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HMW (gay rights)

Jinglebob

Well-known member
CattleRMe said:
Soapweed said:
theHiredMansWife said:
Some allow gay pastors, but only if they're celibate.

What in the world does that mean, a happy-go-lucky abstainer? Sounds like a complete moran, or at least an oxy-moran. :???: :? :wink:

Aren't Catholic priests celibate (or at least supposed to be)? Does that make them happy-go-lucky abstainers?

Yes I guess they would be happy-go-lucky as celibate means to "not marry", not, to not have sex. They take a vow of chastity and that is why they are not supposed to have sex.

Of course, they are still human and they fight sin and temptation, just as the rest of us do.

As far as the gay question. "Love the sinner, hate the sin".
 

nonothing

Well-known member
Jinglebob said:
nonothing said:
Faster horses said:
How can they effectively preach God's Word, if they are going against God's Word?

ask any catholic priest....

And just what do you mean by this? :???:

i mean come people on give your heads a shake.......no one lives by the word of the good book....and you all are guilty of sinning....and what is wrong with being gay....is it the act of bummin or is it because its anti reproductive
 

Red Robin

Well-known member
reader (the Second) said:
http://www.soulforce.org/article/homosexuality-bible-walter-wink

Very interesting discussion of homosexuality by a renowned Christian theologian, based on study of the original texts.
If you think this represents a renown Christian theologian, you are very unlearned in Christian theology, tradition, and beliefs. He would be regarded as foolish in any mainstream Christian circle. His logic as well as his use of scripture is more than flawed. You are either being decietful by saying he is a renown Christian theologian or you should learn more about Christianity before you speak.
 

Red Robin

Well-known member
reader (the Second) said:
I judged him as quite knowledgeable about the Bible and recognized based on numerous publications, public recognition of his publications (3 "Religious Books of the Year" awards), being a professor at several theological seminaries, member of numerous scholarly societies...
Some how I'm not supprised that you find him knowledgable. It just shows how out of touch with most american Christians you really are. Why don't you put it in a poll form and ask only those that are Christian to participate and see how many people consider the wonderous walter wink woefully wacky.
 

Red Robin

Well-known member
It's unimpressive R2. It just shows how liberal and out of touch our colleges and some of our seminaries are. Just poll the Ranchers crowd and see what you get.
 

CattleRMe

Well-known member
:? Maybe you all would view gay marriages differently if someone you loved was gay. Maybe then you would see the want for commitment and the same rights we as heterosexual couples have.

My question is this if indeed the act of homosexuality is a sin then why did God make a man that was attracted to another man? Why would he create a being that in the end would be damned? I thought God was loving, he did give his only son for mankind.
 

Red Robin

Well-known member
CattleRMe said:
:? Maybe you all would view gay marriages differently if someone you loved was gay. Maybe then you would see the want for commitment and the same rights we as heterosexual couples have.

My question is this if indeed the act of homosexuality is a sin then why did God make a man that was attracted to another man? Why would he create a being that in the end would be damned? I thought God was loving, he did give his only son for mankind.
He didn't make a man that was attracted to another man. That comes with the fallen Adamic nature we all aquire after sin entered the world. BTW just because you are attracted to another man, that doesn't make you a homosexual. Acting on it is the sin.
 

theHiredMansWife

Well-known member
A poll here wouldn't reveal "mainstream". :roll:
The country is fairly evenly split "liberal" and "conservative", yet that is hardly the composition of this board.

So far as your defintion of mainstream vs. mine, I don't think they are the same, RR.

"Dr. Wink is a United Methodist minster {Bush is a Methodist}, works for a Presbyterian seminary and attends Quaker meeting"

The United Methodist Church is the 3rd largest denomination in the country. Presbyterian is 5th.
That seems pretty mainstream.
confused-smiley-013.gif
 

Red Robin

Well-known member
theHiredMansWife said:
A poll here wouldn't reveal "mainstream". :roll:
The country is fairly evenly split "liberal" and "conservative", yet that is hardly the composition of this board.

So far as your defintion of mainstream vs. mine, I don't think they are the same, RR.

"Dr. Wink is a United Methodist minster {Bush is a Methodist}, works for a Presbyterian seminary and attends Quaker meeting"

The United Methodist Church is the 3rd largest denomination in the country. Presbyterian is 5th.
That seems pretty mainstream.
confused-smiley-013.gif
See it as you wish.
 

Jinglebob

Well-known member
Isn't there a quote out there about, "the devil quoting scripture, to make his points"? Just because someone quotes scripture, doesn't make them smarter or better. They may be doing it for the wrong reasons.

If you allow gay marriages, what is the next step? If they want to make an agreement between themselves as to division of property or let a partner have the last say in all matters, can't they do that now?

Seems to me they just want to be thought of as mainstream. I've heard that 4 to 5 % of the population in the US is gay. That is a far thing from being mainstream. While they do not need be persecuted, they also don't need to be looked up to and admired.

I feel sorry for gays. What a hard and sad life they live. But it's not my fault and I don't see why they should pretend that they are the same as us. They may be similar in many ways, but their lifestyle puts them outside the norm and that is something they have to deal with, not us.

Some people are alcoholics and are born that way also, that doesn't mean we need to hold it up and say it is a good thing. Nor do we need to celabrate it as we do when a man and a woman come together to live, love and raise a family. We don't need to castigate them or they us. We are different and will always be so. Not my fault, not their fault, just the way it is.
 

theHiredMansWife

Well-known member
Red Robin said:
He didn't make a man that was attracted to another man. That comes with the fallen Adamic nature we all aquire after sin entered the world. BTW just because you are attracted to another man, that doesn't make you a homosexual. Acting on it is the sin.

Unless you're Christ returned, I'm going to guess this is simply your interpretation. Which is no more valid than anyone else's.
 

Red Robin

Well-known member
theHiredMansWife said:
Red Robin said:
He didn't make a man that was attracted to another man. That comes with the fallen Adamic nature we all aquire after sin entered the world. BTW just because you are attracted to another man, that doesn't make you a homosexual. Acting on it is the sin.

Unless you're Christ returned, I'm going to guess this is simply your interpretation. Which is no more valid than anyone else's.
You amaze me with your ability to see 0 truth. You look for every angle to say there is nothing true. My position is the traditional Christian opinion. It is the one handed down through the bulk of Christianity for over 2000 years. It is what the Bible teaches. If you don't like it , don't believe it. That doesn't make it untrue.
 

theHiredMansWife

Well-known member
I don't think they care about mainstream. I think they just want the same treatment everyone else gets. That doesn't seem like much to ask, really.

No one can fire me for being straight. But in 34 states it's perfectly legal to fire someone for being gay. That's discrimination no matter how you slice it.
 

Jinglebob

Well-known member
Jinglebob said:
Isn't there a quote out there about, "the devil quoting scripture, to make his points"? Just because someone quotes scripture, doesn't make them smarter or better. They may be doing it for the wrong reasons.

If you allow gay marriages, what is the next step? If they want to make an agreement between themselves as to division of property or let a partner have the last say in all matters, can't they do that now?

Seems to me they just want to be thought of as mainstream. I've heard that 4 to 5 % of the population in the US is gay. That is a far thing from being mainstream. While they do not need be persecuted, they also don't need to be looked up to and admired.

I feel sorry for gays. What a hard and sad life they live. But it's not my fault and I don't see why they should pretend that they are the same as us. They may be similar in many ways, but their lifestyle puts them outside the norm and that is something they have to deal with, not us.

Some people are alcoholics and are born that way also, that doesn't mean we need to hold it up and say it is a good thing. Nor do we need to celabrate it as we do when a man and a woman come together to live, love and raise a family. We don't need to castigate them or they us. We are different and will always be so. Not my fault, not their fault, just the way it is.

I think you guys missed this
 

theHiredMansWife

Well-known member
Red Robin said:
You amaze me with your ability to see 0 truth. You look for every angle to say there is nothing true. My position is the traditional Christian opinion. It is the one handed down through the bulk of Christianity for over 2000 years. It is what the Bible teaches. If you don't like it , don't believe it. That doesn't make it untrue.

:)
That's okay. You amaze me with your inability to separate fact from opinion.

Like I said before, there are however many denominations of Christianity in the world because of different interpretations of the exact same book. There are however many different individuals within a denomination, each of whom possess their own brains and see things slightly different as well.
And you know what? I can't even begin to guess how many people think they're the ones with the correct version. :wink:
 

theHiredMansWife

Well-known member
And I think something that is conveniently forgotten in in this argument is that a Christian wedding is not a requirement for a state-recognized marriage (or "civil union", if you prefer).

So far as the state is concerned, a marriage is a legal contract, pure and simple.
 

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