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Enemies cutting our supply lines from the north

Red Robin

Well-known member
White House And Turkey Fight Bill On Armenia
Genocide Label for WWI-Era Killings Has House Support

By Glenn Kessler
Washington Post Staff Writer
Wednesday, October 10, 2007; Page A01

A proposed House resolution that would label as "genocide" the deaths of Armenians more than 90 years ago during the Ottoman Empire has won the support of a majority of House members, unleashing a lobbying blitz by the Bush administration and other opponents who say it would greatly harm relations with Turkey, a key ally in the Iraq war.

Three former defense secretaries, in their own letter, said Turkey probably would cut off U.S. access to a critical air base. All eight living former secretaries of state have signed a joint letter to House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) warning that the nonbinding resolution "would endanger our national security interests." . The government of Turkey is spending more than $300,000 a month on communications specialists and high-powered lobbyists, including former congressman Bob Livingston, to defeat the initiative.



House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) has long supported the resolution.

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Pelosi, whose congressional district has a large Armenian population, has brushed aside such concerns and said she supports bringing the resolution, for the first time, to a full vote in the House, where more than half of the members have signed on as co-sponsors. The House Foreign Affairs Committee, which has passed such a resolution before, is set to vote on it today.

House Resolution 106, officially the Affirmation of the United States Record on the Armenian Genocide, has been pushed doggedly by a congressman whose Southern California district contains the largest concentration of Armenian Americans in the country. Rep. Adam B. Schiff (D) won his seat in 2000 after his Republican predecessor was sandbagged when then-House Speaker J. Dennis Hastert reneged on a pledge and pulled the bill from the floor after a last-minute plea from President Bill Clinton.

Schiff, who defeated Rep. James Rogan after Hastert killed the floor vote, said the deaths so long ago still resonate with Armenians. "It is an insight you get when you have lots of Armenian constituents," he said, saying it reminded him of conversations he had while growing up Jewish. "But imagine losing the entire family and having the successor state say it never happened."

Few people deny that massacres killed hundreds of thousands of Armenian men, women and children during and immediately after World War I.

But Turkish officials and some historians say that the deaths resulted from forced relocations and widespread fighting when the 600-year-old Ottoman Empire collapsed, not from a campaign of genocide -- and that hundreds of thousands of Turks also died in the same region during that time.

"This is the greatest accusation of all against humanity," said Turkish Ambassador Nabi Sensoy, referring to genocide. "You cannot expect any nation to accept that kind of labeling." He said the reaction in the Turkish parliament would be one of fury, noting that the Turkish military cut contacts with the French military and terminated defense contracts under negotiation after the French National Assembly voted in 2006 to criminalize the denial of Armenian genocide.

Pelosi had long been a co-sponsor of the resolution. The Armenian National Committee, one of the many Armenian organizations that have sought passage of the measure for years, has given her an "A" grade for her stance on Armenian issues.

Now as speaker, Pelosi will face a choice between her role as a national leader and her previous campaign pledges as a member of Congress. U.S.-Turkish relations are already under some strain because Kurdish militant groups have attacked Turkish targets from bases in Iraq, with Ankara suggesting it may launch its own attack. Turkey plans to hold a "neighbors" conference on Iraq pushed by the United States later this month, but a recent poll by the nonpartisan group Terror Free Tomorrow found that 83 percent of Turks would oppose assisting the United States on Iraq if the Armenia resolution passed.
 

Sandhusker

Well-known member
That vindictive old witch has absolutely no morals or common sense - just a pure politician.

The killing of the Armenians is no secret - it' not like it's been covered up and recently discovered. It happened nearly 100 years ago and it wasn't even the Turk government - it was the Ottoman Empire!
 

Red Robin

Well-known member
Would someone please post a list of house members so we can see how they voted? I suspect we'll find a pattern that might give us the answer of who our enemies are. Someone wants us to fail in Iraq. Wonder who it is?
 

Red Robin

Well-known member
Defense Secretary Robert Gates said the measure is damaging relations at a time when U.S. forces in Iraq rely heavily on Turkish permission to use their airspace for cargo flights.

About 70 percent of U.S. air cargo headed for Iraq goes through Turkey as does about one-third of the fuel used by the U.S. military there. U.S. bases also get water and other supplies carried in overland by Turkish truckers who cross into Iraq's northern Kurdish region.

In addition, C-17 cargo planes fly military supplies to U.S. soldiers in remote areas of Iraq from Incirlik, avoiding the use of Iraqi roads vulnerable to bomb attacks. U.S. officials say the arrangement helps reduce American casualties.
 

Sandhusker

Well-known member
Red Robin said:
Would someone please post a list of house members so we can see how they voted? I suspect we'll find a pattern that might give us the answer of who our enemies are. Someone wants us to fail in Iraq. Wonder who it is?

Very good point, RR. This could be a smoking gun.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
How quickly we forget.

"GEORGE W. BUSH RECOGNIZES ARMENIAN GENOCIDE

Republican Candidate Calls on Americans to Remember and Acknowledge "Facts and Lessons" of the "Genocidal Campaign" against the Armenians


Washington, DC -- In a powerfully worded letter to two of his leading Armenian American supporters, Republican presidential hopeful Texas Governor George Bush acknowledged the Armenian Genocide, called on Americans to join with him in remembering the crime committed against the Armenian people, and pledged as President to ensure that the United States properly recognizes this terrible atrocity, reported the Armenian National Committee of America (ANCA).

Governor Bush's letter, addressed to Michigan community activist Edgar Hagopian and New York businessman Vasken Setrakian, who attended Harvard with the Governor, also called for continued U.S. aid to Armenia, encouraged a peaceful settlement of the Nagorno Karabagh conflict, and praised the "tremendous contribution of the Armenian community to the United States."

"We welcome Governor Bush's principled stand on the Armenian Genocide and join with him in calling upon all Americans to acknowledge both the facts and lessons of this crime against humanity," said ANCA Executive Director Aram Hamparian. "We would like, as well, to voice our community's gratitude to Vasken Setrakian and Edgar Hagopian, both of whom have done so much to share with Governor Bush the issues of pressing concern to our community. We appreciate their leadership and value their contribution to expanding the voice of Armenian Americans in the political process."

Governor Bush's rival for the Republican nomination, Arizona Senator John McCain, has yet to speak out on Armenian issues. He has remained silent, in particular, on the Armenian Genocide, despite having received an unprecedented number of postcards from Armenian Americans as part of the ANCA's million postcard campaign to leading presidential candidates - including Governor Bush, Vice President Al Gore and former New Jersey Senator Bill Bradley.

The two hundred thousand postcards addressed to Sen. McCain ask him to explain his vote in 1990 against former Senator Bob Dole's Armenian Genocide resolution and, more recently, his 1999 vote to lift the Section 907 restrictions on U.S. aid to Azerbaijan, despite Azerbaijan's failure to lift its blockades of Armenia and Nagorno Karabagh. (For more information on the ANCA postcard campaign, visit http://www.anca.org.)

In a September 1998 speech in the U.S. Senate, McCain attacked a Congressionally approved ten million dollar aid package to the American University of Armenia as an "objectionable program," and a "serious diversion of scarce resources otherwise needed for truly worthy programs." (For more information on this speech, visit http://mccain.senate.gov/frop99ap.htm.)

Provided below is the full text of Governor Bush's letter.


#####

George W. Bush for President
February 19, 2000

Mr. Edgar Hagopian
Mr. Vasken Setrakian


Dear Edgar and Vasken,

Thank you for your inquiry to my campaign regarding issues of concern to Armenian Americans.

The twentieth century was marred by wars of unimaginable brutality, mass murder and genocide. History records that the Armenians were the first people of the last century to have endured these cruelties. The Armenians were subjected to a genocidal campaign that defies comprehension and commands all decent people to remember and acknowledge the facts and lessons of an awful crime in a century of bloody crimes against humanity. If elected President, I would ensure that our nation properly recognizes the tragic suffering of the Armenian people.

The Armenian diaspora and the emergence of an independent Republic of Armenia stand as a testament to the resiliency of the Armenian people. In this new century, the United States must actively support the independence of all the nations of the Caucasus by promising the peaceful settlement of regional disputes and the economic development of the region. American assistance to Armenia to encourage the development of democracy, the rule of law and a tolerant open society is vital. It has my full support.

I am encouraged by recent discussions between the governments of Armenia and Azerbaijan. The United States should work actively to promote peace in the region and should be willing to serve as a mediator. But ultimately peace must be negotiated and sustained by the parties involved. Lasting peace can come only from agreements they judge to be in their best interests.

I appreciate the tremendous contribution of the Armenian community to the United States. The Armenian community has been and will continue to be a model of dedication to values of faith and family.

Sincerely,

[signed]
George W. Bush


http://www.anca.org/press_releases/press_releases.php?prid=3
 

Red Robin

Well-known member
That was at a time when we weren't depending on a country to supply our troops. I see you side with the traitors here again ff.
 

Goodpasture

Well-known member
Red Robin said:
That was at a time when we weren't depending on a country to supply our troops. I see you side with the traitors here again ff.
the only traitor I see is you..........I see a deliberate campaign to consume our armed forces resources based on a series of lies, weakening them to the point they are incapable of providing any defense whatsoever through a police action in the middle of a secular civil war when we face genuine threats from the Korean peninsula, Iran, and an invasion from south of the border.
 

hopalong

Well-known member
It is easy to see which forum members are sleeping with the enemy in one way or the other.
Defeat from within is the motto of a few of these libbies that call themselves human.
 

aplusmnt

Well-known member
Why would they ever wait time making resolutions about something that happened almost 100 years ago? I do not understand the upside of doing it?

Seems like another wasted moment spent waisting our tax dollars for a go nowhere, mean nothing legislation by the Dem's to me.

If there is an upside to doing this someone please explain.

Seems the Dem's want to make our allies in the middle east our enemies and then support our enemies (such as Iran and Syria).

Pelosi and Hillary seem to be neck to neck in the race to being the most evil, anti American women in this day and time!
 
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Anonymous

Guest
aplusmnt said:
Why would they ever wait time making resolutions about something that happened almost 100 years ago? I do not understand the upside of doing it?

Seems like another wasted moment spent waisting our tax dollars for a go nowhere, mean nothing legislation by the Dem's to me.

If there is an upside to doing this someone please explain.

Seems the Dem's want to make our allies in the middle east our enemies and then support our enemies (such as Iran and Syria).

Pelosi and Hillary seem to be neck to neck in the race to being the most evil, anti American women in this day and time!


Bush said:

If elected President, I would ensure that our nation properly recognizes the tragic suffering of the Armenian people.


Maybe you should contact President Bush and ask him why he promised to get this legislation passed as soon as he became President. And why he didn't do it then instead of trying to block it now. Is he, could he, possibly be a flip flopper?
 

Red Robin

Well-known member
ff said:
aplusmnt said:
Why would they ever wait time making resolutions about something that happened almost 100 years ago? I do not understand the upside of doing it?

Seems like another wasted moment spent waisting our tax dollars for a go nowhere, mean nothing legislation by the Dem's to me.

If there is an upside to doing this someone please explain.

Seems the Dem's want to make our allies in the middle east our enemies and then support our enemies (such as Iran and Syria).

Pelosi and Hillary seem to be neck to neck in the race to being the most evil, anti American women in this day and time!


Bush said:

If elected President, I would ensure that our nation properly recognizes the tragic suffering of the Armenian people.


Maybe you should contact President Bush and ask him why he promised to get this legislation passed as soon as he became President. And why he didn't do it then instead of trying to block it now. Is he, could he, possibly be a flip flopper?
Don't change the subject ff. Your beloved Pelosi is making it harder on the troops in a battlezone. If Turkey withdraws support some of those who wished to see U.S. lose in Iraq might get their wish. You'd be happy I guess?
 

Sandhusker

Well-known member
He's trying to block it now, as would anybody with an ounce of common sense, because now is certainly not the time - and nothing good will come out of it anyway. This is just a losing deal. So they declare it a genocide -what then? That fixes anything? Who the heck are they to think a proclamation from Congress means anything to the world? 82% of the people in this country think they're idiots, I'm sure that number is higher abroad.

So Bush renigs on his pledge. Woopie-wow-wow, a politician breaks a campaign pledge. You already knew he was full of crap. Seems the Dems were full of pledges before the last election, too. They've got room to point fingers?

Pelosi and Co. are putting their party ahead of national interests. They don't care that their actions are detrimental to the entire country and our efforts over there. This type of despicable action is exactly why Congress has the approval rating that it does.
 

Goodpasture

Well-known member
Look at this as a ploy out of Washington.

Turkey is preparing for war against the Kurds in the southeastern part of Turkey. They will be supported by the oil rich Kurds of Iraq. Civil war is likely to spread from Iraq to Turkey in the next 6 months to a year as the Kurds seek their own nation....complete with oil.

By pushing this resolution, Washington now has the ability to "back off" if the turks "back off" of the Kurds.........

It's all politics
 

Red Robin

Well-known member
Goodpasture said:
Look at this as a ploy out of Washington.

Turkey is preparing for war against the Kurds in the southeastern part of Turkey. They will be supported by the oil rich Kurds of Iraq. Civil war is likely to spread from Iraq to Turkey in the next 6 months to a year as the Kurds seek their own nation....complete with oil.

By pushing this resolution, Washington now has the ability to "back off" if the turks "back off" of the Kurds.........

It's all politics
That's not the way I see it. I see it as a bunch of socialists/communists cleverly (or not so) disguised in "progressive" clothing doing all they can to thwart the efforts of their counterparts in their home country for their political gain. They don't care about the outcome.
 

Red Robin

Well-known member
So what you're saying is that Bush and co. have used the democrats to set the stage for a political move against Turkey? Sure , that makes sense. :lol: Perfect logic if you're a progressive. Your a peach missionary.
 

Goodpasture

Well-known member
Red Robin said:
So what you're saying is that Bush and co. have used the democrats to set the stage for a political move against Turkey? Sure , that makes sense. :lol: Perfect logic if you're a progressive. Your a peach missionary.
And you're an ass
 
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