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R-CALF Cattle Update: Currency Manipulation

HAY MAKER

Well-known member
R-CALF Cattle Update: Currency Manipulation In International Trade

7/31/2007 4:59:00 PM


R-CALF Cattle Update: Currency Manipulation In International Trade

Washington, D.C. – To further its membership-established policies, R-CALF USA joined with the Coalition for a Prosperous America (CPA), the Organization for Competitive Markets (OCM), and Dakota Rural Action (DRA) to urge the Senate Banking Committee to support S. 1677, a proposed bill that would effectively address currency manipulation in international trade.

"It is our understanding this amendment may be offered during tomorrow’s Senate Banking Committee hearing," said R-CALF USA Trade Committee Chair Eric Nelson. "We understand this bill will allow both countervailing and anti-dumping duties to neutralize intentional, or unintentional, currency misalignment and would be a major first step toward decreasing the U.S. trade deficit."

In a joint letter sent today, the groups stated that Asian nations – including China – prevent their currency values from responding to market forces. For 13 years, the U.S. Treasury Department has reported that neither China, nor any other country, manipulates currency for the purpose of achieving unfair trade advantages, but that position generally is not deemed credible.

"The distinction between intentional currency manipulation and unintentional currency misalignment is rooted in diplomatic concerns, and this distinction should be eliminated because the effect is the same," Nelson continued.

The letter states that it is generally agreed that China devalued its currency (remnimbi) in relation to the U.S. dollar by about 40 percent in 1995, and has pegged the remnimbi value to the dollar since that time. China’s economy has seen explosive growth in size and in exports since 1995 which, in a flexible currency regime, would cause the remnimbi to gain in value. However, the remnimbi value has remained relatively constant, in a gravity-defying feat. The result is a 12-year period in which all China products have had a 40 percent export price advantage, although estimates vary between 9 percent and 57 percent. Conversely, U.S. exports to China are 40 percent more expensive than they should be.

"This affects the entire U.S. economy, including agriculture," Nelson pointed out. "U.S. farmers and ranchers cannot compete with other governments, but can compete with producers in other countries given a level playing field. The U.S. is now a net food importer, in large part because of unfair international trade practices.

"S.1677 will expand the anti-dumping remedy contained within a bill first approved by the Senate Finance Committee, and it includes countervailing duties while taking Treasury diplomacy out of the mix," Nelson concluded. "Farmers and ranchers across the country request objective and effective action to reduce and ultimately eliminate the trade deficit."

In 2004, R-CALF USA members voted the following policy into place: "R-CALF USA requests the Administration to use existing laws to correct currency manipulation by trading partners who have taken action to under-value their currencies vis-à-vis the U.S. dollar."
 

Kato

Well-known member
What? Not blaming Canada? :shock: :shock: :? :? :?

Countries manipulate their currency every day. All countries. What do these guys think the variations in interest rates are for? They are not just to control inflation. They also affect currency values. The money will go where the interest rates are highest, and I'm pretty sure that's not China.

"We understand this bill will allow both countervailing and anti-dumping duties to neutralize intentional, or unintentional, currency misalignment and would be a major first step toward decreasing the U.S. trade deficit."

So now they want to include the normal day to day practice the world has run by for years as a reason for countervailing and anti-dumping duties. Can anyone still say with a straight face that these guys aren't protectionists? :shock: :roll: :roll: :roll: Who is to define currency misalignment? Sounds like we're grasping at straws here boys. :roll:

I would think cattle producers like the members of R-Calf would be happy that the dollar has dropped. It makes your beef cheaper to buy for people in other countries.
 

ranch hand

Well-known member
1. safeguarding of somebody or something: the act of preventing somebody or something from being harmed or damaged, or the state of being kept safe
Encarta ® World English Dictionary © & (P) 1998-2004 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.


I think I am a protectionist. Who isn't? Kato you are one if you are worrying about R-calf.
 

Sandhusker

Well-known member
Kato said:
What? Not blaming Canada? :shock: :shock: :? :? :?

Countries manipulate their currency every day. All countries. What do these guys think the variations in interest rates are for? They are not just to control inflation. They also affect currency values. The money will go where the interest rates are highest, and I'm pretty sure that's not China.

"We understand this bill will allow both countervailing and anti-dumping duties to neutralize intentional, or unintentional, currency misalignment and would be a major first step toward decreasing the U.S. trade deficit."

So now they want to include the normal day to day practice the world has run by for years as a reason for countervailing and anti-dumping duties. Can anyone still say with a straight face that these guys aren't protectionists? :shock: :roll: :roll: :roll: Who is to define currency misalignment? Sounds like we're grasping at straws here boys. :roll:

I would think cattle producers like the members of R-Calf would be happy that the dollar has dropped. It makes your beef cheaper to buy for people in other countries.

Kato, it's common knowledge that China has been manipulating their currency and no, it's not a common thing. The only reason you have a problem with this is because R-CALF said it.
 

RobertMac

Well-known member
Kato (and other R-CALF hating Canadians), would you be a member and support a cattleman's organization that promoted and helped your competition take market share and supported corporations whose goal was to pay you less for your cattle?
 

Ben Roberts

Well-known member
ranch hand said:
1. safeguarding of somebody or something: the act of preventing somebody or something from being harmed or damaged, or the state of being kept safe
Encarta ® World English Dictionary © & (P) 1998-2004 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.


I think I am a protectionist. Who isn't? Kato you are one if you are worrying about R-calf.


pro-tec-tion-ist \ n: an advocate of government economic protection for domestic producers through restrictions on foreign competitors-

The Merriam-Webster Dictionary
copyright 1997 by Merriam-Webster, Incorporated
ISBN 0-87779-911-3

I know, that I am not a protectionist! I believe that we all (US and Canadian) cattle producers, should be working together, without government intervention, to remain solvent in the cattle industry.

Best Regards
Ben Roberts
 

QUESTION

Well-known member
As far as countries manipulating their currency value every country does it every day. Canada for example if we wanted the value of the canadian dollar to drop the goverment increases the interest rates and the currency value drops. this isn't new it has been done since time began.
As for everyone being protectionist that is a total load of crap, canadian cattle producers aren't filing injunctions to stop US beef from coming into canada. It isn't protectionist in my mind to lobby for your own product in your own country but that changes when you start trying to use the court system to stop competition. If you guys are afraid you can't compete with canadian beef just say it ,but the way you guys are going about it is very backdoor it is like you are too proud to say you are afraid of canada beef producers. Oh well that is your probem. Too bad your country is built on a free market economy r-calf seems to want competition as long as they are guarenteed a win. :roll: Psst that is not competition. :oops:
 

ranch hand

Well-known member
Question, since you are so smart please explain to me how we can compete with Canada when you dollar was lower than ours. Consumers did not know if they were eating USA,Canada, Mexico, or what ever beef! We were locked in with the packers on what ever flavor was cheaper for them to buy. If it was a compation of good beef I would say we would be pretty close one way or the other on beef quality. But how does the consumer know what country they liked the beef from?
 

Sandhusker

Well-known member
Q, I don't think you understand the difference between manipulation and simple cause and effect.

I think you're also having a hard time differentating between protectionism and demanding a government agency be accountable.
 

QUESTION

Well-known member
Ok ranch hand you want to do some learning. Here we go. The difference in the US and Canadian dollars is only 4-5 cents that is eaten up by high transportation costs so do you have another reason to keep canadian beef out. But lets look at it if a country is selling beef below cost of production you can take it to the WTO and get a anti-dumping ruling and that country is not allowed to sell under their price of production. what the US can do is put on a countervail duty to make the price of the beef equally between imported and domestic produce but it has to be proven that foreign produce is coming in cheaper. But there are consequences if you put as counter vail on if the WTO finds the countrvail duty un fair you have to pay it back to the counrty collected from and then they are allowed additional movement of product. another country may put a counter vail duty on something produced in the US that you guys produce cheaper. So stopping trade unfairly is tough to do that is why R-CALF got the court injuntion stopping canadian cattle.
On knowing what you are eating it is this simple stop relabeling by processors. This is the problem i see cattle going to the US are product of canada but once they are are processed in the US the beef(meat) is product of USA. As they were not inspected or killed in accordance to canadian regulations. Beef from canada is already inspected and graded and our inspection standards are higher than the US standerds but the grading system is different. As for other countries i do not know what their standards are. But why does it matter where food comes from as long as it is safe and healthy to eat and your inspectors are there to make sure all food is safe for human consumption.
 

RobertMac

Well-known member
Q said:
As for other countries i do not know what their standards are. But why does it matter where food comes from as long as it is safe and healthy to eat and your inspectors are there to make sure all food is safe for human consumption.

If you do not know the standards...and if you do not know if those standards are enforced...and NO, the USDA does not have inspectors around the world inspecting food...JUST HOW DO YOU KNOW FOOD IS SAFE , HEALTHY, AND FIT FOR HUMAN CONSUMPTION!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

QUESTION

Well-known member
In canada we make sure imported food is inspect by our inspectors. If you want to import food it is your responsibility to inspect it before it gets to the consumer. Stop blaming others and get off you butt and make sure things are good. A prime example is salad greens recalled in canada it passed USDA and FDA testing but up here it was found to contain excessive high bacterial contaminatin or what about CFIA also recalling canned stew from the US sold in Walmarts because of contamination with salmonella. Was there a recall in the US. Didn't hear about one so did it pass thru the US inspection process. You see up here we do not trust others to do important work and we bear the cost of extra testing but it is done to confirm food safetey for the consumer. So that is how canadians know food is safe. Maybe the US should take a page from the CFIA .
 

Sandhusker

Well-known member
QUESTION said:
In canada we make sure imported food is inspect by our inspectors. If you want to import food it is your responsibility to inspect it before it gets to the consumer. Stop blaming others and get off you butt and make sure things are good. A prime example is salad greens recalled in canada it passed USDA and FDA testing but up here it was found to contain excessive high bacterial contaminatin or what about CFIA also recalling canned stew from the US sold in Walmarts because of contamination with salmonella. Was there a recall in the US. Didn't hear about one so did it pass thru the US inspection process. You see up here we do not trust others to do important work and we bear the cost of extra testing but it is done to confirm food safetey for the consumer. So that is how canadians know food is safe. Maybe the US should take a page from the CFIA .


Last Updated: Monday, September 25, 2006 | 7:14 PM ET
CBC News
Canada has confirmed its first illness related to the outbreak of E. coli involving spinach grown in the U.S.

A 43-year-old woman in Renfrew County, Ont., became ill in early September and had to be hospitalized, the province's Health Ministry said Monday. She has since been released.

Health officials said she had a strain of E. coli that is an exact genetic match to the strain that has killed one American and caused 173 to become sick.

It has yet to be determined exactly where the woman purchased the contaminated spinach, but officials say it was in Canada.

-------------
If you're going to BS this board, Q, you've got to get a whole lot smoother! :wink: :lol:
 

QUESTION

Well-known member
Sand H - check what happened last couple of weeks not last year. :roll: Check the CFIA recall website. Do i have to treat people on here like 5 yr olds. :???
 

Sandhusker

Well-known member
QUESTION said:
Sand H - check what happened last couple of weeks not last year. :roll: Check the CFIA recall website. Do i have to treat people on here like 5 yr olds. :???

Sorry. I wasn't aware that your inspection methods had changed in the last couple of weeks.
 

QUESTION

Well-known member
Sand H i'll give you a soother so you can get a nap before work is out. Inspection methods have not changed what i was saying was check the last month of CFIA recalls and warnings. So did the USDA or FDA recall poisionous stew from Walmart or was the US consumer allowed to be poisoned intentionally. Coincedently i was not talking about e.coli spinach of 06 but californian grown organic salad that a warning was issued about this spring. Maybe the USDA should contract the CFIA to inspect imported food so the US consumer is assured of a safe product.
 

Sandhusker

Well-known member
QUESTION said:
Sand H i'll give you a soother so you can get a nap before work is out. Inspection methods have not changed what i was saying was check the last month of CFIA recalls and warnings. So did the USDA or FDA recall poisionous stew from Walmart or was the US consumer allowed to be poisoned intentionally. Coincedently i was not talking about e.coli spinach of 06 but californian grown organic salad that a warning was issued about this spring. Maybe the USDA should contract the CFIA to inspect imported food so the US consumer is assured of a safe product.

Sorry Q. When you said, "In canada we make sure imported food is inspect by our inspectors.", and " You see up here we do not trust others to do important work and we bear the cost of extra testing but it is done to confirm food safetey for the consumer. So that is how canadians know food is safe.", I thought you were talking all food, which would include spinach.
 

QUESTION

Well-known member
Sand H you want to talk about this particular case. let us do that. the spinach was recalled after tests revealed it was contaminated with e.coli. It was recalled before it was mass distributed. How many canadians got sick and died compared to the US consumers . It taught canadians a lesson that it doesn't matter where food comes from it has to be retested as most countries do not have as rigid regulations for human consumption as Canada. So what are you trying to prove. One person got sick too bad we trust US producers, they inadvertantly poisioned canadians. I guess canadians are not allowed to make a mistake. Maybe you can give lessons on perfection. :roll:
 

Kato

Well-known member
Canada has confirmed its first illness related to the outbreak of E. coli involving spinach grown in the U.S.

A 43-year-old woman in Renfrew County, Ont., became ill in early September and had to be hospitalized, the province's Health Ministry said Monday. She has since been released.

Health officials said she had a strain of E. coli that is an exact genetic match to the strain that has killed one American and caused 173 to become sick.

It has yet to be determined exactly where the woman purchased the contaminated spinach, but officials say it was in Canada.

So what's the point? :?

Also, as a matter of fact the USDA does inspect meat processing facilities in Canada. We have a hog processing plant near here that gets regular visits from both USDA officials, and Japanese officials. The CFIA also inspects American plants.

Back to the currency manipulation. What I was getting at is that these boys are off tilting at windmills again. First it was us, now it's the Chinese currency rate. Do they think the U.S. treasury has not been manipulating the market also? Come on! Trying to change the way currency is valued in this world is like trying to stop the wind. Values change by the minute around the world.

In this country, currency values have a very high priority in the national picture. We are an exporting nation. It's important. Ask any Canadian farmer, rancher, manufacturer or consumer what the dollar is worth today and they can tell you. It's posted on the TV radio and newspaper news many times a day. I can even tell you that it is 94.99 cents U.S. today. A couple of days ago it was lower, but it's come up a bit. A week or so ago it was closer to 96. For years we have gotten the dollar value with every news report, and it is usually accompanied by an explanation for what it has done. An election here or there, a good or bad budget, and especially a change in interest rates will change it.

Lately it's been going up against your dollar, but that is as much a reflection of yours going down as of ours going up in relationship to other currencies. You were in surlplus positions with your budgets a few years ago, and that was reflected by your dollar being high. Now it's deficit time, and the dollar will feel that too.

To try and pass a law that allows tarriffs on countries based on their currencies sounds like the biggest Lawyer Gravy Train yet. :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:
 

Sandhusker

Well-known member
Kato, "Back to the currency manipulation. What I was getting at is that these boys are off tilting at windmills again. First it was us, now it's the Chinese currency rate. Do they think the U.S. treasury has not been manipulating the market also?'

R-CALF aren't the only ones upset about China's currency. It's common knowledge, Kato. Our Congress has been needling China about it for years and their patience is finally wearing thin.

And no, the US Treasury has not been manipulating the dollar. There is a heck of a difference between a currency adjusting to the market and what China is doing.
 
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