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OT, NCBA voting and membership policy

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mrj

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OT, sorry to take so long to get this posted, but here are the facts.

Re. NCBA Policy div. ( which is SEPARATE FROM the Federation of State Beef Councils, & the CBB).

OT, votes on policy DO NOT depend on cattle numbers of a state.

The number of votes on the Policy Division board and policy committees a state affiliate of NCBA has is based on the membership revenue generated (that means the number of the state affilate members who pay dues to NCBA). This is how it has been done for at least three decades dating back to the days of ANCA through the days of NCA.. NCBA lists and reports only members who pay NCBA dues directly, or those that have paid their NCBA dues through their state affiliate. These are the only members counted by NCBA.

MEMBERSHIP:OT, members of state affiliates are NOT forced to join NCBA in order to join their state association. There was a time when state affiliates CHOSE to have a state/national partnership where members paid one fee to belong to both orgagnizations, HOWEVER, individuals in the state affiliate COULD belong ONLY to the state organization if they so chose. That structure was dropped two years ago. A Marketing Partnership choice was implemented so that if a state so chooses, they may agree to handle all recruitment and retention efforts for their NCBA members. This gives them a lower cost for dues paid to NCBA and the state affiliation fee is lower, reflecting the state groups cost of doing the membership work. Whatever affiliation type a state chooses is entirely their decision and is not demanded by NCBA. Your claim in a previous post that NCBA has large numbers of "ghost" or captive members due to being forced to join by a business connection is, it it even exists, beyond the control of NCBA and there is no policy promoting such. I suppose it could be similar to the "gifting" of memberships to R-CALF by those who donate money in the name of people or businesses, a practice that I do KNOW occurs, whether or not it is policy of that group.

MEMBERSHIP & POLICY DEVELOPMENT: OT, you and some other R-CALFers ignore the fact that the approach to membership and policy devlopment differs greatly between NCBA and R-CALF.

The NCBA state affiliates are the critical cog in both areas. For membership we do not recruit over the top of, or around our 46 state affiliate organizations, but work actively with and through them to recruit members, whichever membership structure they choose to use.

Re. POLICY DEVELOPMENT: development of policies begins with the state affiliates. Resolutions considered at the national conventions begin with a state member, who does not have to be an NCBA member (giving non-NCBA members direct input into NCBA policy formulation) introducing and getting a resolution passed at his state convention. The state affiliate brings the resolution to the appropriate committee at the NCBA convention. If approved in committee, the Res. goes to the Policy Division board. Any Res. defeated at the committee level can be brought to the board by any director. The next step for approved resolutions is the Annual Membership Meeting at the convention. A resolution defeated by the board can also be brought up at the Membership Meeting. The final step is the mail in ballot. Which DOES get counted!

Re. POLICY COMMITTEE STRUCTURE: First, it is the same structure that has been in effect for at least 30 years. The number of seats an affiliate has on a policy committee is equivalent to the number of Policy Division board members they have (which is determined by the number of members they represent). Voting is simple.....one vote per committee member, simple majority to approve, just like in virtually any other organization.

OT, when you say it is confusing or complicated, you are probably thinking about the JOINT CHECKOFF COMMITTEES where votes are first equalized in order to ensure that one side (CBB, Federation Division, and Policy Division are the three "sides") cannot out vote the others by sheer numbers alone. THE JOINT CHECKOFF COMMITTEES ARE ADVISORY ONLY and cannot commit the Policy division of NCBA to any action. Nor any of the other "sides", I presume. Just thought of that, so will check to see if I'm right.

VOTING: NCBA changed bylaws two years ago to implement a mail ballot. The ballot is mailed to all active members and includes all resolutions passed at convention. Results are tabulated and reported in detail by the accounting firm. The 2005 results were reported on page 7 of the April 7, 2005 issue of Beef Business Bulletin. Mail ballot returns are very typical compared to other association ballot and survey returns. This ballot is designed to OVERTURN policy previously established and passed through the committee, board, and membership voting process IF that policy is contrary to the positions of cow/calf producers back home. The fact that it hasn't done so indicates the producers appointed by their state affiliate members to the committees and board of directors of NCBA are doing the great job their neighbors back home expected of them.

MRJ
 
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The fact that it hasn't done so indicates the producers appointed by their state affiliate members to the committees and board of directors of NCBA are doing the great job their neighbors back home expected of them.

MRJ
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Or that they are just "ghost members" that don't either know or care if they belong--when the auditing firm says they only recieved mail ballots back from less than 2% of the membership it raises huge questions :???: ...
 

mrj

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Oldtimer said:
The fact that it hasn't done so indicates the producers appointed by their state affiliate members to the committees and board of directors of NCBA are doing the great job their neighbors back home expected of them.

MRJ
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Or that they are just "ghost members" that don't either know or care if they belong--when the auditing firm says they only recieved mail ballots back from less than 2% of the membership it raises huge questions :???: ...


OT, obviously you believe what you want to regardless of the facts presented. You claim there are "ghost" members of NCBA who do not even know they belong, or that they don't care that they belong. How about some verification of that statement. Surely a person like you who claims to have your "contacts" among former NCBA members must have some spies worthy of the chore of finding such a "ghost".

MRJ
 
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MRJ said:
Oldtimer said:
The fact that it hasn't done so indicates the producers appointed by their state affiliate members to the committees and board of directors of NCBA are doing the great job their neighbors back home expected of them.

MRJ
--------------

Or that they are just "ghost members" that don't either know or care if they belong--when the auditing firm says they only recieved mail ballots back from less than 2% of the membership it raises huge questions :???: ...


OT, obviously you believe what you want to regardless of the facts presented. You claim there are "ghost" members of NCBA who do not even know they belong, or that they don't care that they belong. How about some verification of that statement. Surely a person like you who claims to have your "contacts" among former NCBA members must have some spies worthy of the chore of finding such a "ghost".

MRJ

MRJ- Many on the board, including myself, have posted numerous situations where people became "ghost" members--You seem to have selective memory again- or maybe you're like your ex-Pres --"We weren't listening" :wink: :lol:
 

mrj

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Oldtimer said:
MRJ said:
Oldtimer said:
The fact that it hasn't done so indicates the producers appointed by their state affiliate members to the committees and board of directors of NCBA are doing the great job their neighbors back home expected of them.

MRJ
--------------

Or that they are just "ghost members" that don't either know or care if they belong--when the auditing firm says they only recieved mail ballots back from less than 2% of the membership it raises huge questions :???: ...


OT, obviously you believe what you want to regardless of the facts presented. You claim there are "ghost" members of NCBA who do not even know they belong, or that they don't care that they belong. How about some verification of that statement. Surely a person like you who claims to have your "contacts" among former NCBA members must have some spies worthy of the chore of finding such a "ghost".

MRJ

MRJ- Many on the board, including myself, have posted numerous situations where people became "ghost" members--You seem to have selective memory again- or maybe you're like your ex-Pres --"We weren't listening" :wink: :lol:


OT, unlike you, I don't have time to read every post. I try, but just can't fit them all in. How would I word a search to find those posts?

I don't have a "selective" memory......though it does seem to naturally recall things truly useless to me, and refuse to give me information I want and need, at times.

BTW, that was an unfortunate comment by Jan Lyons. I seriously doubt anyone can find an organization that goes to greater lengths to "listen" to the members than NCBA, nor a person more considerate and "listening" than is Jan Lyons. She was just too kind and self-deprecating in that instance, taking any perceived "blame" upon herself.

If there is any NCBA member who isn't heard, it is their own fault for not trying. Leaders go beyond the call of duty to be inclusive of all cattle producers. Even ranchers who are not NCBA members can bring up a resolution through their state affiliate, and it can go on to become policy of NCBA.

MRJ
 

feeder

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I am one of those that posted about a membership in order to signed up for a marketing site. BUT on my renewel this year I noticed I only had to pay dues at the state level and not to the national level. So I"m still confused on what I actually belong to.
 

mwj

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feeder said:
I am one of those that posted about a membership in order to signed up for a marketing site. BUT on my renewel this year I noticed I only had to pay dues at the state level and not to the national level. So I"m still confused on what I actually belong to.


Feeder was it implied or requiered that you become a member? Sometimes it is hard to seperate the 2 without very carefull reading :? The lawyer sometimes comes to the phrasing in documents!
 

feeder

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We needed to belong to the state level. But I am so confused with this. Does that mean I'm a NCBA member or not. I think I'm not cuz that is "national". Please everyone don't laugh at me, but if someone would kindly clarify this for me,I'd appreciate it. Thanks.
 

mrj

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feeder said:
I am one of those that posted about a membership in order to signed up for a marketing site. BUT on my renewel this year I noticed I only had to pay dues at the state level and not to the national level. So I"m still confused on what I actually belong to.

feeder, you say you were signing up for a marketing site.......was that by paying dues into a state affiliate of NCBA?

Why didn't you ask the group you were paying dues to at the state level what the deal was if you are still confused on what you "actually belong to"?

This sounds more harsh than I intended for you, "feeder", and I want to assure you it isn't intended for you. I simply do not understand even if you were signing up online, if there wasn't a place to ask questions, or if you just didn't feel like you should????

The only thing I can think of is if the state cattle organization, if that is what you joined, was on the "unified plan" for membership where THAT STATE ORGANIZATION DECIDED ALL STATE MEMBERS SHOULD BE NCBA MEMBERS. Again. That is not the fault of NCBA. The state members made the decision to get lower dues rates and/or because they believed it best served the needs of the STATE members to also be NCBA members.

How can it be the fault of NCBA if people will not ask what they are "signing up" for? Why is it the fault of NCBA if the state organization members and leaders CHOOSE to have a unified membership (belong to both state and national and pay one dues fee)? I'm not saying you made this claim, "feeder" but others pretty well did, so I'm asking anyone who grumbled that NCBA did that and made people members of NCBA that did not want to be, but couldn't join their state organization if they didn't join NCBA.

I can't urge you strongly enough to contact local or state leaders to get answers to your questions and tell them what you need from the state organization. How can leaders effectively serve members and make the organization better if you only complain to others (especially those of us on ranchers.net) who can do little or nothing to help you, however much we may want to?

MRJ
 

feeder

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I think you answered my question MRJ. Thankyou. I guess I just belong to a state cattlemens association not at the national level. I did ask questions when we first joined and it was mandatory to belong at the state level. That is why I didn't get any mail in ballots last year cuz I was only affiliated at the state level. Many questions are answered. Thanks.
 
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MRJ said:
feeder said:
I am one of those that posted about a membership in order to signed up for a marketing site. BUT on my renewel this year I noticed I only had to pay dues at the state level and not to the national level. So I"m still confused on what I actually belong to.

feeder, you say you were signing up for a marketing site.......was that by paying dues into a state affiliate of NCBA?

Why didn't you ask the group you were paying dues to at the state level what the deal was if you are still confused on what you "actually belong to"?

This sounds more harsh than I intended for you, "feeder", and I want to assure you it isn't intended for you. I simply do not understand even if you were signing up online, if there wasn't a place to ask questions, or if you just didn't feel like you should????

The only thing I can think of is if the state cattle organization, if that is what you joined, was on the "unified plan" for membership where THAT STATE ORGANIZATION DECIDED ALL STATE MEMBERS SHOULD BE NCBA MEMBERS. Again. That is not the fault of NCBA. The state members made the decision to get lower dues rates and/or because they believed it best served the needs of the STATE members to also be NCBA members.

How can it be the fault of NCBA if people will not ask what they are "signing up" for? Why is it the fault of NCBA if the state organization members and leaders CHOOSE to have a unified membership (belong to both state and national and pay one dues fee)? I'm not saying you made this claim, "feeder" but others pretty well did, so I'm asking anyone who grumbled that NCBA did that and made people members of NCBA that did not want to be, but couldn't join their state organization if they didn't join NCBA.

I can't urge you strongly enough to contact local or state leaders to get answers to your questions and tell them what you need from the state organization. How can leaders effectively serve members and make the organization better if you only complain to others (especially those of us on ranchers.net) who can do little or nothing to help you, however much we may want to?

MRJ

Another example of the "super secret" NCBA...I've went to their website more than once and can't get an answer on what their membership costs are.. One rule for here, another for the next area--I've had some tell me its a flat fee- others say its a fee and a cattle ownership fee...

MSGA used to REQUIRE NCBA membership to belong- We had belonged to MSGA for 40- 50+ years until that- I quit them and only for that reason...I don't think anyone should be forced to belong to a supposed "cattlemens organization" that actively promotes, campaigns for, and donates to any political candidates (Political Action Group)- no matter whatever party....They donated nothing to my party-INDEPENDENT- I vote for the best person running.....

Maxine- What does it cost you to be a member of NCBA? Tell me what these dues are.......

R-CALF is simple- $50 dollars a year for everyone- big guy, little guy- equal say and voting rights, and you don't have to go to the convention parties to vote......
And the Packers and Texas Feeders don't tell R-CALF what to do or say!!!!
 

feeder

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OT, I went to the NCBA website and found out if I feed 1000 head I would have to pay 300.00 plus fair share of 20 cents per animal in my state. Now if that went per marketing animal in a year it would be more for me. Wow, kinda a lot of $$$. Fifty dollars per year looks mighty good.
 

mrj

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feeder said:
OT, I went to the NCBA website and found out if I feed 1000 head I would have to pay 300.00 plus fair share of 20 cents per animal in my state. Now if that went per marketing animal in a year it would be more for me. Wow, kinda a lot of $$$. Fifty dollars per year looks mighty good.

feeder, that is why they call it a "fair share" assessment in addition to the base dues.

Isn't that more fair than if you sell 100 head you pay the same dues as the guy who sells 10,000 head?

I like the concept of they person who is able to pay more doing so. Every member is treated equally in voting and I challenge ANYONE to bring proof of being told how to vote by anyone!

Yes, it is a little pricey..........quality usually is. You get what you pay for.

OT, I will have to look up a current dues schedule. The reason for different rates is because the STATE organizations have different rates, and they CHOOSE whether they pay the costs of selling memberships or whether NCBA does so. Nothing secret about it at all, darn your luck!!!

Obviously, you were in the minority of MSGA when they decided to be a unified state and national organization. Tough! Does anyone miss you?

NCBA dues are not used to fund any political action. There is a SEPARATE political action committee, financially independent of the membership organization. Members of that PAC, not leadership of the membership org., decide which candidates and/or parties will be supported with our donations. I've never heard of anyone being "forced" to belong to NCBA. Where is your proof of that allegation..........oh!, it must be like your others......nothing there!

I think my dues last year were about $120.00 with a $100.00 base and I paid an extra $20.00 as a donation. Shorty pays our fair share, and I didn't ask what he paid. I will post after I check the new brochure we got a few days ago. It is upstairs and I'm downstairs so won't make that extra trip right now.

NCBA Policy/Dues Div. members are one person, one vote, and all have the opportunity to vote absentee if they so choose. Show us a name of anyone Packers or TX Feeders have told how to vote, other than their state delegates who are supposed to vote according to how their members back home told them to via their state policy directives.

BTW, NCBA votes are taken at the announced meetings.

MRJ
 

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