History review

[passin thru]

Muslims fly commercial airliners into buildings in New York City. No Muslim outrage.
Muslim officials block the exit where school girls are trying to escape a burning building because their faces were exposed. No Muslim outrage.
Muslims cut off the heads of three teenaged girls on their way to school in Indonesia. A Christian school. No Muslim outrage.
Muslims murder teachers trying to teach Muslim children in Iraq. No Muslim outrage.
Muslims murder over 80 tourists with car bombs outside cafes and hotels in Egypt. No Muslim outrage.
A Muslim attacks a missionary children's school in India. Kills six. No Muslim outrage.
Muslims slaughter hundreds of children and teachers in Beslan, Russia. Muslims shoot children in the back. No Muslim outrage.
Let's go way back. Muslims kidnap and kill athletes at the Munich Summer Olympics. No Muslim outrage.
Muslims fire rocket-propelled grenades into schools full of children in Israel. No Muslim outrage.
Muslims murder more than 50 commuters in attacks on London subways and busses. Over 700 are injured. No Muslim outrage.
Muslims massacre dozens of innocents at a Passover Seder. No Muslim outrage.
Muslims murder innocent vacationers in Bali. No Muslim outrage.
Muslim newspapers publish anti-Semitic cartoons. No Muslim outrage
Muslims are involved, on one side or the other, in almost every one of the 125+ shooting wars around the world. No Muslim outrage.
Muslims beat the charred bodies of Western civilians with their shoes, then hang them from a bridge. No Muslim outrage.
Newspapers in Denmark and Norway publish cartoons depicting Mohammed. Muslims are outraged.

 

[kolanuraven]

It's part of the " rules & reg's" of Islam that no human or animals are to be depicted in ANY form in any way. That's why you see no pictures of Mohammed nor any one in the mosques or in the Quran, etc. All art forms are geometric or plant shape...i.e. mostly intertwined vines

It's equal to someone here doing something in a joke like fashion with a picture of Jesus. Ok....Christian religion allows pictures of Jeses but within reasonable guidelines. Wasn't there a stink a few yrs back when someone somewhere showed Jesus as a black skinned man...and the whole white Christian world went NUTZ????

It does seem a bit over the top to burn and riot over a bit of ink and paper...

 

[BBJ]

WHO CARES ABOUT THE RULES & REG'S OF ISLAM.

That just proves we can't trust muslims, I hate to group them as a whole but to me it's pretty clear. If they don't like that type of statement about them then they need to speak up, not against us but rather the idiots in their religon.

 

[kolanuraven]

BBJ....it's too early to get Pi$$ed. Calm down.


I know I'm gonna regret asking this BUT...have you ever studied or been exposed to any of the world religions, the in and outs , the why for's and how come's of their structure?


This idea of total isolationism is the ostrich theory! You have to understand your " enemy" first before you can defeat them, as I see you consider these people, i.e. Muslims....all these people .....your enemy. That's sad cause you're missing some really nice people .

 

[Anonymous]

WHO CARES ABOUT THE RULES & REG'S OF ISLAM.

Very good question. I certainly don't see many of 'them' trying to understand Christianity. I certainly don't see many of 'them' condemning the hate-filled and murderous activities of their brethren.

What I see is many of 'them' wanting to participate in the opportunities and rewards offered by this country. Without 'them' doing jack **** to try to stand up for it. That's what I see. And I don't like what I see.

 

[BBJ]

Thanks for the sermon stevec, :roll: let me get this straight, you think "we" are part of the problem?
stevec wrote:
There is lots of Muslim opposition over the extremist violence of some Muslims, but those who see a solution in violence and anger ignore them.

I don't care about the muslims who see a solution in violence and anger, I'm interrested in the "peaceful" Muslims. Since you are so informed on the subject what is the percentage of peaceful to violent Muslims in the world today. Why don't we hear more from the peaceful?

Yes I do hold myself to the same standard that I expect from the Muslims, if the Christian faith decided that killing all non christians then I would stand up and speak out against it. Even if I was in the minority. So don't play that game that I need to "come to peace with myself" before I can come to peace with the Muslim. Thats a bunch of hippy crap to me.

stevec wrote:
However, "outrage" itself is the trap everyone falls into: Outrage is a not a positive force. To be peaceful, to support peace, and to create peace, one must think, act and be a peaceful person. In fact, one must hold oneself to a higher standard than what one expects of others. In asking "where is the outrage?" you are actually holding others to a higher standard than you hold yourself, because you are outraged by "their" violence and their lack of outrage, but not by the violence or outrage of your own clan.
In my opinion outrage is like fear, yes it can have very negative effects on your actions, but if it is controlled and used correctly can be a VERY POSITIVE FORCE.
stevec wrote:
Obviously, it is best if the whole family can find agreement and the courage of faith, but it is those who are "outraged" that are often the most loud and wrong. They shout, attack and demonize others, and have no love in their hearts. They get back whatever they give. They lack mercy, and cannot teach what they do not have. So instead they teach anger and vengence. But anger and vengence are just a reflection of fear and pride. Men think they have created things, and they fall in love with the work of their own hands.
So what you are saying isif we would just call up people like bin laden and prefess our love for him that is in our hearts, he will just love us back and harmony will exist. OK, that may sound like a real grand idea in your world but it ain't happening here.

Your from Mass. right?
:?
Makes sense now.
:wink:

 

[kolanuraven]

"X" how many of THEM do you know|???????

 

[BBJ]

I'll give you some credit there stevec, no I'm not an engineer but I do work in the field, and yes "Controlled" outrage and fear can be the solution. Your make love not war approach never has and never will work.

You can ask anybody that knows me and they will tell you I am not a confrontational person, but if someone attackes me, I will fight back, I will not cowdown and beg. Is that what you are suggesting we do?


If my possible solution is wrong then please tell me how you would handle it.

 

[Red Robin]

"X" how many of THEM do you know|???????

Do you think it is really necessary to know one Kolan to disagree with their religion? I certainly don't understand their religion very well but I , through several world events , have been exposed to lots of their actions committed in the name of Alah.

 

[kolanuraven]

Yes, Red Robin I think it's necessary to know people and their ways before condeming the whole lot of them.

That's like saying you know one nut-job from Utah...thus the whole state in full of nut-jobs. It's not fair. There are as many Christian/Jew/Hindu/Jane etc nut cases as there are Muslim I'm sure.

As you well know...I'm not a biblical scholar but isnt' there something about " casting stones"?

 

[Red Robin]

Yes, Red Robin I think it's necessary to know people and their ways before condeming the whole lot of them.

That's like saying you know one nut-job from Utah...thus the whole state in full of nut-jobs. It's not fair. There are as many Christian/Jew/Hindu/Jane etc nut cases as there are Muslim I'm sure.

As you well know...I'm not a biblical scholar but isnt' there something about " casting stones"?

The casting stones isn't hardly applicable here Kolan. I am going to suggest the rediculious again. Is it necessary to know how rapist or child molesters think to condemn their actions?

 

[kolanuraven]

YES....you have to know how people think and why they think like they do....IF....IF.....IF....you want to understand and adjust/modify their actions to what you deem are appropriate in whatever situation.

You can condem all you want....but learn nothing....so why bother wasting all that time and energy condeming if not learning WHY

 

[Red Robin]

I am more interested in punishing actions than motives. I am not even interested personally in finding their redeeming qualities. If they bomb us then I say we should punish them 10 fold to give them motive to not do that again.

 

[kolanuraven]

But then how can you know that your punishment is the correct punishement without knowing their motives?

If you don't learn the motives.....the reasons behind it all , be it religious or not, don't you see you leaving yourself open to it again?? You have not took the time to seek out the warning signs.

It's like garbbing a hot pot. You throw it to the floor as hard as you can cause it hurts...but that won't stop it from burning you again UNLESS you understand why it was hot in the first place.

 

[Red Robin]

But then how can you know that your punishment is the correct punishement without knowing their motives?

If you don't learn the motives.....the reasons behind it all , be it religious or not, don't you see you leaving yourself open to it again?? You have not took the time to seek out the warning signs.

It's like garbbing a hot pot. You throw it to the floor as hard as you can cause it hurts...but that won't stop it from burning you again UNLESS you understand why it was hot in the first place.

I am not bombing them to make me feel better (though it might) I am bombing them to make them not commit the same action again. I can assure you if we nuked every nation that rose up against us there wouldn't be many rising up against us...though I am not advocating that except as a last resort.

 

[theHiredMansWife]

This is why stereotypes exist. So we don't have to go through the trouble of getting to know individuals.
Heaven help us when those individuals tend to prove the stereotype wrong...

 

[BBJ]

Who cares about getting to know "why" they do it. It's kind of like a horse that bites you. I could care less why he did it, but I guarentee that I'll jump on him the instant he does and he'll know real quick that maybe it's a good idea if he doesn't do that again.

Now I realize that I'm comparing apples to oranges, but in a sense it's the same thing. I'm talking about safety, and when it comes to the safety of the ones I love, I don't give a damn about motives.

 

[Red Robin]

This is why stereotypes exist. So we don't have to go through the trouble of getting to know individuals.
Heaven help us when those individuals tend to prove the stereotype wrong...

Erin if you belong to a religion,club, or church voluntarily and that church, club, or religion promotes terrorism among civilian population as an agressive act...and you have the freedom to get out of the religion,club, church...why shouldn't we assume that you condone the acts ? Shouldn't we disregard any personal exceptions for you in this case? Why do I need to get to know you?

 

[BBJ]

This is why stereotypes exist. So we don't have to go through the trouble of getting to know individuals.
Heaven help us when those individuals tend to prove the stereotype wrong...

Erin if you belong to a religion,club, or church voluntarily and that church, club, or religion promotes terrorism among civilian population as an agressive act...and you have the freedom to get out of the religion,club, church...why shouldn't we assume that you condone the acts ? Shouldn't we disregard any personal exceptions for you in this case? Why do I need to get to know you?

My guess is that it's the "feel good" thing to do. People that disagree are not "sensitive" to others and are usually STEROETYPED as war mongerers (sp?) or something like that.

 

[theHiredMansWife]

Erin if you belong to a religion,club, or church voluntarily and that church, club, or religion promotes terrorism among civilian population as an agressive act...and you have the freedom to get out of the religion,club, church...why shouldn't we assume that you condone the acts ? Shouldn't we disregard any personal exceptions for you in this case? Why do I need to get to know you?

Islam doesn't promote terrorism. Radical Muslems promote terrorism. But not all Muslems are radicals...
And I'm going to guess it doesn't matter how many Islam101 links I post that say the same thing, you're going to cling fast to your steroetype anyway.

Who cares about getting to know "why" they do it. It's kind of like a horse that bites you. I could care less why he did it, but I guarentee that I'll jump on him the instant he does and he'll know real quick that maybe it's a good idea if he doesn't do that again.

But the difference is that you don't believe that *all* horses will bite. Or even most.
That's the stereotype.