 years too late...

7 years of a secretly negotiated energy policy that oilman Cheney did with assistance of the oil company executives, which centered almost entirely around the oil industry and their tax subsidies and profiteering- instead of looking at and focusing on alternative sources have helped put the costs at where they are- as well as leading the way for the downfall of our current economy....

I do know one thing I would do....Instead of the US taxpayers paying all the bill of rebuiding Iraq's oil infrastructure- and then charging us full whores price for it- I would make them use the 100's of Billions of dollars in oil money they have stuffed away in world banks ($200 Billion in the US alone) to do the rebuilding and then require the sale of the oil to the US at greatly reduced prices- until they have repaid the US taxpayer for the total $520 Billion we have spent there (which increases at a rate of $2.3 Billion a week- while the entire Iraqi budget last year was only $12 Billion- much of which they didn't spend, because GW just kept giving them US taxpayer dollars instead :shock: :( :mad: )

What does tax breaks or subsidies have to do with the price of oil on the open market? How would cutting these things to the Oil companies help lower the price of crude oil?

And if you are talking about alternative sources should not that have started say 15 years ago, or maybe 30 years ago? Why all of a sudden is it GW's fault that the American people have abused the oil source with our Hummers, SUV's and over sized cars. And now when other countries are becoming industrialized like China and India now we complain that prices have went up.

I do not agree that ethanol is the answer to the oil problem, but under Bush's presidency there has been more done to develop alternative fuel than under any other presidency.

How does Bush control the free market of Crude oil? Is it Bush fault that China and India are buying oil more, is it Bush fault that the population of the world is growing and so would the demand for its natural resources?

Go back 7 years in time and play President and give some specific answers that you would have done to keep crude oil from reaching record prices of today??????? If you are going to criticize you must have the answers!

Aplus Do you think its right to keep giving subsidies to giant corporations when they are making more profit per quarter than any company in the history of the world? :shock: :shock:

Don't you think it only fair that the Iraqi gov help fund their rebuilding as much as possible.

Finally do you think that a vice president should meet with the giant oil company executives to develop an energy policy for our country ( a meetin which I understand was denied by all parties concerned)?
 

aplusmnt

Well-known member
TSR said:
Aplus Do you think its right to keep giving subsidies to giant corporations when they are making more profit per quarter than any company in the history of the world? :shock: :shock:

Don't you think it only fair that the Iraqi gov help fund their rebuilding as much as possible.

Finally do you think that a vice president should meet with the giant oil company executives to develop an energy policy for our country ( a meetin which I understand was denied by all parties concerned)?

No I do not believe in subsidies of any kind, rather it be oil companies or farmers. But taking them away will do nothing to help lower oil or gas prices. All it will do is raise prices, sure the Government will get more tax dollars to spend but no gas prices will lower. And that is the point of this conversation, what can be done or what should have been done to lower gas prices.

I will admit I know little about what kind of subsidies or tax breaks they get, some may to stimulate more development or searching for oil, but I am no authority in that area. I am interested though to research it.

And yes I do think Iraq should use their oil profits to rebuild their country, but since most libs believe we unjustly went to war with Iraq, then if that is so then they should probably keep all that money and maybe us pay some to help them. Remember you libs believe we were criminals for going over there, and if that is so then we must not take any thing from them, we should only be helping to right that wrong you believe we did.

And should the VP let oil companies dictate our energy policy, nope, not sure if that is fact or fiction. But if it is fact then that is wrong. But I still ask the question, what would you libs do or have did to keep oil prices from hitting the highs they are currently at?

This is the question to be answered for those that blame GW for high gas prices and oil. What would you have did or currently do to lower them?

And who has did more in the past to encourage alternate fuel sources than GW? You have heard of the ethanol boom under GW? What president in history implicated any thing to encourage alternate fuels besides GW?
 

aplusmnt

Well-known member
backhoeboogie said:
aplusmnt said:
No I do not believe in subsidies of any kind, rather it be oil companies or farmers.

Now you've done gone and done it :shock:

But that is exactly the way I'd vote. No subsidy for anyone.

:lol: Wondered how unpopular that sentence would be. But it is how I feel. Rather you are making billions or barely getting buy. Success or failure of a business should be up to the free market not politicians.
 

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