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Max on Healthcare

A

Anonymous

Guest
An e-mail from Max Baucus to try and calm some of the "crazies" out there.... And no matter if he is a Dem- even rightwingernuts can't say he is a flaming Liberal in the Boxer/Pelosi mold...I think both he and Tester even got "A's" from the NRA :wink:


To My Fellow Montanans:

Last year I was in Havre holding a listening session as we started to lay the ground work for meaningful health care reform. When I was up there, I heard from a couple whose son had been in a very bad accident. For years they had battled obstacle after obstacle trying to find treatment and rehabilitation for him. And as I sat there and listened to their story, and similar stories from other residents, I knew we must act. We must reform health care.

Health care reform. I am sure you have all heard that phrase in the last weeks and months. Whether it is advertisements on TV, articles in the newspapers, or talking with your friends and neighbors, health care reform seems to be everywhere. Even the President of the United States is focusing on Montana to talk about this important issue.

With all this information swirling around, I wanted to take this opportunity to talk directly to you. To tell you more in depth about what has been going on in Washington, how health care reform is shaping up and what it means for you and those you care about.

Health care reform is the single largest legislative challenge that I’ve ever experienced. It is a once in a generation opportunity, and that is why we are working diligently to make sure we get it right.

Unfortunately, because it's so big and complex, it is often misunderstood, misrepresented, and subject to misinformation.

I want to address some of the concerns, dispel some of the myths and highlight some of the benefits of what health care reform really means.

To start off, why do we need health care reform? Why should we tackle such a big problem? The answer is simple: if we don’t act now, our economy will continue to be paralyzed by out of control health care costs. Family budgets will be consumed with paying for health care, and millions of people will fall victim to medical tragedies because they can’t access the care they need and deserve.

The next logical question is what does health care reform mean for Montana? How will reform affect you and those you love?

For the thousands of Montanans without coverage, or barely able to afford the care they have, it is clear what health care reform means . Those folks are scared that one accident, one illness, could wipe out their life savings. Reforms means having access to quality, affordable health care so you no longer have to lay awake at night, praying that your child doesn’t get a fever. It means that you no longer have to choose between a trip to the pharmacy and a trip to the grocery store.

But, for many of you whom I have talked with, you are happy with your health care. You have a doctor you like, you get regular check ups, and so you feel like you don’t really have a stake in any type of reform efforts. Yet, let me be crystal clear, we ALL have a stake in health care reform.

· Health care reform means lower costs for everybody: Right now the average Montana family pays an extra $2,100 a year for their health care premiums because of the broken health care system. By reforming the system, folks won’t be hit with this hidden tax every year. Additionally, if we can provide some commons sense tax incentives to provide health care, we can really take a burden off many of our small businesses.

· Health care reform means higher quality for everybody: Montana is a rural state. We are proud of our communities, and many of us have roots going back one hundred years or more. But this also produces a lot of challenges, especially regarding health care. That is why I’ve worked so hard to promote things like improving health care technology, so when folks go to see their doctor in Havre, they can have access to the most cutting edge medical care.

· Health care reform means greater access for everybody: Across our state, we are seeing a shortage when it comes to primary care doctors, especially in rural areas. These are the doctors that we go to for our regular check-ups and usually the first people we see when we’re feeling sick. I want to make sure that we are taking care of these folks, because they provide a great service to our rural communities.

Yet, I know that many of you still have concerns about health care. The most passionate concerns I hear usually revolve around the government’s involvement with health care. Some people feel that there is not enough government involvement in health care, and they want a single payer type system. Others feel that there is too much government involvement in health care, and they want to eliminate government health care programs and only have private care.

To those who expressed those concerns, I want you to know I am listening. I understand where you are coming from. I recognize the merits of both these arguments, and I have used these viewpoints to help shape the current health care debate. After listening to both sides, meeting with advocates of both viewpoints, it is clear that the answer lies somewhere in between. Some have begun calling it a uniquely American solution to the health care crisis that combines both public and private care.

While some decry government involvement in health care, certainly we can all agree that programs like the Children’s Health Insurance Program, which provides health care to low-income children, and Medicare, which provides care to our seniors, are good things. Programs like these should be strengthened so our children and seniors don’t have to worry about whether they will get their next immunization or be able to fill their next prescription.

And to those who call for a completely government run system, surely we can say that for those who have private coverage that they like, who have a doctor that they like, they should be able to keep that. That we shouldn’t eliminate the health insurance plans that thousands of Montanans currently have, and are satisfied with.

Secondly, there are hundreds of myths floating around about what health care reform will mean. I hear them all the time when I talk with Montanans. Max, they say, are you really going to cut Medicare benefits for seniors? Absolutely not. Am I going to have to change health care insurance I currently have? No way. Will this lead to rationed care? No!

Let me clear about several things:

· We will NOT cut Medicare benefits. Too many seniors rely on this program to ever jeopardize their coverage.

· We will NOT force you to change your current health care. I have said from the beginning, if you like what you have you can keep it.

· We will NOT start rationing health care. If anything, we will do just the opposite. We are working to make care more available, and more affordable.

These are just a few of the things that I wanted to talk about with you when it comes to health care. I know many of you have questions about all of this. I know many of you have heard rumors or seen ads about what health care reform means. I want to provide answers to your questions.

Me and my staff are here to serve you. We want to continue a productive dialogue so we can let you know what we are working on, and you can tell us what is working and what isn’t.

As we move forward, I hope you will join us as we fight to reform our health care system, because the bottom line is that health care reform affects us all.

Max Baucus
 

hypocritexposer

Well-known member
they will never quiet the dissent, if they are unwilling to honestly answer the questions.

brush it aside as much as you want, the questions still remain.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
hypocritexposer said:
they will never quiet the dissent, if they are unwilling to honestly answer the questions.

brush it aside as much as you want, the questions still remain.

I guess you could do like the rightwingernut fearmongers are doing and go out and put out false, misleading, and untrue info---BUT you can't answer the questions- until the final bill is done with all the steps it needs to go thru..... :roll:
Should Dems just lie like the rightwingernut fearmongers are doing :???:
 

hypocritexposer

Well-known member
Can you list this mis-information?

obama can't, that's why he is asking for your neighbors to snithch on those that would pass on such rumors.

Why did obama say he did not know what was in the bill,if he knows how to answer the questions?
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
hypocritexposer said:
Can you list this mis-information?

obama can't, that's why he is asking for your neighbors to snithch on those that would pass on such rumors.

Why did obama say he did not know what was in the bill,if he knows how to answer the questions?

But you do think all the rightwingernut fearmongers do know what is in the bills and will be in the final bill :???:

I've posted numerous evidence of false info being put out- the one that takes the cake is the one requiring older folks be advised on the advanced directives- that rightwingernuts were calling government mandated euthanasia-- that was put in by a Senator that is a conservative doctor- Coburn :roll:
 

hypocritexposer

Well-known member
Nobody knows what is in the bill(s).

that is why people are interested in asking questions.

Answer their questions, instead of avoiding them, and you will have peace.

Refuse to answer then, and you will have doubt and anger.

show contempt, and you will have more anger.

What has obama done so far?
 

Texan

Well-known member
Yep, good ole Max. Just working for the people. :lol:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/07/20/AR2009072003363_pf.html
 

Lonecowboy

Well-known member
Hey as a Montanan I resent that post Texan-
Just because max may have taken a measly few million dollars from healthcare, pharmaseutical, and insurance companies doesn't nesasasarily mean his vote is for sale.
Does it?? :???:

well ok, maybe that was a bad question!!

OK, well Texan, I still resent that and I will get back to you on this when I can find some information to back me up!
Come on OT, the reputation of our great state is at stake here, help me, how can we defend max on this one.
Max wouldn't lie to us for his own benefit would he OT??
Ok, another bad question!!
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Lonecowboy said:
Hey as a Montanan I resent that post Texan-
Just because max may have taken a measly few million dollars from healthcare, pharmaseutical, and insurance companies doesn't nesasasarily mean his vote is for sale.
Does it?? :???:

well ok, maybe that was a bad question!!

OK, well Texan, I still resent that and I will get back to you on this when I can find some information to back me up!
Come on OT, the reputation of our great state is at stake here, help me, how can we defend max on this one.
Max wouldn't lie to us for his own benefit would he OT??
Ok, another bad question!!

Thats actually why I like the Dodd/Kennedy bill that includes a government insurance option to give the insurance companies some competition....
I'm not a Max fan-- but don't think he would put out something false on paper that he could get caught with later...
Lonecowboy- the Montana Dems are asking the question of why Max doesn't give that lobbying money back...Already has the biggest warchest of almost anyone in Congress -spent nothing in this years campaign as had no competition- does not need to worry about running for 6 more years- has no one even showing in anyones wildest dreams that could beat him :???:

Thats why I say that everyday this bill doesn't get passed- the more it gets watered down in the favor of the Big Industry Lobby (Insurance, Pharmaceuticals, Health Supplies, etc) with their funneling of money into Congressmans pockets-- and to the detriment of the American health care user who is already being raped and pillaged by these companies...

I don't know if you saw the post I put on about the McCain amendment- that shows how many are in big industry (in this case Pharmaceuticals) pockets...
McCain introduced a bill that allowed US citizens to be able to purchase prescription drugs from certain foreign countries ( that are as much as 10 times cheaper)...He had all the safety checking and FDA approval covered in the amendment...
He knew it wouldn't pass-(as he's presented it before) and even had a twisted smile- but demanded a "recorded" vote on the bill..EVERY Repub and 2 of the Dems voted against it- killing it....
Pretty well told who buttered their bread....
 

Lonecowboy

Well-known member
oltimer wrote:
with their funneling of money into Congressmans pockets-- and to the detriment of the American health care user who is already being raped and pillaged by these companies...

so are we being "raped and pillaged" by "these companies" or by congressmen on the take??
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Lonecowboy said:
oltimer wrote:
with their funneling of money into Congressmans pockets-- and to the detriment of the American health care user who is already being raped and pillaged by these companies...

so are we being "raped and pillaged" by "these companies" or by congressmen on the take??

Both....
 

Lonecowboy

Well-known member
ultimatly then isn't it the corrupt congressmen that allow this to happen for their own personal gain?

Why then would we trust these same politicians to write a "health care bill"??

Why would we believe anything that they have to say on the matter??
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Lonecowboy said:
ultimatly then isn't it the corrupt congressmen that allow this to happen for their own personal gain?

Why then would we trust these same politicians to write a "health care bill"??

Why would we believe anything that they have to say on the matter??

Roughly 500,000 Montana residents get health insurance on the job.

Since 2000 alone, average family premiums have increased 83 percent.

22 percent of middle-income Montana families spend more than 10 percent of their income on health care.

12 percent of people in Montana report not visiting a doctor due to high cost.

16 percent of people in Montana are uninsured, and 69 percent of them are in families with at least one full-time worker.

Montanans with employer coverage declined from 56 to 53 percent between 2000 and 2007.

Much of the decline is among workers in small businesses, and small businesses make up 86 percent of Montana businesses.

Choice of health insurance is limited in Montana. Blue Cross Blue Shield Montana alone constitutes 75 percent of the health insurance market in Montana, with the top two insurance providers accounting for 85 percent.



We don't have much alternative- unless we can continue to pay 10% per year higher insurance premiums- while wages have stagnated and in some cases like farm earnings have decreased...

Even the most conservative of those on the committees (Burgess, Enzi, Hatch) have said "doing nothing is not an option"....Especially when most economists say rising healthcare costs were one of the key reasons for the wage/earning stagnation during the Bush years- and all forecasts are for this to continue at an ever faster rate which will further put the economy in peril- especially when anymore US companies are competing with companies in countries with government provided health care or insurance and much more controlled costs...
 

Tam

Well-known member
Oldtimer wrote --- Thats actually why I like the Dodd/Kennedy bill that includes a government insurance option to give the insurance companies some competition....
Frank's words

"Public Option is the best and only way to get to a Single Payer system"

Single payer leads to higher taxes, waiting lists and rationing of care, ask anyone that lives in a country that has single payer government funded Universal health care!!!!!!!

NOW Oldtimer do you want CORRUPT CONGRESSMEN deciding what treatment you and your loved ones will get? Will they decide to save your life or your grandchild's life or will they decide to cut the budget and limit your care to the less expensive course of treatment like they do in other countries with Government funded care? Will they pick the treatment you need or will they limit the options you can recieve to those provided by their campaign donors? DO YOU WANT TO TAKE THAT CHANCE. Remember Oldtimer your life and the lives of your grandchildren will depend on your answer.

BTW do you know what the World's third largest employer is Oldtimer?
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Tam- Barney isn't the only Congressman...There are 434 more of them...He wasn't even on the House Committee that produced the House bill... Any ideas of single payer was immediately dropped because there was not much support for it....

And How many times do I have to tell you-- these bills aren't even talking government Health Care - its a Health Insurance Plan...A plan so everyone is guaranteed access to health care insurance....The same Board of Directors and CEO that runs my local Hospital- and the local Clinic - will still run the Hospital and the Clinic- and hire and fire the Doctors and nurses- and pay them what they determine/negotiate for a wage.... The government is not involved in the operation of the Doctors or Hospital....

My wife is in a health care profession that is heavily in demand- and she could make 4-5 times the money in another location or working traveling- as she can get as much as demand will pay- but chooses lifestyle over money- but leaves open the option of semi retiring after getting to medicare age , traveling and making a months wage in one week- and spending the rest of the time home watching grandkids grow... One of the reasons she hasn't is because she needs to stay where she's at to keep health care coverage- which on the open market neither of us could get now because of pre-existing conditions...And she is totally against Government Health Care- and becoming a government worker- or having government setting wages...

But she is in favor of a Comprehensive Plan giving everyone insurance coverage as she's seen so many cases that if the person had had insurance they probably would have been diagnosed much earlier before the disease had progressed to chronic conditions..And she's in favor of the idea in the bills of setting up a Medical panel to set up advisory guidelines to use for treating differing ailments (that the doctors/hospitals can or cannot follow- all voluntary) that will remove much of the liability issue- and make the huge amount of unnecessary and expensive exams/tests she now sees run that are only done so to CYA.....
 

Tam

Well-known member
Oldtimer said:
But she is in favor of a Comprehensive Plan giving everyone insurance coverage as she's seen so many cases that if the person had had insurance they probably would have been diagnosed much earlier before the disease had progressed to chronic conditions..And she's in favor of the idea in the bills of setting up a Medical panel to set up advisory guidelines to use for treating differing ailments (that the doctors/hospitals can or cannot follow- all voluntary) that will remove much of the liability issue- and make the huge amount of unnecessary and expensive exams/tests she now sees run that are only done so to CYA.....

By chronic conditions do you mean like the Condition that would drive you to leave your home and go to another country to get life saving treatment that you can't get because you are SITTING ON A WAITING LIST. :?
Bull, they will be diagnosed much earlier they will sit on a waiting list waiting for a referal to see a specialist to recieve treatment just like they are in Canada and the UK.
And Bull as far as Medical panels to set advisory guidelines they will be limiting options of the kind of treatment you will recieve and they will make their decisions on COST NOT HEALTH CARE QUALITY, Just like they are in Canada and the UK.

Wake up Oldtimer, You are not inventing the wheel here, it is the same wheel that has driven Health care the UK and Canada for years. :wink: :roll:

Oh and wasn't Barney the one that said he saw no problems with Fanny and Freddy and guess what happen Oldtimer? Regulations on them were voted down and the results were the ECONOMIC MELTDOWN IN THE US. So please don't give me this crap about he is only one Congressmen. :roll:
 

Lonecowboy

Well-known member
Oldtimer said:
Lonecowboy said:
ultimatly then isn't it the corrupt congressmen that allow this to happen for their own personal gain?

Why then would we trust these same politicians to write a "health care bill"??

Why would we believe anything that they have to say on the matter??

Roughly 500,000 Montana residents get health insurance on the job.

Since 2000 alone, average family premiums have increased 83 percent.

22 percent of middle-income Montana families spend more than 10 percent of their income on health care.

12 percent of people in Montana report not visiting a doctor due to high cost.

16 percent of people in Montana are uninsured, and 69 percent of them are in families with at least one full-time worker.

Montanans with employer coverage declined from 56 to 53 percent between 2000 and 2007.

Much of the decline is among workers in small businesses, and small businesses make up 86 percent of Montana businesses.

Choice of health insurance is limited in Montana. Blue Cross Blue Shield Montana alone constitutes 75 percent of the health insurance market in Montana, with the top two insurance providers accounting for 85 percent.



We don't have much alternative- unless we can continue to pay 10% per year higher insurance premiums- while wages have stagnated and in some cases like farm earnings have decreased...

Even the most conservative of those on the committees (Burgess, Enzi, Hatch) have said "doing nothing is not an option"....Especially when most economists say rising healthcare costs were one of the key reasons for the wage/earning stagnation during the Bush years- and all forecasts are for this to continue at an ever faster rate which will further put the economy in peril- especially when anymore US companies are competing with companies in countries with government provided health care or insurance and much more controlled costs...


OT- That's like saying we're losing 10% of our chickens to predators every year. So we put out a bid for someone to build us a new chicken house. Then saying , "well we have no alternative, the fox and weasle company was the only one to put in a bid,"
You know that this bunch in there are going to write a bill that fills their pockets and the pockets of the insurance companies, pharmaseuticals, etc.
Doing nothing may not be an option, but doing the wrong thing is even worse. People are waking up finally to what these congressmen are doing. Look at the town hall meetings. Change is coming!!
 

hopalong

Well-known member
Oldtimer said:
hypocritexposer said:
Can you list this mis-information?

obama can't, that's why he is asking for your neighbors to snithch on those that would pass on such rumors.

Why did obama say he did not know what was in the bill,if he knows how to answer the questions?

But you do think all the rightwingernut fearmongers do know what is in the bills and will be in the final bill :???:

I've posted numerous evidence of false info being put out- the one that takes the cake is the one requiring older folks be advised on the advanced directives- that rightwingernuts were calling government mandated euthanasia-- that was put in by a Senator that is a conservative doctor- Coburn :roll:

And a good portion of that false and misleading information is put out by you. THat is fact!!!
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Tam said:
Oldtimer said:
But she is in favor of a Comprehensive Plan giving everyone insurance coverage as she's seen so many cases that if the person had had insurance they probably would have been diagnosed much earlier before the disease had progressed to chronic conditions..And she's in favor of the idea in the bills of setting up a Medical panel to set up advisory guidelines to use for treating differing ailments (that the doctors/hospitals can or cannot follow- all voluntary) that will remove much of the liability issue- and make the huge amount of unnecessary and expensive exams/tests she now sees run that are only done so to CYA.....

By chronic conditions do you mean like the Condition that would drive you to leave your home and go to another country to get life saving treatment that you can't get because you are SITTING ON A WAITING LIST. :?
Bull, they will be diagnosed much earlier they will sit on a waiting list waiting for a referal to see a specialist to recieve treatment just like they are in Canada and the UK.
And Bull as far as Medical panels to set advisory guidelines they will be limiting options of the kind of treatment you will recieve and they will make their decisions on COST NOT HEALTH CARE QUALITY, Just like they are in Canada and the UK.

Wake up Oldtimer, You are not inventing the wheel here, it is the same wheel that has driven Health care the UK and Canada for years. :wink: :roll:

Oh and wasn't Barney the one that said he saw no problems with Fanny and Freddy and guess what happen Oldtimer? Regulations on them were voted down and the results were the ECONOMIC MELTDOWN IN THE US. So please don't give me this crap about he is only one Congressmen. :roll:

Tam-that is the reason they have looked at this as a COMPREHENSIVE plan- to put in programs to get more doctors and nurses and health professionals available- guidelines to reduce many of the unnecessary tests that not only take up medical professionals time- but have high costs- and are done mostly now to Cover their Arses from lawsuit...Standardized forms of billing and insurance forms- to simplify the reading of them- and so you don't need to get an attorney every time to understand them...All computerized interconnected billing thru the new Broadband to reduce costs...ETC. ETC...
I suggest you try and find some way to get videos of the hearings- and watch the future hearings..

A good example of a chronic condition she sees regularly are cancers- in differing advanced stages- that would have been caught by yearly physicals offered under insurance programs-- that could have been simply treated if caught early- that have now progressed to the point they take costly radiation treatments- bone transplants- and/or surgeries.... And the thing is Tam- you and I- all insurance buyers and health care users end up picking up that extra cost now in increased and ever increasing insurance prices and health care bills... They inflate ours- to cover the cost of those that have no insurance- so even if you take care of yourself and have yearly checkups- your paying for those that don't have insurances expensive treatment because they didn't have any...

I don't believe all your fearmongering- because I have talked with many Canadians- including many from Saskatchewan that are very satisfied with their health care and the their affordable insurance plan...Several on here posted the same- but you ran them off with your rule the roost attitude... Some Canadians I know personally that live here go back to Canada for their health services- and several have commented they wished they could get their kids under the same plan...
I don't think you would be happy with anything--I think you showed your colors yesterday when you were whining about not being able to find a Doctor within 50 miles on a weekend--something that most of us who live in a rural area are used to being the norm...You remind me of the little old lady that moved into the north country from the midwest- that was so used to government services there right now, she was calling every day if she got an inch of snow for the county road crew to plow her road... :roll:

All I can do is relate what I personally have seen- and what a health care professional (that discuss's it regularly with their peers) relates to me....I've told how thru the courts I've seen a tremendous rise in court filings over health care bills-- lives financially ruined-business's and farms lost- because they had a major accident or catastrophic illness- and found even tho they thought they had insurance they didn't- or the insurance company dropped them when they began getting major bills- or they had pre-existing conditions and could not get insurance...

These type situations should not exist in a civilized country-- and just sitting around saying NO won't solve it....
 

Sandhusker

Well-known member
Reader, we do know how healthcare in Europe and Cuba is, and that is exactly why we don't want any part of goverment healthcare.

http://www.therealcuba.com/Page10.htm
 
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