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My apologies to fedup and a question for Murgen.

rkaiser

Well-known member
Though our views on how and why American and Canadian troops are in that hell hole known as the middle east, our views on the loss of human life are probably similar.

My post last night was likely a little harsh and may have been seen as cold toward victims of this horrible war.

I can't stand the thought of boys the age of my son being slaughtered in a part of the world where war is a way of life and will never end. What a bloody waste. A couple of weeks past there was a thread on this site which was using these dead boys as scoring how much each of our countries was dedicated to this war. That post made me as sick as the one I wrote last night made you fed up, only I could not even respond to it.

Question for Murgen - Do you think you can line me up a cheap elastrator. GW gave me the choice of having him cut my middle finger off or doing it myself - I thought an elastrator might be less painful

Seriously though Murgen - Can you find me one. Borrowing from the neighbors is getting old.
 

RobertMac

Well-known member
Randy, I haven't read your other post, but I want you to think about something...The USA has lost less lives in three and a half years in Iraq than we lost in one day in New York City by the hands of the same Islamo-fascist. You want to blow this war off because it is "in a part of the world where war is a way of life". If these same fanatics were to get their hands on a nuclear weapon and set it off in New York, how many lives would be lost then? Do you think they would not try?
 

rkaiser

Well-known member
And that is where we disagree Robertmac. I do not believe that these Islamofacists were alone in the 9-11 attack. Yes there are horribble blood thirsty people in Iraq, but there are people like that all over this great world. You can believe that 9-11 was an attack on American by Islamofacists all you like, but the distruction of the twin towers and tower number 7 at the world trade center were far from caused by two passenger jets. Does this mean that Osama is good ---- hell no, but continuing to use and abuse the lives of young innocent soldiers is wrong. Find the Islamofacists themselves ---- catch Osama --- but occupying the countries that may not even house these criminals is only making more of them and like I keep repeating ---- wasting wonderful young men and women who - like you - saw 9-11 as something less than what it truly was.
 

Econ101

Well-known member
Although I was totally for the Iraq war, I am really questioning whether the govt. of the U.S. under Bush can successfully prosecute it. Iraq is deteriorating becase we have been pretty incompetent and the Neo conservatives were not living in reality when it came to power vacuum they created.

In other words, it has been so incompetently prosecuted on the strategic side that we have something that can be worse than what we started with.

I am all for going after our enemies in the world, but doing so incompetently may be worse than not doing so at all, so it seems.

Setting up a scenario where we will have a continuous meat grinder FOR OUR DEDICATED SERVICEMEN is not what I would have approved when giving the okay to go ahead with the war to Bush. He and his top policy advisors shut off discussion, claimed they knew what they were doing, and proceeded to make a mess of things.

The Iraqi meat grinder has killed more U.S. servicemen under the U.S. managment than it has under Saddam's management, and there seems to be no end in sight.

When taking over another country, you have to plan on winning the peace as much as winning the war, and we seem to not be able to do that with the current bobble heads in control.
 

Kathy

Well-known member
Sadly, the death toll for American soldiers actually lies somewhere in the range of 160,000 not the (approx) 2400 "killed in action" reported by the Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld administration and the corporate owned media.

They continue to come home sick from exposure to depleted uranium, as well as being exposed to it on testing ranges around the world.

The USA has used the "radioactive atomicity" equivalent of:

400,000 Nagasaki bombs in Iraq and Afganastan


There is no "rebuilding communities" in areas heavily contaminated. This stuff is genocidal. Don't believe me, read the 1995 Life article "The Tiny Victims of Desert Storm" Link: www.life.com/Life/essay/gulfwar/gulf01.html
This is about the deformed children of USA service men and women, born after their return from Iraq, Kuwait and Saudi Arabia and the 1991 conflict.

I also strongly recommend everyone look at the free on-line videos by Leuren Moret, nuclear whistleblower, geophysicist and radiation specialist where-in she discusses the danger of radiation and depleted uranium.

I was just re-watching the part one video last evening. Leuren was able to obtain declassified documents from the EPA - Environmental Protection Agency (USA) entitled: "Animal Investigation Program for the Nevada Test Site - 1957-1981". This document has information relating radio-active Strontium 90 testing of beef & dairy cattle, as well as deer found at several locations including: "Delamar Valley Beef Herd", "Nevada Test Site (NTS) Beef Herd", "Knoll Creek Beef Herd", "Nevada Test Site Deer".

She also relates the other research. This includes the testing and measurements of Strontium 90 in the "North Atlantic" Fishing Catch which showed Sr90 and Cesium 137 levels resulted in a 50% decline of the NA fishing catch by 1963. It recovered. The Sr90 levels in the NA Ocean/fish directly related to the Sr 90 levels in the milk of Norway's dairy cattle. ALL the result of nuclear testing in Nevada from the early 1940's until 1963 (atmospheric testing). Testing went underground after this. Small particles <1 micron can stay suspended in the air for over 100 days.

The video also shows graphs of the Pacific Ocean Fish Catch, between 1935-1970 which dropped 65%, and never recovered. This is because of the continued testing in the Marshall Islands and Polynesian Islands, as well as by China. China never stopped until 1993.

#1 Atmospheric Testing, Nuclear Power Plants, Depleted Uranium (1 hour) “GLOBAL NUCLEAR COVERUP part one” – Berkeley Community Access TV Series.
15 min. clip:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1407594719544307232
One Hour:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3626298989248030643


#2 Global Diabetes Epidemic Caused by Depleted Uranium (1 hour)May 26, 2006,
GLOBAL NUCLEAR COVERUP part two – Berkeley Community Access TV.
15 min. clip:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1144673265921073656
One Hour:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-7451332617120640846

Connecting the Dots: 911 Four Years Later, From the A-Bomb to Depleted Uranium and Beyond (1 hour) Leuren Moret presentation on low level radiation for Therapists for Social Responsibility, September 11, 2005, Sacramento, California.
Sacramento Community Access TV: by MEDIA EDGE, ART 101 and ROOSTER PRODUCTIONS Full Video: http://www.art101.com/radiation/index.html

Since 2003, over 650,000 Iraqi civilians have been killed. Various reasons for this including their own internal war/killings. Also, disease and starvation, depleted uranium contamination and white phosphorous.

As for worrying about them building a nuclear weapon.... They don't need one. If they wanted to, they could have flown the planes (on 911) into nuclear power stations; but they didn't. That is partially because the hijackers (6 of the 19 which are still alive), were from Saudi Arabia - not Iraq.

Their goal? The goal, in my opinion, was not to kill as many people as possible - but to put fear and hate (for Muslems/Islam) in American hearts, thus enabling Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld/Rice/Powell etc. to push forward their invasion and "occupation" of the Middle East. This way, they control who gets to buy Middle Eastern oil and with what currency it is bought (American dollars). Private corporations get trillions of American tax dollars and the Department of Defense doesn't even have to account for it! Latest figures - over 4 trillion DOD funds "unaccounted for".

Explosive demolition materials were found in Building #7 WTC. It is called "Thermate". Dr. Steven Jones has a peer-reviewed paper which describes these findings with links to video of the collapse of Buiding #7 (a perfect example of a "classical demolision") and other examples where the laws of physics were defied that day.

Link: http://www.physics911.net/stevenjones.htm

The soldiers are doing their job. They are doing what they are told to do by their Commanding Officers. They are told DU is safe - but it's not.

After Vietnam, Henry Kissinger said, "Military men are just dumb, stupid animals to be used as pawns in foreign policy. . ." (from Chapter 5 in the "Final Days" by Woodward and Bernstein).

This is the same man GW Bush wanted to put in charge of the 911 Commission (originally). This was shot down. Still Lee Hamilton, co-chair of the eventual 911 Commission, has publically stated that the Commission was "set up to fail" - they have no idea why Building #7 fell.

Everyone should watch the free on-line video, which gives very good information on the actual events of 911:

"9/11 Mysteries: Chapter One - Demolition" 1hr 30 min. 911weknow.com

http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=-6708190071483512003&q=9+11
 
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