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Red Backs in winter

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Thanks for your input, righter. You made a great point.

One thing that really infuriates me, is when "chicken feathers" are part of ingredients in order to up the protein. Why don't they put dirt in as well, as it is protein? It wouldn't do any good because it is not available to the cow... :mad: but 'cheap' is the name of the game, too much of the time.

Yep, you just can't be too careful when purchasing processed feed.
 
FH when you say Vigartone will test your water and grass and formulate a blend. I can see that working in a continuous grazing enviroment but where you rotational graze several different types of grasses with various water sources you might end up chasing a moving target.
 
This fall I tried a new brand of mineral. We mix directly into the feed wagon with the cattle in the lots.After pouring it out I noticed green chunks the size of baseballs which I gathered up suspecting it was copper. The salesman said they would make it right with me but never did.needless to say I switched. Wonder how many cales they were willing to buy if I had not caught it.
 
You would be suprised, NR, it really doesn't change that much (grass or ground). Out of 148 different mineral formulas Vigortone offers, we use about 6 in our area~and it is a big area. Usually the area manger knows which formula works best in a certain area, based on grass and water samples that have already been taken.

There is one place north of us that requires a special formula based on past history and grass and water samples, otherwise everyone uses basically the same mineral. We have sandy soil and clay (gumbo soil) in our area. Cattle eat the mineral better in the sandy areas than they do on the gumbo, but basically the same mineral is used on both. It is a proven fact that Montana is short of copper and zinc in pretty much all areas.

We try to keep it pretty easy. Get on the program and see the results. No need to make it complicated. Performance is the bottom line. We have found that cattle who don't eat enough mineral during the summer, make up for it in winter. Cattle that eat it about right during the summer, consume it about right during the winter. Interesting what those ole cows tell ya. We figure the consumption over the whole year, not day, week or month. It would drive you nuts. The year is what matters. And we usually are right on target of the recommendation.

You know the KISS system is my philosophy: KEEP IT SIMPLE, STUPID.


And baling wire, what a terrible experience!!! That should have NEVER happened.
 
NR,

The mineral content of forage doesn't change alot, except Calcium, Phosphorous and Magnesium.... The things like Copper, Zinc and Selenium tend to be "soaked" up by plants fairly consistently,

Some brands do seasonal packs for the Magnesium, Calcium, and Phosphorous,


PPRM
 
I guess i should have worded that differant. Uh when i say local guys i meant the entire kentucky southern indiana area of clay ground and fescue grass. But than i forgot i shouldnt bring up mineral because nothing is as good as vigortone. I am just teasin FH ! Oh and george that umbarger is a dang good mineral. Good show feed to just to high for my scruffy show calves. lol And your salesman needs smacked for trying to sell you that sweet phos mineral. Its not a real good grazing mineral. Its more for a silage feedlot situation.Like i said thou the mix works great for me and i sell a little out of my barn to locals and friends and they all like it. But and i believe it was george that said it maybe not . If you lime your ground in this area and fertilize accordingly thats the best dang mineral you could have!
 
shorthorn said:
I guess i should have worded that differant. Uh when i say local guys i meant the entire kentucky southern indiana area of clay ground and fescue grass. But than i forgot i shouldnt bring up mineral because nothing is as good as vigortone. I am just teasin FH ! Oh and george that umbarger is a dang good mineral. Good show feed to just to high for my scruffy show calves. lol And your salesman needs smacked for trying to sell you that sweet phos mineral. Its not a real good grazing mineral. Its more for a silage feedlot situation.Like i said thou the mix works great for me and i sell a little out of my barn to locals and friends and they all like it. But and i believe it was george that said it maybe not . If you lime your ground in this area and fertilize accordingly thats the best dang mineral you could have!
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I started on Vigotone a month ago the cattle sure eat it up the cows all are taking on a new shine to there haircoat's.I alway's fly tag my calves in the spring this year I am going to gamble and skip it.If it works that the right mineral's will keep up their immune system's I will be money ahead. The mineral is cheaper than what our local feedstore sells and to me looks like a very smooth and well mixed blend my old mineral particles were bigger and clumpy.One of the most successful farmers of my area has used Vigotone for 30 years that alone is proof enough he would'nt waste one penny.I can remember the pictures of how black and shiney FH's cows were that says alot mine don't look that good but they are coming around.
 
Big Muddy rancher said:
Denny if your cows are eating vigortone just switch to Vigortone with IGR for fly control. The IGR works great if your cows eat the mineral.
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That was what I was thinking of doing this spring. They have ate 6 bags since sunday figure 2 more bags to make it till sunday so it figures out to 7 oz. per head per day 146 head. That's to much but they ran out while I was in Denver so they are making up for it I'm sure I just keep putting it out My cows have always ate mineral like that all or none.
 
FH, you'll be happy to know the last time I was in town with the pickup I bought a ton of Vigortone 32S. It was sure easy enough to load with the forklift. Unloading into the shed was a bit harder! But I needed the exercise! :D

I'm feeding the mineral to the cows on top of Smartlic barrels. Cows still grazing native pasture, no hay, cake, or corn yet. I don't calve until late April so if the weather stays mild and winter doesn't close in I can keep it up until calving time.

Also feeding the mineral to my calves which are also grazing only and eating a 50/50 cracked corn/DDG mix which should be about 16% protein.
 
Thanks, guys. Sure makes it fun when you can visibly SEE the difference a good mineral makes.

John, if you are feeding those calves corn, there is alot of phosphorus in corn. So you could feed the calves 35SPL. It is cheaper, has less phos and the calves will eat it better. Cattle won't overeat phos, it is a limiter like salt. And the PLUS means it has more trace minerals than the 'S' products.

Denny, start the IGR when you have a few days of 60 degree weather and feed it through to the first frost. It won't get rid of all the flies (we never will get rid of all the flies) but it interrups the life cycle of the horn fly, which is the one that does the most damage, economically. It will cut the number of horn flies down so they won't cause the cattle to bunch during the day. Horn flies are what cause cattle to bunch up. When they are bunched, they aren't out grazing and when they aren't out grazing they aren't gaining weight. Here is a little example. A neighbor wasn't feeding IGR and we were. I came home from town and noticed his cattle on the left side of the road all jammed up in the fence corner. Five miles down the road, our cattle were on the left side of the road and they were all scattered out grazing.

And you are right on about the cows 'catching up' on the mineral. Also, if they should keep eating it at that rate, put out salt or up their hay a little. Sometimes they do that if they aren't getting enough dry matter. FWIW

(The product you are using doesn't contain much salt. Loose salt is best and don't mix it, put it in another tub. Hope this helps!)
 
FH, I looked at the bag again. It's 32S Plus. I did mix the 32S Plus with 2 parts mineral, one part American Stockman TM salt for the calves. Gave the mineral to the cows straight. I notice the TM salt has iron, iodine, and cobalt on the guaranteed analysis list, but the Vigortone mineral doesn't mention these trace elements.

When green grass time comes I might mix a bit of magnesium with the mineral, although I see it does contain magnesium. Don't want to make it taste so bad they won't eat it! :lol:
 
Faster horses said:
Thanks, guys. Sure makes it fun when you can visibly SEE the difference a good mineral makes.

John, if you are feeding those calves corn, there is alot of phosphorus in corn. So you could feed the calves 35SPL. It is cheaper, has less phos and the calves will eat it better. Cattle won't overeat phos, it is a limiter like salt. And the PLUS means it has more trace minerals than the 'S' products.

Denny, start the IGR when you have a few days of 60 degree weather and feed it through to the first frost. It won't get rid of all the flies (we never will get rid of all the flies) but it interrups the life cycle of the horn fly, which is the one that does the most damage, economically. It will cut the number of horn flies down so they won't cause the cattle to bunch during the day. Horn flies are what cause cattle to bunch up. When they are bunched, they aren't out grazing and when they aren't out grazing they aren't gaining weight. Here is a little example. A neighbor wasn't feeding IGR and we were. I came home from town and noticed his cattle on the left side of the road all jammed up in the fence corner. Five miles down the road, our cattle were on the left side of the road and they were all scattered out grazing.

And you are right on about the cows 'catching up' on the mineral. Also, if they should keep eating it at that rate, put out salt or up their hay a little. Sometimes they do that if they aren't getting enough dry matter. FWIW

(The product you are using doesn't contain much salt. Loose salt is best and don't mix it, put it in another tub. Hope this helps!)
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My heifer calves have been right on 3 to 4 oz per day but the cows are smokeing thru it.They have been leaveing hay each day but its some late made hay they also have corn silage I may put out some loose salt to slow them up but my heifers are due in 2 weeks so maybe they just feel the need to eat it.
 
Put a red salt block right in the tub you are putting the mineral in and they should slow down - - - when consumption gets low take the blocks away - - - - this seems to work for me.
 

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