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hmmmmmmmm

I felt it imperative to follow my oath to obey the Constitution and protect everyones rights especially those of private property rights and privacy-- and a persons right to be secure in their own homes (property)....And as Sheriff, you are the Chief Law Enforcement Officer of the County- and I feel it is your duty to guarantee these rights are enforced evenly thruout the county....

Fish and Game and Highway Patrol did not always agree with me- but I really didn't care
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My hats off to ya OT.................
 
There you have it. Back to the good ol boys club. The sheriff does whatever he feels. Now im betting if someone did that who wasnt the sheriff, such as shoot first, let some one know after, there would some consequences.

Why have seasons? Just shoot. Tell them they were eating your hay. We dont need no stinking seasons!
 
Southdakotahunter said:
There you have it. Back to the good ol boys club. The sheriff does whatever he feels. Now im betting if someone did that who wasnt the sheriff, such as shoot first, let some one know after, there would some consequences.

Why have seasons? Just shoot. Tell them they were eating your hay. We dont need no stinking seasons!
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Purest form of Law Enforcement-- no civil service testing, state boards, unions, and court hearings to get or keep the job...If the population (voters) of your jurisdiction think you are competent, capable, and the best person for the job- you get it...If the population (voters) of your jurisdiction like the way you do your job and think your doing it competently and capably- you keep it....
Pure and simple the way it should be....And since I ran as an Independent, I was able to keep partisanship out of everything also....
 
Ok....trust........

I have a farm in which i have a few cattle, and some crops. What would happen if some deer were eating my bales and i started shooting. Do you think the warden would trust me? Or would my a$$ be in a sling for not notifying them first?
You HAVE to give the gfp a chance to take care of the problem. the law is the law. Trust should not come in anywhere. Everyone should be treated the same, weather its a lawman or not.

Should a cop be let go for speeding with an excuse they left the coffee pot on? No. They should get a ticket just like you or me, but we all know thats not the way things work out. Most times, lawmen look out for each other. Right or wrong, and you know as well as me, thats wrong.
 
Southdakotahunter said:
Ok....trust........

I have a farm in which i have a few cattle, and some crops. What would happen if some deer were eating my bales and i started shooting. Do you think the warden would trust me? Or would my a$$ be in a sling for not notifying them first?
You HAVE to give the gfp a chance to take care of the problem. the law is the law. Trust should not come in anywhere. Everyone should be treated the same, weather its a lawman or not.

Should a cop be let go for speeding with an excuse they left the coffee pot on? No. They should get a ticket just like you or me, but we all know thats not the way things work out. Most times, lawmen look out for each other. Right or wrong, and you know as well as me, thats wrong.
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Well I could sit here and argue with you forever-- on why some people can shoot someone, and walk away scott free with it ruled self defense- and others can do the same thing and be convicted of murder and get life in prison or the death penalty...

Its a little thing called "intent" and involves the facts surrounding each individual situation ( a reason I also don't believe in mandatory sentencing laws) ...

But I doubt if that would be worthwhile with you, since it appears you have your mind made up... :roll: I've pretty well told you what has happened in the past and probably will in the future....And thats all I can do.....

And I have no idea where you're coming up with this "lawmen looking out for each other" BS unless you want to just slime law enforcement or me in general--because none of the folk I saw that had to resort to these actions were law enforcement-- just your average joe blow farmer/rancher trying to protect their property....And many I talked to hated to have to do it-but also had to protect their livelihood and guarantee they could feed their cattle and their families....
 
Southdakotahunter said:
Do you honestly want me to believe its a shoot first, inform later?
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Been there, done it myself.

Drove by one of my soybeans fields late one afternoon soon after the beans came up and started shooting. Left the deer in the field and the next morning called Game & Fish for a nighthunting permit .

Told him what I had done.

When he came out 3 days later there were several more laying in the field.

He wondered why I hadn't moved them cause he said legally he could ticket me. But didn't...........
 
OT being you where in law enforcement wouldn't you want to know if someone else was running something or looking at someone in your county?

The game issue is No different! You must let an officer of the state know what your doing and why before we all go out and start stacking up deer,antelope carcasses. Until you get open seasons, no bag or possession limits, then I for one would have a hard time with anyone who shot without my prior knowledge or consent if I where a Game warden.

The land is yours and mine, the wildlife is neither of ours in itself and must be dealt with in a manner that involves those entrusted to protect and conserve the resource! I have No problem with removing the excess of the carrying capacity, but to do it without the proper channels knowing or giving the green light prior to an act that is otherwise against state laws?

SJ trust? LOL. If we all went to a trust me policy concerning wildlife, what kind of mess would we be in? Millions of dollars annually are poached and killed for horn and meat markets, gall bladder markets etc etc. You would have a much higher rate of this with a trust me policy in lue of game wardens being made known of all activity's that concern wildlife!
 
Happy go lucky said:
OT being you where in law enforcement wouldn't you want to know if someone else was running something or looking at someone in your county?

The game issue is No different! You must let an officer of the state know what your doing and why before we all go out and start stacking up deer,antelope carcasses. Until you get open seasons, no bag or possession limits, then I for one would have a hard time with anyone who shot without my prior knowledge or consent if I where a Game warden.
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Happy-- Sure I agree that you should and always told people to try and get ahold of the local warden first --if possible....I don't think I've ever advocated anything different........But sometimes there were periods of time when the local warden was gone for weeks- and times when no one got out there to do anything even after the office was notified as they were so overloaded with calls.....

I did not/do not promote shooting them without giving Fish and Game a chance to try and do something- altho most things I've seen used over the years - bloodmeal (illegal now), drip cannons, shotgun cracker rounds, temporary snow fence don't work or only work for a short time- and putting up deer proof fences in the middle of a deepsnow winter is out of the question- so it leaves about only one choice....

You guys asked- and I answered- under Montana law, I think you have the right to shoot wildlife to protect your property- and have seen it done on many occasions without prosecution because the state prosecutors believe the same...

And personally I am not the evil killer you believe I am- I seldom even shoot a deer anymore- unless he's something special- and have for many years ate the free tag I get for having my land in Block Management....I prefer to enjoy watching them- as long as they are not endangering my livelihood... I also went with Block Management because it allows the locals (especially the kids) a place to hunt- altho leasing to an outfitter would pay more....But since BM is limited in the amount of money they have- and outfitters are increasingly offering 2-3-4 times the amount- it may not be fiscally possible in the future to turn them down....

But also- I have shot hundreds of starving, dying deer/antelope- that were sometimes so weak they were froze to the ground, rather than let them lay there and suffer....Antelope can eat off your haystack (and pee and crap all over it)- and still starve to death because it isn't the normal type food their body can handle....
 
Happy

Some may have a problem or question there being able to be trusted or trusting others and that is a very valid reason not to trust.

I am very secure in my trust as well as trusting others unless there is a valid/factual reason not to.

I have a bit more faith in people in general. I think a fellow named Basitat said it best.

"I don't believe if it weren't for legislators or organizers that the natural tendencies of mankind are so bad that it is not safe to permit people to be free, or if it weren't for these legislators and organizers, society if left alone, undirected would rush headlong to its inevitable destruction because the instincts of the people are so perverse."
 
Getting back to the issues of access and stuff--heres another article on some to the problems and proposed solutions Montana is looking at:
As you can see outfitter leasing is becoming a hot issue....

http://www.billingsgazette.net/articles/2008/01/31/features/outdoors/20-access.txt
 
nice quote SJ, but large money=greed in alot of cases and we have been down that road with wildlife in the days before teddy roosevelt . No different than socity. We need police/law enforcement and we need game wardens as they are both there to protect and serve, while one deals primarily with people the other deals with people and wildlife, without sportsman and game wardens we wouldn't have the wildlife we do today!
 
Happy
without sportsman and game wardens we wouldn't have the wildlife we do today
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!

I have no problem with either but if you think it is only sportsman and game wardens that dictate whether we have wildlife or not ---I disagree.

Have a nice day.
 
The Tony Dean mentality of "us against the landowner" has done more to kill the sport they love than anything else. Landowners who make their living off the land are the only friends they have left.
 
Doug, you make me sick. Please tell me or show me where its us against the landowner. Over and over i have said there is nothing wrong with charging to hunt. I also have said i am a landowner, so what, its me against me? Dont compair me with Mr Dean. I have a mind of my own and use it. You may want to try that sometime. Mr Dean has some very valid points for many things, and if you would get off your hi horse and check it out sometime, you would see that.

I dont see any problem with protecting your land, your livelyhood or property. I do the same let me tell ya. However, if you dont at least try to help your self, such as have hunters come in to thin out the herd as much as you feel is needed, then i see no need or excuse for landowners to be shooting deer off hay stacks when they should have been thinned during hunting season. There is a difference between them starving to death and them eating your hay. Ya, dispatch them when you see them suffering. But, because they are eating your hay and you didnt allow hunting this fall is no reason to start shooting...........you get whats coming to you at that point, as far as im concerned.
 
Tony Dean and his followers keep fighting vocally for a number of things that landowners do not want.

Roadhunting

Open Fields

Game and Fish ownership of land

Then they bash the lockout and call it a failure, bash Betty Olsen and call her a failure, bash landowners for any reason they can think of, and then talk up how great the walk in program and public access is while Game and Fish is playing favorites on that program.

I grew up a hunter and I still hunt but I hate the thought of being associated with a sport where Tony and his vocal followers are considered the mouthpiece.
 

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