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Just Say NO!!!!

Sandhusker

Well-known member
MRJ, "Isn't it reasonable that there be beef (and other products) in various price ranges so that people with a wide range of incomes are able to buy it? "

As long as US producers can make money selling it.
 

Tex

Well-known member
mrj said:
Tex, you are such a nag! I stated that I will ask about BSE when it is possible for me to donate blood again.

Are you asking for government "stimulus" money to subsidize producers of USA beef??? Do you understand that money is taken away from those of us who produce things of value: "stimulus" losers; in order to redistribute it to those whom 'they' decide 'need' it more: "stimulus" winners?

So.....you have no sympathy for "the poor", chastizing them for not "making a decent wage"???

Isn't it reasonable that there be beef (and other products) in various price ranges so that people with a wide range of incomes are able to buy it?

mrj

I am absolutely not against the poor. I think we have seen an increase in productivity that has not shown up in wages and incomes of those who are being more productive. That is what happens when you allow the economic laws to be ignored because of the "consumer surplus maximazation". You totally leave out those who are producing those supplies while companies like Walmart are hollowing out the economy and putting pressure on suppliers and therefore wages.

The reason we have had so much increase in the tippy top and not everyone as a whole can blame these kind of policies.

I want the "poor" in this country to be able to eat a steak now and then and not have such low incomes that they can't afford a steak. You seem to be on this make it cheap program that puts cattle ranchers in the "poor" category instead of allowing them to make a decent living.

The only "chastizing" I was doing was the distribution of resources that our policies have lead to. Why should the owners of Walmart make so much money while they are undermining the economy just because China manipulates its currency and subsidizes trade? Our markets are the largest economic force in the world and we have let them be sold to the merchandisers with the help of foreign subsidies. I don't like the people in China being abused and kept poor and neither do I like the concentration of wealth.
 

mrj

Well-known member
Tex, what, specifically, do you mean by "consumer surplus maximazation"?

What is the starting wage at Walmart, and for productive employees after one year on the job? Many people are able to live better with Walmart than they did before Walmart according to infrequent news stories. Has the average wage of Chinese people risen or dropped in the past ten years? Isn't China the nation with the fastest growing 'middle class'?

I believe "the poor" CAN and DO eat steak either at home, or as a treat when eating out. They CAN and DO purchase it with their food stamps, BTW. Eating at McDonalds often is a family event and going out for steaks is not, if for no other reason than that many small children (and some that are not so small!) much prefer hamburgers, hot dogs and chicken strips to steak.

I don't believe it is the political system we have had which is to blame for our financial condition, but it is the manipulation of it by liberal politicians going back to FDR, and the ruination of some businesses by Union demands, plus the immoral and illegal activities of relatively few people in the financial industries.

The current mudslide into socialistic governmental policies will only make the financial woes worse, IMO.

However, we have strayed quite a way from the original subject of the thread, which is lies spread with intent of harming a business. That serves no one well, is immoral, and a real [email protected]#!! act when the original perpetrator hides behind the anonymity of the internet while falsely claiming the person and organization whose names appear on the post originated it.

THat you defend the letter as being "facts that are true" is despicable. Don't you understand that???? No matter how much one dislikes international trade and?or corporate businesses, which you obviously do, does not make it right to perpetuate these lies.

mrj

R
 

PORKER

Well-known member
MRJ;Has the average wage of Chinese people risen or dropped in the past ten years? Isn't China the nation with the fastest growing 'middle class'?

Not with all the Chinese Counterfieting going on.


Counterfeiting significant to China’s overall economy
by Susan Headley


The counterfeiting of general goods and infringement of intellectual rights (such as software piracy) in the People’s Republic of China (PRC) comprises a significant portion of China’s overall economy. Consider these facts:

- In 2006, an estimated 8 percent of China’s Gross Domestic Product (GDP) was generated from counterfeiting.

- The PRC’s own State Council Research and Development Center estimated that there were $19 billion to $24 billion worth of counterfeit goods flooding China’s economy in 2001.

- Brand owners estimated that 15 to 20 percent of all well-known brands in the PRC are counterfeit.

- Up to 80 percent of all worldwide counterfeiting is done in China, according to some estimates.

- In 2005, U.S. Customs seized $93 million worth of counterfeit and infringing goods, nearly 70 percent of which came from China (and this is only what Customs actually caught entering the country, which is probably a small percentage of the total).

- The manufacture of counterfeits is primarily centered in the two southern Chinese provinces of Fujian and Guangdong. Had any Chinese food today MRJ ???? WalMart sells China Goods!
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Go easy on Maxine- the bank business hasn't been too lucrative lately- and until she gets her government bailout--shes now a Walmart food shopper eating all those good imported "mystery meats".... :wink:
 

Tex

Well-known member
mrj said:
Tex, what, specifically, do you mean by "consumer surplus maximazation"?

What is the starting wage at Walmart, and for productive employees after one year on the job? Many people are able to live better with Walmart than they did before Walmart according to infrequent news stories. Has the average wage of Chinese people risen or dropped in the past ten years? Isn't China the nation with the fastest growing 'middle class'?

I believe "the poor" CAN and DO eat steak either at home, or as a treat when eating out. They CAN and DO purchase it with their food stamps, BTW. Eating at McDonalds often is a family event and going out for steaks is not, if for no other reason than that many small children (and some that are not so small!) much prefer hamburgers, hot dogs and chicken strips to steak.

I don't believe it is the political system we have had which is to blame for our financial condition, but it is the manipulation of it by liberal politicians going back to FDR, and the ruination of some businesses by Union demands, plus the immoral and illegal activities of relatively few people in the financial industries.

The current mudslide into socialistic governmental policies will only make the financial woes worse, IMO.

However, we have strayed quite a way from the original subject of the thread, which is lies spread with intent of harming a business. That serves no one well, is immoral, and a real [email protected]#!! act when the original perpetrator hides behind the anonymity of the internet while falsely claiming the person and organization whose names appear on the post originated it.

THat you defend the letter as being "facts that are true" is despicable. Don't you understand that???? No matter how much one dislikes international trade and?or corporate businesses, which you obviously do, does not make it right to perpetuate these lies.

mrj

R

mrj, you are so backwards I really don't know where to start. For one, I am not against trade. I understand it pretty well having helped with research for a book on international trade quite some time ago, having kept up with it, and read regular books on it like "The Wealth of Nations" which counters many of the myths on trade you bring up. A balance of trade on average is necessary for the economic health of a country and we haven't had that for some time thanks to very poor trade policies.

In the kind of trade you champion, the middlemen make the money and the suppliers are suppressed with their incomes which is exactly what has happened in the cattle industry and other meats industry. Sure it has concentrated wealth in the hands of a very few families who control much of the agriculture trade in this nation and they get away with it because, yes, it is a little complicated and over the head of most people (yes you!!) and do a lot of it behind closed doors.

You need to read up on China. They have a communist government which is about like having prisoners compete with industry when we trade with them with no qualifications. Perhaps we could do that in our country, put everyone in jail, take your ranch by eminent domain, and have them produce all the food for the rest of us.

I am all for the Chinese or Mexican people bettering themselves. I am not in favor of allowing companies to outsource their supplies to lower cost countries and still sell their supplies here in the U.S. It allows them to be the middlemen I was talking about while they undercut the opportunities in this economy. A balance of trade would help make this more digestible, for lack of a better word, but not entirely. You on the other hand seem to approve undermining an economy just to get a lower price. I also don't like the power a manipulated currency gives to a country like China who then "invests" in U.S. treasuries, thereby keeping the cost of borrowing by the U.S. down (and helps create "bubbles"---part of the problem) a and interest rates subsidized for the overspenders in our govt.

I don't dislike you for thinking the way you do, I just think it is short sighted and irresponsible. Oldtimer said you are involved in banking. If so, that kind of thinking fits.
 

mrj

Well-known member
Duhhhh! China has a Communist government???? Tex/Econ the what-alias-next guy, I truly have known most of my life that was the case.

Is that government more, or less, repressive and oppressive of it's citizens now than even in the quite recent past???? Every little easing of such oppression makes people hunger for more freedom, doesn't it?

Please don't put total trust in what OT says, BTW. We all have seen his political rants and they have not always been the most accurate statements according to many who counter them on that forum, have they?

My "involvment" in banking is more as a customer than any other way. For the record, I do own a very minor interest in the bank which my spouses' ancestors, among many other pioneering agriculture families in the area, started more than 100 years ago. It continues to be recognized as one of the strongest, and fairest ag banks in the state. Government, rather than "bailing out" honest banks, puts more regulation over them than over many other lending agencies.

It matters not to me whether you dislike me or not, particularly so since you do not know me beyond a few remarks I make on this site. Calling me irresponsible or short sighted is your only your opinion, which does not make it true, after all.

Your apparent disdain for "banking" makes one wonder what you would substitute for the function banks serve in the USA.

mrj
 

Tex

Well-known member
mrj, I like good banking, but not what caused the current crisis. I have no disdain for a good bank but for a bad one, well, yes.

I do think your inability to recognize that trade deficits create structural problems in our economy. With the way it has happened with China and their manipulation of their currency, it has given China huge power over our financial system that shouldn't be there if we are to maintain our independence. Workers and businesses in the U.S. should never have to compete with communist goods unless their are political concessions like more freedom and civil rights, and I don't mean that they subsidize our interest rates.
 

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