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National ID card-- if implemented: get one or you can't work

Faster horses

Well-known member
EDITED because this part was deleted somehow.

"I don't think Obama is soley responsible for this. Bush and his
Congress and then his Democratic Congress are responsible
as well." This needs to stop NOW.


From Rand Paul and John Tate-in the same email:

You and I have stood together on the frontlines in our battles to uphold our constitutional principles and civil liberties.

Now, Big Government politicians want you to carry a national ID card loaded with biometric and personal information. If you don't carry the card, it will be illegal for you to work.

Campaign for Liberty President John Tate has been leading the fight against Big Government outside the halls of Congress while I do battle on the inside.

I sincerely hope you will take a few minutes of your time to read his message below about the threat a national ID card poses to our freedoms and civil liberties -- and then take action.

In Liberty,


Congressman Ron Paul
---------------------------------------

This from John Tate: Campaign for Liberty President

This is getting to be like a bad movie.

You know the ones where the villain, dead and buried more times than you can count, somehow mysteriously reappears in a place you don’t expect him?

Well, here comes... a new fight over a biometric national ID card -- and if you don’t have the card, you can’t work.

Right now, freedom-stealing statists Senator Lindsey Graham (R-SC) and Senator Chuck Schumer (D-NY), banding together with other statists from both parties, are scheming to sneak a massive power grab into a new “immigration reform” bill.

This bill is a statist’s dream -- “amnesty” for illegal immigrants and a biometric ID card for virtually everyone else.

That’s right. Instead of controlling the border and enforcing the rule of law, these statists want to control you.

That’s why it’s vital you sign the petitions to your Senators IMMEDIATELY.

You see, a National ID scheme -- complete with biometric tracking technology -- is embedded in the new “Comprehensive Immigration Reform Bill” being pushed by Senators Graham and Schumer, as well as other Big Government members from both parties.

And if passed, the “Comprehensive Immigration Reform Bill” would require a new National ID card that would:

*** Include biometric identification information, such as fingerprints, retinal scans or scans of veins on the back of hands. Depending on the technology used, the ID card could easily be used as a tracking device;


*** Be required for all U.S. workers regardless of place of birth, and make it illegal for anyone to hold a job in the United States who doesn't obtain the ID card;


*** Require all employers to purchase an “ID scanner” to verify the ID cards with the federal government. Every time any citizen applies for a job, the government would know -- and you can bet it’s only a matter of time until “ID scans” will be required to make even routine purchases, as well.
Of course, the most dangerous part of the bill is the biometric tracking technology which would allow federal bureaucrats to track our every move.

Allowing our government to have this much “prying power” in our lives will ultimately result in the TOTAL loss of freedom.

This is exactly the type of battle that often decides whether a country remains free, or continues down a slide toward tyranny.

Government goon squads with all our personal information -– information they do not need and constitutionally should not have –- is a recipe for disaster for our nation.

You see, once “well-meaning” government bureaucrats know exactly how we live our lives, it won’t be long until they try to run them.

In fact, it will only be a matter of time until they spend their workdays making sure you and I don’t go anywhere we “shouldn’t,” buy anything we “shouldn’t,” read anything we “shouldn’t,” eat anything we “shouldn’t” or smoke anything we “shouldn’t.”

You see, this fight isn’t really about immigration.

Whatever you think of that fight, it’s simply being used as cover.

If there is good news in this fight, thanks to the help of grassroots citizens like you, it’s that we’ve been able to render the Big Government politicians’ REAL ID nearly toothless in more than two dozen states.

Now, the statists are growing nervous.


They know Americans are FED UP with their mad rush to take over our health care system, expand Federal Reserve power and regulate and control every aspect of our lives.

We’re FED UP with trillion dollar deficits.

We’re SICK AND TIRED of radical schemes like Cap and Tax.

We’re done with their out of control spending on foreign affairs and nation building all over the globe.

They also see that our anger is producing results. Many of their schemes are failing.

Rallies are growing in strength. Candidates are rising up in state after state to say “Enough!”


So the statists are trying a bipartisan “backdoor” scheme to impose more control on American citizens.

They’re hoping that after months of Big Media mouthpieces decrying the “poisonous and partisan politics” in Washington, the American people will jump for joy at the sight of a Democrat from liberal New York and a Republican from conservative South Carolina “working together to solve our immigration mess.”

Well, you and I know better.


After all, liberty activists can hardly find two Senators with bigger vendettas against the liberty movement than Senator Chuck Schumer and Senator Lindsey Graham.


Senator Graham himself has very publicly denounced the limited government R3VOLUTION launched by Dr. Ron Paul.


He’s stated that we’re not welcome in HIS party.

And now, he’s proving why the one who should not be welcome in any party that values freedom is LINDSEY GRAHAM.

That’s why it’s up to you and me to FIGHT back.

Unfortunately, the only way to DEFEAT a new National ID card is to contact Americans from coast-to-coast and explain EXACTLY what’s at stake.


They’re not going to get the real story from the media. It’s up to you and me to reach them.

Already, I’ve prepared email blasts, blog posts and other internet activities to alert liberty-loving Americans to the National ID scheme included in the new “Comprehensive Immigration Reform Bill.”

But that’s not all. Campaign for Liberty staff tells me if I pull out all the stops, there’s an additional twelve million folks I can reach through our mail and phone programs.


And finally, if I can raise the resources, I’d also like to run hard-hitting newspaper, radio and TV ads in New York and South Carolina, explaining to the citizens of those states exactly what Senators Schumer and Graham are up to.

With all the battles we’ve faced over the past several months to save AUDIT THE FED and stop ObamaCare, I simply don’t have the resources to do everything.

So please sign the petition and chip in a quick contribution of $5, $10 or even $25 IMMEDIATELY!

You see, this isn’t a fight we can afford to lose.


Passage of the National ID card would virtually guarantee the last vestiges of freedom we enjoy as Americans would be seriously jeopardized.

And if you and I don’t defeat it, who will?

There is already a strong, “bipartisan coalition” developing, and the American people barely know what’s going on.

So I have to ask you -- in addition to your signed petition -- can I count on you to help out with a $5 or more donation?

Sincerely,




John F. Tate

President, Campaign for Liberty


P.S. Embedded in Senators Lindsey Graham’s and Chuck Schumer’s “Comprehensive Immigration Reform Bill” is the groundwork for a National ID card -- complete with biometric tracking technology -- for everyone with a job in America.

If passed, it would require every American to obtain the card to work legally in the U.S. -- and you can bet it will only be a matter of time until they’re required even for simple purchases.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
FH-- Did you scream about this 5 years ago when GW, his boys, and the Repub controlled Congress passed a real ID- which is essentially a national ID law-- making all the states go to a National ID style approved drivers license or identity card....

History
The REAL ID Act of 2005creates a de facto national identification card. Ostensibly voluntary, it would become mandatory as those without the card would face suspicion and increased scrutiny. It is a law imposing federal technological standards and verification procedures on state driver's licenses and identification cards, many of which are beyond the current capacity of the federal government, and mandating state compliance by May 2008. In fact, REAL ID turns state DMV workers into federal immigration officials, as they must verify the citizenship status of all those who want a REAL ID-approved state driver's license or identification cards. State DMVs would far move away from their core mission -- to license drivers.

REAL ID was appended to a bill providing tsunami relief and military appropriations, and passed with little debate and no hearings. The REAL ID Act repealed provisions in the Intelligence Reform and Terrorism Prevention Act of 2004, which contained "carefully crafted language -- bipartisan language -- to establish standards for States issuing driver's licenses," according to Sen. Richard Durbin. After more than two years, the Department of Homeland Security issued draft regulations for state compliance on March 1, 2007.

The National Conference of State Legislatures estimates (pdf) that the cost to the states will be more than $11 billion over five years. This is more than 100 times the $100 million cost that Congress initially estimated. For 2006, $40 million was allocated for start-up costs. It is likely that the cost will be shouldered by the public. The Department of Homeland Security originally estimatedthat REAL ID will cost $23.1 billion over 10 years. But, when the agency released the final rule in January 2008, it made dubious assumptions and claimed that the national ID system would only cost $9.9 billion.

EPIC and 24 experts in privacy and technology submitted detailed comments(pdf) in May 2007 on the draft regulations explaining the many privacy and security threats raised by the REAL ID Act. The fundamentally flawed national identification system is unworkable and the REAL ID Act must be repealed. In particular, the group admonishes DHS for its failure to include adequate privacy and security safeguards for this massive national identification database. DHS's own Data Privacy and Integrity Advisory Committee has refused(pdf) to endorse the agency's plan. "The Committee feels it is important that the following comments do not constitute an endorsement of REAL ID or the regulations as workable or appropriate."

And FH-- Did you back and give Atta Boys to your Governor and Attorney General when they took a stand against this (backed unanimously by the State Legislature) as an invasion of our privacy?--which in turn Chertoff then threatened to deny persons without the ID from being able to use air or rail transportation....

Somehow I don't remember you're being so against it when it was a Bush/Repub proposed/supported idea :wink: :p :lol: :lol:


Schweitzer Tells Feds
They Can Go to Hell
Montana Defies DHS Chief Chertoff on Real ID


By Pat Hill
A dramatic standoff took place recently between the state of Montana and the Department of Homeland Security in Washington, D.C. Armed with a law passed unanimoulsy by the state legislaure, which rejected the rquirements of the federal Real ID Act of 2005, Gov. Schweitzer defied the feds, saying publicly they could “go to hell.” Montana, though, after a face-saving maneuver pulled by DHS chief Michael Chertoff, officially joins the long list of states officially complying with Real ID.


Brian Schweitzer is passionate about this cause. In January of this year, he sent letters to governors in 17 states asking them to join Montana in standing up to the Feds on Real ID. The letter was sent to the governors of Colorado, Georgia, Idaho, Maine, New Hampshire, Oklahoma, South Caro-lina, Arizona, Hawaii, Illinois, Missouri, Nebraska, Nevada, North Dakota, Pennsylvania, Tennessee, and Washington.

“Today, I am asking you to join with me in resisting the Department of Homeland Security (DHS) coercion to comply with the provisions of Real ID,” Schweitzer wrote. “If we stand together either DHS will blink or Congress will have to act to avoid havoc (including pat-down searches) at our nation's airports and federal courthouses.”

Schweitzer also cited cost as a major concern. The Real ID is a massive undertaking requiring time and money, and the states are to foot most of the bill. Initially expected to cost some $20 billion, the federal government (after making some changes dealing with, among other things, “trickle-down” costs to the states) now expects the program will come in at around $4 billion.

By mid-March, Montana, New Hampshire, South Carolina, and Maine were the only states not granted Real ID extensions by DHS. Like Montana, New Hampshire sent a letter similar to Montana’s to DHS in February, and received an extension it didn’t ask for later that month. That leaves South Carolina and Maine as the only states that haven't asked for an extension, but judging by DHS’s actions so far, they might receive them relatively soon.

The ever-colorful Schweitzer, well aware there’s political hay to be made with such an issue, compared the compliance of the majority of the other states to a Montana sheep ranching operation.

“You know how you tie a bell around the neck of an old wether or two, and pretty soon all the other sheep follow them? I’m not getting into the sheep line,” Schweitzer told the Pioneer. “This is a program looking for a problem. [Real ID] is just another bluff by bureaucrats in D.C.”

Montana has nevertheless been steered into the federal fold, although Schweitzer declared that the fight isn’t over. He told the AP he sent a letter to Chertoff on Mar. 24, saying, “I recognize the question that some recent press coverage might have raised, but I can assure you I stand behind the Attorney General's letter in its entirety.” McGrath’s letter to Chertoff empha-sized that Montana would not give the Feds a copy of the database required by Real ID, in that the state legislature outlawed compliance with that requirement based on privacy concerns.

“Let’s be frank,” Schweitzer told the Pioneer. “I represent the people of Montana. I would break my oath of office if I complied with Real ID. I’m just playing the cards that I’ve been dealt.”
 

hopalong

Well-known member
oldtimer have you decided yet to address the questions asked of you or are you gonna pull a Gloria Allred and run for the hills???

Faced with hard questions she ran! :wink: :wink:
 

Faster horses

Well-known member
OT, you probably won't believe this, but somehow the part I posted
before the article is no longer there. What I said was
"I don't think Obama is totally responsible for this. I think Bush and
his Congress and the Democratic Congress he had need to take
responsibility too."

I was surprised when I went back to look, after reading your post,
that that part wasn't there.

No, I don't believe in a National ID
I don't care WHO comes up with it. And it looks like we need to put
some money behind those that are fighting it now. I will, will you?
 

hopalong

Well-known member
How did it get deleted??

When I originally read the post it was there!
only two ways that someting can be deleted that i am aware of,
just saying wouldn't be the first time somthing was deleted to serve a purpose for rebuttal



EH?
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Faster horses said:
No, I don't believe in a National ID
I don't care WHO comes up with it. And it looks like we need to put
some money behind those that are fighting it now. I will, will you?

I already have...I donated to Jon Tester- who has been adamently against this and the Patriot Act.....
Will you support his fight against it ???
 

Mike

Well-known member
Schumer has been the biggest proponent of the ID. Lindsay Graham even co-sponsored one bill with him on the Biometric ID.
 

hypocritexposer

Well-known member
hopalong said:
How did it get deleted??

When I originally read the post it was there!
only two ways that someting can be deleted that i am aware of,
just saying wouldn't be the first time somthing was deleted to serve a purpose for rebuttal



EH?

I read it in the original post also. It's back now.
 

Steve

Well-known member
seems to me it is alot of worry for nothing.. as it has already been watered down.. and will not get enforced


New Jersey has used the "six point ID" for awhile now and we are still over run with illegals..

I am not sure if they will ever be in compliance with real ID, but I also doubt it will make much difference as it will have holes in it like the 6 point ID

a few ways to show "proof of ID".. (must add up to 6 points)..
Utility bill less than 90 days old (address verification)

Credit card bill less than 90 days old (address verification)

Current health insurance card, prescription card

Parent/guardian address verification

High school diploma, GED or college diploma

Employee ID card with printed pay stub

ATM card with name and signature (1 pt, secondary)

Bank statement or record (1 pt, secondary)

bill or receipt issued by a New Jersey municipality

Photo temporary resident card (Form I-688)

US school photo ID card

US college photo ID

Current driver license from any other state or the District of Columbia

Current NJ driver license

so anyone who was already here and has established a fake name and life.. can continue....

but just in case.. they have ways for others to come in and get started...


for non citizens the folloing its acceptable..
Foreign passport with INS or USCIS verification and valid
record of arrival/departure (Form I-94)
Foreign passport with INS or USCIS verification and valid
Form I-551 stamp
Current alien registration card (new Form I-551) with expiration
date and verification from INS or USCIS
Refugee travel document (Form I-571)
US re-entry permit (Form I-327)
Valid I-94 stamped “Refugee,” “Parolee,” “Asylee” or “Notice
of Action” (Form I-797 approved petition) by INS or USCIS
Valid I-94 with attached photo stamped “Processed for I-551…” by
INS or USCIS
3 – POINT DOCUMENTS:
Current photo employment authorization card (Form I-688B
or I-766).

so once you get a drivers license you can use that to get another..

in other words.. it will not stop illegals.. nor solve anything, other then making it a bit more confusing to get a drivers' license..
 

hopalong

Well-known member
Angusgord said:
hopalong said:
How did it get deleted??

When I originally read the post it was there!
only two ways that someting can be deleted that i am aware of,
just saying wouldn't be the first time somthing was deleted to serve a purpose for rebuttal



EH?
Your a lying piece of s***! I read it as soon as it was posted it wasn't there. I'm thinking Faster was writing it not noticing it wasn't being put on the post Its happened to me before! No biggie!!

Yea ok what ever you say :wink: :wink: :wink:
 
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