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obama care requires elderly to take suicide course

jcummins

Well-known member
ONE HALF ($500 BILLION) OF THE PRESIDENTS "COST SAVINGS" UNDER HIS HEALTH PLAN COMES FROM CUTTING CURRENT BENEFITS AND SERVICES TO THE ELDERLY. THE BILL STIPULATES THAT SENIORS GO THROUGH MANDATORY SUICIDE "HOW TO" COUNSELING EVERY 5 YEARS AND WHEN THEY DEVELOP A SERIOUS DISEASE - THIS IS ONE OF THE WAYS THEY PLAN ON PAYING FOR IT.

IF YOU ARE MEDICAIRE AGE (65), GETTING CLOSE TO THE AGE WHEN YOU MAY QUALIFY FOR MEDICAIRE, OR HAVE ELDERLY PARENTS WHO ARE ON IT, YOU OWE IT TO YOURSELF AND TO THEM TO LISTEN TO THE LINK BELOW (THE FRED THOMPSON SHOW) AND THEN LET YOUR CONGRESSMAN KNOW THAT THIS IS SIMPLY IMMORAL AND NOT ACCEPTABLE.

After listening, please let EVERYONE you know - this information needs to be passed to as many people as possible.

http://fredthompsonshow.com/premiumstream?dispid=320&headerDest=L3BnL2pzcC9tZWRpYS9mbGFzaHdlbGNvbWUuanNwP3BpZD03MzUxJnBsYXlsaXN0PXRydWUmY2hhcnR0eXBlPWNoYXJ0JmNoYXJ0SUQ9MzIwJnBsYXlsaXN0U2l6ZT01
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
This is almost laughable- because during the hearings I heard one Senator try to do the same fearmongering- and he was pretty much sat back on his butt by Senator Tom Coburn MD (probably one of the true conservatives in Congress)- who was the coauthor of the amendment....

What it actually does is give counseling advice to people- especially older people about sitting up living wills and advance directives- whereby they can describe their preferences regarding treatment if they're faced with a serious accident or illness.
It would also make advanced directives/living wills much more binding and remove the threat of suits if any family members tryed to force a Dr. to do treatment against the patients wishes and direction in the advanced directive- and the Dr. didn't do it...

He described many cases of folks with chronic diseases-terminal cancer debilitating strokes, etc-- that had advanced directives not wanting continued treatment if no hope of recovery was evident-- but where family members would step in and say "Do everything for Mom"- and the Doctor was caught between his patients (Mom's) advance wishes- and the daughters wishes- and fearing lawsuits the Doctors usually had to follow the daughters wishs and do lots of unnecessary tests and treatment.....

But that wouldn't fit the big scarey story the rightwingernut crazies want to tell.... :roll: :(
I just laugh that the number one push behind it was not only a very conservative Republican- but an MD- and who said he was doing it at the wishes of the medical industry.....
 

Lonecowboy

Well-known member
Dr. Coburn Criticizes Judge Sotomayor’s Contradictory Statements on Foreign Law


July 22, 2009


(WASHINGTON, D.C.) – U.S. Senator Tom Coburn, M.D. (R-OK) released the following statement today regarding Judge Sotomayor’s written responses to questions regarding the use of foreign law in American courts.

“While I admire Judge Sotomayor’s achievements, I’m troubled that she has reversed herself on the subject of using foreign law in court decisions and deliberations. Judge Sotomayor is now embracing the same attitude toward foreign law she articulated previously but rejected during her public hearings,” Dr. Coburn said.

Before she was nominated Judge Sotomayor said: “I share more the ideas of Justice Ginsburg in thinking, … in believing that unless American courts are more open to discussing the ideas raised by foreign cases, and by international cases, that we are going to lose influence in the world. Justice Ginsburg has explained very recently . . . that foreign opinions . . . can add to the story of knowledge relevant to the solution of a question, and she’s right.”

During the hearing Judge Sotomayor said:

“I will not use foreign law to interpret the Constitution or American statutes. I will use American law, constitutional law to interpret those laws, except in the situations where American law directs a court.”

After the hearing Judge Sotomayor said:

“In limited circumstances, decisions of foreign courts can be a source of ideas informing our understanding of our own constitutional rights.”

“To the extent that American courts categorically refuse to consider the ideas expressed in the decisions of foreign courts, it may be that foreign courts will be less likely to look to American law as a source of ideas.”

“A Supreme Court justice has no authority to make judgments based on international law, much less world opinion. I have serious concerns with any judge who, in the back of her mind, is worried about offending the international community while making a decision about a case in the United States,” Dr. Coburn said.

“Judge Sotomayor’s written responses confirm many Americans’ worst fears that she views the U.S. Constitution, which is the basis of our rule of law, as an insufficient basis for deciding cases and would instead allow the broader arena of international commentary to influence her decisions,” Dr. Coburn said.

http://coburn.senate.gov/public/index.cfm?FuseAction=LatestNews.PressReleases&ContentRecord_id=a3f6f02b-802a-23ad-4e11-0e418e178bd9

DR. Coburn also wrote:

new debt proposed by Administration's budget is larger than the total amount of debt accumulated by the government from 1789 to today
 

Lonecowboy

Well-known member
Earlier today, U.S. Senators Tom Coburn, M.D. (R-OK) and Richard Burr (R-NC) and U.S. Representatives Paul Ryan (R-WI) and Devin Nunes (R-CA) introduced health care reform legislation that delivers on the shared principles of promoting universal access to quality, affordable health care, and does so without adding billions of dollars in new debt or taxes.

“The Patients’ Choice Act of 2009,” transforms health care in America by strengthening the relationship between the patient and the doctor; using choice and competition rather than rationing and restrictions to contain costs; and ensuring universal, affordable health care for all Americans. “The Patients’ Choice Act” promotes innovative, State-based solutions, along with fundamental reforms in the tax code, to give every American, regardless of employment status, age, or health condition, the ability and the resources to purchase health insurance. The comprehensive legislation includes concrete prevention and transparency initiatives, long overdue reforms to Medicare and Medicaid, investments in wellness programs and health IT, and more.

As a practicing physician, I have seen first-hand how giving government more control over health care has failed to make health care more affordable and accessible. The American people deserve health care reform that will work, not another round of so-called reform that repeats the same failed policies of the past. Congress and the administration have the opportunity to pursue bold reform and a fresh start. The Patients’ Choice Act will provide every American with access to affordable health care without a tax increase, more debt and waiting lines,” Dr. Coburn said.
http://coburn.senate.gov/public/index.cfm?FuseAction=HealthCareReform.Home
 

jcummins

Well-known member
Oldtimer said:
This is almost laughable- because during the hearings I heard one Senator try to do the same fearmongering- and he was pretty much sat back on his butt by Senator Tom Coburn MD (probably one of the true conservatives in Congress)- who was the coauthor of the amendment....

What it actually does is give counseling advice to people- especially older people about sitting up living wills and advance directives- whereby they can describe their preferences regarding treatment if they're faced with a serious accident or illness.
It would also make advanced directives/living wills much more binding and remove the threat of suits if any family members tryed to force a Dr. to do treatment against the patients wishes and direction in the advanced directive- and the Dr. didn't do it...

He described many cases of folks with chronic diseases-terminal cancer debilitating strokes, etc-- that had advanced directives not wanting continued treatment if no hope of recovery was evident-- but where family members would step in and say "Do everything for Mom"- and the Doctor was caught between his patients (Mom's) advance wishes- and the daughters wishes- and fearing lawsuits the Doctors usually had to follow the daughters wishs and do lots of unnecessary tests and treatment.....

But that wouldn't fit the big scarey story the rightwingernut crazies want to tell.... :roll: :(
I just laugh that the number one push behind it was not only a very conservative Republican- but an MD- and who said he was doing it at the wishes of the medical industry.....

OT

Do a google of ‘health care mandatory suicide how tos’

The first thing on the list is ‘Obama Health Bill: Those on Social Security – Mandatory Counseling….’
Jul 17, 2009 ... On Page 425 of Obama's health care bill, the Federal Government will .... To: My Favorite Headache. "Mandatory Counseling on Asst. Suicide" ...

Click on it…it will no longer open.

They are doing their version of cleansing of the internet.

There has been enough go on with this administration that I no longer trust ANYTHING they are saying. There has been just to much bad stuff.

Can you or anyone come up with the actual wording in the bill?

You have your opinion…I have mine.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
jcummins said:
Oldtimer said:
This is almost laughable- because during the hearings I heard one Senator try to do the same fearmongering- and he was pretty much sat back on his butt by Senator Tom Coburn MD (probably one of the true conservatives in Congress)- who was the coauthor of the amendment....

What it actually does is give counseling advice to people- especially older people about sitting up living wills and advance directives- whereby they can describe their preferences regarding treatment if they're faced with a serious accident or illness.
It would also make advanced directives/living wills much more binding and remove the threat of suits if any family members tryed to force a Dr. to do treatment against the patients wishes and direction in the advanced directive- and the Dr. didn't do it...

He described many cases of folks with chronic diseases-terminal cancer debilitating strokes, etc-- that had advanced directives not wanting continued treatment if no hope of recovery was evident-- but where family members would step in and say "Do everything for Mom"- and the Doctor was caught between his patients (Mom's) advance wishes- and the daughters wishes- and fearing lawsuits the Doctors usually had to follow the daughters wishs and do lots of unnecessary tests and treatment.....

But that wouldn't fit the big scarey story the rightwingernut crazies want to tell.... :roll: :(
I just laugh that the number one push behind it was not only a very conservative Republican- but an MD- and who said he was doing it at the wishes of the medical industry.....

OT

Do a google of ‘health care mandatory suicide how tos’

The first thing on the list is ‘Obama Health Bill: Those on Social Security – Mandatory Counseling….’
Jul 17, 2009 ... On Page 425 of Obama's health care bill, the Federal Government will .... To: My Favorite Headache. "Mandatory Counseling on Asst. Suicide" ...

Click on it…it will no longer open.

They are doing their version of cleansing of the internet.

There has been enough go on with this administration that I no longer trust ANYTHING they are saying. There has been just to much bad stuff.

Can you or anyone come up with the actual wording in the bill?

You have your opinion…I have mine.

I watched the hearing- and the amendment was accepted exactly as presented by Dr. Coburn- who said he was doing so at the request of numerous Doctors- and who argued for it and totally agreed with it....

The main heart to it as he presented it- was for besides giving advanced directives more authority- remove unneccessary treatments many times given because of threat of suit- but to also advise everyone when they signed up for medicare of their choices and abilities under such type instruments- so they can make an informed decision....

Darn sure it isn't a "suicide" clause.....I, my wife, and a lot of responsible folks I know have a living will or some type of advance directive- to take the choices/decisions off their loved ones- and to give them the ability to die with dignity when all hope is gone.....
Almost all that have worked much in the health care field have them...
 

alice

Well-known member
Oldtimer said:
jcummins said:
Oldtimer said:
This is almost laughable- because during the hearings I heard one Senator try to do the same fearmongering- and he was pretty much sat back on his butt by Senator Tom Coburn MD (probably one of the true conservatives in Congress)- who was the coauthor of the amendment....

What it actually does is give counseling advice to people- especially older people about sitting up living wills and advance directives- whereby they can describe their preferences regarding treatment if they're faced with a serious accident or illness.
It would also make advanced directives/living wills much more binding and remove the threat of suits if any family members tryed to force a Dr. to do treatment against the patients wishes and direction in the advanced directive- and the Dr. didn't do it...

He described many cases of folks with chronic diseases-terminal cancer debilitating strokes, etc-- that had advanced directives not wanting continued treatment if no hope of recovery was evident-- but where family members would step in and say "Do everything for Mom"- and the Doctor was caught between his patients (Mom's) advance wishes- and the daughters wishes- and fearing lawsuits the Doctors usually had to follow the daughters wishs and do lots of unnecessary tests and treatment.....

But that wouldn't fit the big scarey story the rightwingernut crazies want to tell.... :roll: :(
I just laugh that the number one push behind it was not only a very conservative Republican- but an MD- and who said he was doing it at the wishes of the medical industry.....

OT

Do a google of ‘health care mandatory suicide how tos’

The first thing on the list is ‘Obama Health Bill: Those on Social Security – Mandatory Counseling….’
Jul 17, 2009 ... On Page 425 of Obama's health care bill, the Federal Government will .... To: My Favorite Headache. "Mandatory Counseling on Asst. Suicide" ...

Click on it…it will no longer open.

They are doing their version of cleansing of the internet.

There has been enough go on with this administration that I no longer trust ANYTHING they are saying. There has been just to much bad stuff.

Can you or anyone come up with the actual wording in the bill?

You have your opinion…I have mine.

I watched the hearing- and the amendment was accepted exactly as presented by Dr. Coburn- who said he was doing so at the request of numerous Doctors- and who argued for it and totally agreed with it....

The main heart to it as he presented it- was for besides giving advanced directives more authority- remove unneccessary treatments many times given because of threat of suit- but to also advise everyone when they signed up for medicare of their choices and abilities under such type instruments- so they can make an informed decision....

Darn sure it isn't a "suicide" clause.....I, my wife, and a lot of responsible folks I know have a living will or some type of advance directive- to take the choices/decisions off their loved ones- and to give them the ability to die with dignity when all hope is gone.....
Almost all that have worked much in the health care field have them...

Hang in there, OT...you are right...and only the fringe will deny it.

Alice
 

aplusmnt

Well-known member
Wife does home health care and most of her patients are Elderly! There has already been some major changes in What the elderly get in the past few months that is less service than they use to get from Medicare.

They are already making big cut backs for the elderly cutting out the number of visits she can make to them and lots of other services.

Anyone in their 50's or older better give some serious thought to what kind of service you will be getting in a few years.

Shame that the elderly are the ones that worked and made this country great and Obama and social health care is going to throw them to the wolves!
 

jcummins

Well-known member
This is a quote of what Rush Limbaugh said during an interview by Greta Van Susteren on July 23rd. This was during one of Obama’s townhall meetings type things.

They are in a rush to pass this, without even reading....just like previous bills. That in itself is a huge red flag. Passing something without really understanding the content. And when the president of the country thinks HE will be paying God....there is no way any of us should support this. It is YOUR decision.
___
Greta, I could not believe an American citizen stood up, a woman, and essentially asked Obama, Look, my 100-year- old grandmother needed a pacemaker. And the first specialist said, No, she's 100 years old. I can't do any more for her. Went to another specialist -- yes, this woman's got a lot of spunk. I'll put the pacemaker in. She's now 105, living fine.
This woman asked the president of the United States if -- During your health care days, your health care plan, are we going to take into account somebody's spirit and love of life? And Obama simply said, Well, you know, we're going to get to a point here where 100 years old, they'll be better off taking a painkiller.
A citizen of the United States asking the president, Are you going to not kill my mother? I can understand Fidel Castro being asked that question, or Kim Il Sung or Kim Jong Il, or some of the other dictators, but I can't believe that these kind of questions are being asked of the president of the United States, because it's not his decision who lives and dies, but he wants it to be! And he wants it to be the prerogative of his party to determine who gets born and who doesn't, and who has end-of-life problems that are dealt with and not.
 

loomixguy

Well-known member
jcummins said:
This is a quote of what Rush Limbaugh said during an interview by Greta Van Susteren on July 23rd. This was during one of Obama’s townhall meetings type things.

They are in a rush to pass this, without even reading....just like previous bills. That in itself is a huge red flag. Passing something without really understanding the content. And when the president of the country thinks HE will be paying God....there is no way any of us should support this. It is YOUR decision.
___
Greta, I could not believe an American citizen stood up, a woman, and essentially asked Obama, Look, my 100-year- old grandmother needed a pacemaker. And the first specialist said, No, she's 100 years old. I can't do any more for her. Went to another specialist -- yes, this woman's got a lot of spunk. I'll put the pacemaker in. She's now 105, living fine.
This woman asked the president of the United States if -- During your health care days, your health care plan, are we going to take into account somebody's spirit and love of life? And Obama simply said, Well, you know, we're going to get to a point here where 100 years old, they'll be better off taking a painkiller.
A citizen of the United States asking the president, Are you going to not kill my mother? I can understand Fidel Castro being asked that question, or Kim Il Sung or Kim Jong Il, or some of the other dictators, but I can't believe that these kind of questions are being asked of the president of the United States, because it's not his decision who lives and dies, but he wants it to be! And he wants it to be the prerogative of his party to determine who gets born and who doesn't, and who has end-of-life problems that are dealt with and not.

Careful, now...mentioning Rush is like mentioning the Anti-Christ...especially to AT.......

Gotta wonder what AT would say/think if it was him on the table and because of the Usurper's health care reform all the Doc could say is "he's lived a long life"......when a simple procedure would take care of him, but his age was past the cutoff point... :???:

My Mom will be 89 in September and she has had a heart valve replacement, a stroke, pacemaker installed, etc. She lives with me and the pamily now, and it ain't always easy, but she will never be in a nursing home. I KNOW she would have some choice words for the Usurper, and doubtful if any of them would be politically correct! :lol: :lol: :lol: :wink: 8)
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
jcummins said:
ONE HALF ($500 BILLION) OF THE PRESIDENTS "COST SAVINGS" UNDER HIS HEALTH PLAN COMES FROM CUTTING CURRENT BENEFITS AND SERVICES TO THE ELDERLY. THE BILL STIPULATES THAT SENIORS GO THROUGH MANDATORY SUICIDE "HOW TO" COUNSELING EVERY 5 YEARS AND WHEN THEY DEVELOP A SERIOUS DISEASE - THIS IS ONE OF THE WAYS THEY PLAN ON PAYING FOR IT.

IF YOU ARE MEDICAIRE AGE (65), GETTING CLOSE TO THE AGE WHEN YOU MAY QUALIFY FOR MEDICAIRE, OR HAVE ELDERLY PARENTS WHO ARE ON IT, YOU OWE IT TO YOURSELF AND TO THEM TO LISTEN TO THE LINK BELOW (THE FRED THOMPSON SHOW) AND THEN LET YOUR CONGRESSMAN KNOW THAT THIS IS SIMPLY IMMORAL AND NOT ACCEPTABLE.

After listening, please let EVERYONE you know - this information needs to be passed to as many people as possible.

http://fredthompsonshow.com/premiumstream?dispid=320&headerDest=L3BnL2pzcC9tZWRpYS9mbGFzaHdlbGNvbWUuanNwP3BpZD03MzUxJnBsYXlsaXN0PXRydWUmY2hhcnR0eXBlPWNoYXJ0JmNoYXJ0SUQ9MzIwJnBsYXlsaXN0U2l6ZT01

Please go to this website and read the Health care bill for yourself. http://big.assets.huffingtonpost.com/AAHCA-BillText-071409.pdf
You can type 425 in the search block and find this. Looks to me that it has to do with a person having the correct documents on hand to let nature take its course without someone comming in and upsurping his wishs at the end and when he cannot make the decisions. Every five years has to do with the person ,making sure the documents are up to date and still in agreement with his wishes.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
alice said:
Oldtimer said:
jcummins said:
OT

Do a google of ‘health care mandatory suicide how tos’

The first thing on the list is ‘Obama Health Bill: Those on Social Security – Mandatory Counseling….’
Jul 17, 2009 ... On Page 425 of Obama's health care bill, the Federal Government will .... To: My Favorite Headache. "Mandatory Counseling on Asst. Suicide" ...

Click on it…it will no longer open.

They are doing their version of cleansing of the internet.

There has been enough go on with this administration that I no longer trust ANYTHING they are saying. There has been just to much bad stuff.

Can you or anyone come up with the actual wording in the bill?

You have your opinion…I have mine.

I watched the hearing- and the amendment was accepted exactly as presented by Dr. Coburn- who said he was doing so at the request of numerous Doctors- and who argued for it and totally agreed with it....

The main heart to it as he presented it- was for besides giving advanced directives more authority- remove unneccessary treatments many times given because of threat of suit- but to also advise everyone when they signed up for medicare of their choices and abilities under such type instruments- so they can make an informed decision....

Darn sure it isn't a "suicide" clause.....I, my wife, and a lot of responsible folks I know have a living will or some type of advance directive- to take the choices/decisions off their loved ones- and to give them the ability to die with dignity when all hope is gone.....
Almost all that have worked much in the health care field have them...

Hang in there, OT...you are right...and only the fringe will deny it.

Alice

Yep Alice -- especially if the voice of their drug addicted- should be felon- cult spokesman told them :wink: :roll:


Apparently since everyone thinks this is so bad-- it means none of you've taken the reponsible move for your family and made out a living will or advanced directive...

Personally I have- since I don't want all that burden left on my family members- and I want to be the one making the choices of what I consider quality life- and what actions I want taken to keep me alive when I no longer can live what I consider a quality lifestyle....
 

backhoeboogie

Well-known member
Oldtimer said:
alice said:
Oldtimer said:
I watched the hearing- and the amendment was accepted exactly as presented by Dr. Coburn- who said he was doing so at the request of numerous Doctors- and who argued for it and totally agreed with it....

The main heart to it as he presented it- was for besides giving advanced directives more authority- remove unneccessary treatments many times given because of threat of suit- but to also advise everyone when they signed up for medicare of their choices and abilities under such type instruments- so they can make an informed decision....

Darn sure it isn't a "suicide" clause.....I, my wife, and a lot of responsible folks I know have a living will or some type of advance directive- to take the choices/decisions off their loved ones- and to give them the ability to die with dignity when all hope is gone.....
Almost all that have worked much in the health care field have them...

Hang in there, OT...you are right...and only the fringe will deny it.

Alice

Yep Alice -- especially if the voice of their drug addicted- should be felon- cult spokesman told them :wink: :roll:


Apparently since everyone thinks this is so bad-- it means none of you've taken the reponsible move for your family and made out a living will or advanced directive...

Personally I have- since I don't want all that burden left on my family members- and I want to be the one making the choices of what I consider quality life- and what actions I want taken to keep me alive when I no longer can live what I consider a quality lifestyle....

Clinton wanted me to give you folks a message for him.

How did it go? Oh yes! I remember now! "I FEEL YOUR PAIN"
 

Sandhusker

Well-known member
hurleyjd said:
jcummins said:
ONE HALF ($500 BILLION) OF THE PRESIDENTS "COST SAVINGS" UNDER HIS HEALTH PLAN COMES FROM CUTTING CURRENT BENEFITS AND SERVICES TO THE ELDERLY. THE BILL STIPULATES THAT SENIORS GO THROUGH MANDATORY SUICIDE "HOW TO" COUNSELING EVERY 5 YEARS AND WHEN THEY DEVELOP A SERIOUS DISEASE - THIS IS ONE OF THE WAYS THEY PLAN ON PAYING FOR IT.

IF YOU ARE MEDICAIRE AGE (65), GETTING CLOSE TO THE AGE WHEN YOU MAY QUALIFY FOR MEDICAIRE, OR HAVE ELDERLY PARENTS WHO ARE ON IT, YOU OWE IT TO YOURSELF AND TO THEM TO LISTEN TO THE LINK BELOW (THE FRED THOMPSON SHOW) AND THEN LET YOUR CONGRESSMAN KNOW THAT THIS IS SIMPLY IMMORAL AND NOT ACCEPTABLE.

After listening, please let EVERYONE you know - this information needs to be passed to as many people as possible.

http://fredthompsonshow.com/premiumstream?dispid=320&headerDest=L3BnL2pzcC9tZWRpYS9mbGFzaHdlbGNvbWUuanNwP3BpZD03MzUxJnBsYXlsaXN0PXRydWUmY2hhcnR0eXBlPWNoYXJ0JmNoYXJ0SUQ9MzIwJnBsYXlsaXN0U2l6ZT01

Please go to this website and read the Health care bill for yourself. http://big.assets.huffingtonpost.com/AAHCA-BillText-071409.pdf
You can type 425 in the search block and find this. Looks to me that it has to do with a person having the correct documents on hand to let nature take its course without someone comming in and upsurping his wishs at the end and when he cannot make the decisions. Every five years has to do with the person ,making sure the documents are up to date and still in agreement with his wishes.

Which bill, though? Isn't there something like 4 of them?
 

RobertMac

Well-known member
Oldtimer said:
alice said:
Oldtimer said:
I watched the hearing- and the amendment was accepted exactly as presented by Dr. Coburn- who said he was doing so at the request of numerous Doctors- and who argued for it and totally agreed with it....

The main heart to it as he presented it- was for besides giving advanced directives more authority- remove unneccessary treatments many times given because of threat of suit- but to also advise everyone when they signed up for medicare of their choices and abilities under such type instruments- so they can make an informed decision....

Darn sure it isn't a "suicide" clause.....I, my wife, and a lot of responsible folks I know have a living will or some type of advance directive- to take the choices/decisions off their loved ones- and to give them the ability to die with dignity when all hope is gone.....
Almost all that have worked much in the health care field have them...

Hang in there, OT...you are right...and only the fringe will deny it.

Alice

Yep Alice -- especially if the voice of their drug addicted- should be felon- cult spokesman told them :wink: :roll:


Apparently since everyone thinks this is so bad-- it means none of you've taken the reponsible move for your family and made out a living will or advanced directive...

Personally I have- since I don't want all that burden left on my family members- and I want to be the one making the choices of what I consider quality life- and what actions I want taken to keep me alive when I no longer can live what I consider a quality lifestyle....
OT, my wife and I have had a living will for over 10 years.
The point isn't whether it is a good thing or not...the point is (as Rush pointed out, but you missed/ignored) is where in the Constitution does it give the government the right to mandate this or any other of these health care issues????? And why mandate it only for the elderly???

Boogie, your wife does know that Obama care intends to cut home health spending by 3/4....75%!!!!!!!! To reach that goal, there will have to be "death panels" to decide who gets the restricted home health care!!!
 

Steve

Well-known member
OBAMA: I don't think that we can make judgments based on people's spirit. That would be a pretty subjective decision to be making. I think we have to have rules that say that we are going to provide good, quality care for all people. End-of-life care is one of the most difficult sets of decisions that we're going to have to make. But understand that those decisions are already being made in one way or another. If they're not being made under Medicare and Medicaid, they're being made by private insurers. At least we can let doctors know and your mom know that, you know what, maybe this isn't going to help. Maybe you're better off, uhhh, not having the surgery but taking, uh, the painkiller.

lets see.. she is still alive at 105... how much would a pain-killer extend her life? or even better her quality of life?

the death panel is not in the health care bill..... it is hidden in the unread stimulus bill, and was already shoved thru..

a provision in the stimulus bill would create a bureaucracy to “monitor treatments to make sure your doctor is doing what the federal government deems appropriate and cost-effective,”


so much for transparency..
 
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