Oldtimer said:
Soapweed said:
Oldtimer, somewhere along the line you have conjured up the misconceived notion that you are the only person on this forum who "can think for themself." You are wrong. In fact, you are the one most likely to "follow the crowd," literally and Liberally speaking. You think in these modern times, the rules have changed. It is because of the crowd followers like yourself that the rules are changing. God's Holy Word, the Bible, is just as spot on today as it was centuries ago. Wrong was wrong then, and wrong is wrong now. Don't try to make new rules saying that times have changed enough in this day and age, that wrong is no longer wrong and can be legislated to now be right (i.e. gay marriage and abortion which is the killing of innocent babies). You are no hero because you are supposedly an Independent. In fact, you are a loose cannon because you can't stay on course. You and your kind that swing wildly from side to side are the ones who will eventually tip over the ship.
Soap- that is where you apparently don't understand the direction I come from... I am not a fan of gay marriage , nor of abortion- but unlike the "holier than thou's" I do not believe it is up to me to be telling folks how to live their lives...
After years of talking with homosexuals I'm convinced that homosexuality is not a chosen life- that it is a biological abnormality that these folks can't change... Just like God has allowed babies to be born with Down's syndrome- he has allowed some to have homosexual tendencies (which does manifest itself more by environment)....Its a condition that has been around forever... Just like folks are becoming more tolerant of persons with Downs syndrome and DD- so are they of homosexuality...
As far as gay marriage- I believe these folks are being discriminated against by the government which makes it a constitutional issue- which I am a proponent on because either we follow our constitution or its worthless... Which gives the government two choices-- do away with the thousand laws that give married individuals an advantage- or recognize gay unions... Do we follow our Constitution or do we just throw it out the window for folks that are "different".... :???: Remember- it wasn't long ago we had laws forbidding mixed races (blacks, Asians, Native Americans, Filipinos, even Hawaiians in some states) to marry- and when the courts overruled that we had some bible thumpers and white supremacists screaming it would be the end of the country... Didn't happen tho..
Same with abortion... I dislike the practice of abortion- but also realize it has been around longer than recorded history... I would not want anyone in my family having an abortion-BUT would respect it as their personal choice.. I believe it is a decision that should be made between the individual, their Doctor, and their God... And I believe by keeping it legal we prevent the backalley and Mexican abortions that killed and maimed so many women in the past... Just making it illegal didn't stop it before... Hopefully someday we will realize that we can't solve every problem in this country just by passing a law making a person a criminal...
Years ago I was probably more right wing then you... And I pretty much followed in the goosestep of the right wing... But over the years of working with people- and realizing that not all these folks that are "different" are to be feared or hated I have learned to be much more tolerant...
And over the years I came to realize you can't go backwards... We will never see the 1960's again- no more "Ozzie and Harriet" no more "Leave it to Beaver" world... With all the technological advances and globalization we need to move forward... To progress..
A year ago I went to a lady's funeral about four hours of travel time away. There we got to visit with many friends and relatives. One lady a little older than me was in attendance, and I asked her where her husband was. She said, "You must be one of the last who has not heard. Fred (not his real name) decided a few months ago that he was gay. We are now divorced, and he is living a different lifestyle." Boy, you could have knocked me over with a feather. Fred was a good guy, and I had gone to their wedding forty some years previous. The couple raised three children, who have all gone on to become successful productive members of society. My next question was, "What do your sons think of this?" She replied, "What do you think they think of this? They are completely appalled." Fred was a manly type of guy, and this was completely out of character. Fred died within a couple more months of a massive heart attack. Had he died earlier, while still married to his wife, I am sure his family would have had more peace of mind.
The point of this rambling is this. Fred was as straight as they come for many years. He was not born "different." He got into experimentation, and evidently thought he was "missing out." The experimentation ended up ruining his life, and gave him a premature death.
Yes, there are probably those who are born "different," and for them we should show love, compassion, and tolerance. I have friends who are this way, and they are good friends. Yes, they should have equal opportunity under the law for partnership rights upon death. So should other legal partners. A "marriage" in the strictest sense of the word should be reserved for a union between a man and a woman. Other legal arrangements should be available. They could be called civil unions, partnerships, or whatever, but they should have the same financial rights as marriages.
Homosexuality has always been around, and will always be around. "Don't ask, don't tell" was a good policy. People don't need to divulge their bedroom exploits, as it is really no one else's business anyway. As far as making heroes out of homosexual people, what is the point? Obama made a big production out of calling the NBA player who came out of the closet. Why was this necessary? Yes, we need to love and accept those who are different than us, but we don't need to condone and glorify it. Conservatives usually follow the standard of live and let live, as long as it doesn't bother anyone else. Liberals seem to push the envelope and do their best to promote deviant behavior.