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Sinclair Cattle Co

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LCP

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I am looking to buy some rather tight-bred Emulation/5522/EXT bloodlines, and it seems Sinclair is the logical place to get them. Dad used those lines back in the late 80's & early 90's via AI and still talks about how much he liked the cows (yes, despite a few that had anger management issues). Rather than trying to reinvent the wheel, or convince him that some other bloodlines he isn't as familiar with can accomplish the same thing, I figured it would make sense to replicate what he did, except through natural service and not AI. I watched their sale last year on TV and thought the bulls were very reasonably priced.

Has anyone here purchased from them recently? How have the bulls held up? Are they pushed too hard in development, or about right? How about customer service?
 
I haven't bought any bulls from Sinclair but I've bought/used a son of Sinclair Rito Legacy 3R9 (that also went 3 and 4 generations back to EXT and Shoshone Viking GD60)... Since he got wire cut and crippled young, now I am using one of his sons I raised Lazy Bar B Juanada Rito 06X #16741353... He goes back to Cole Creek Goldmere 31N and C H Quantum 6247 (sire of Cole Creek Black Cedar 46P) breeding on the bottom side...

Juanada Rito last July 2nd


I also used N Bar Prime Time D806 on some heifers and kept their daughters...
Like your dad I have mixed in some Emulation/5522/EXT/ with the 707 bloodlines and had your fears on disposition-- but so far have had no problems... The bulls I've had weren't pets- but were quiet and easy to handle...Both enjoyed getting their heads scratched... I think if you keep EXT/Emulation 31 breeding back at least 3 generations you have better luck with disposition.. The heifer's we've kept have been quiet and we've heard no disposition problems on the bulls/heifers we've sold...And when those bloodlines are added it can make some nice cows...

But the way Sinclair is linebreeding EXT/Emulation on top of EXT/Emulation would give me some reasons to wonder about disposition holding up...
 
Tap, as he was known here on ranchers used a lot of those Sinclair bulls and he was well pleased with them. If you want to talk to him, PM me and I will provide you with his phone number.

I'm more afraid of Emulation 31 than EXT (EXT had Emulation 31 three times in his pedigree)...........that bloodline of cattle could be crazy/nuts. IMO. No bull is perfect and EXT came as close as any, but for his bad reputation. His bad attitude was legendary, although some people say they never experienced it. Northern Rancher had first-hand knowledge of it and he didn't mince words one bit.

I know ranchers who had to carry a baseball bat along when the heifers were calving. I guess I'm telling you to be careful...
 
I'm aware of the disposition issue. Dads advice was just be ready to sell the ones that get too goofy. I'm moving towards calving later, so I should have to spend less time in the barn with them. the genetics we are more or less familiar with (a least dad is), just the breeder that I'm trying to learn more about.
 
Tom Elliot is part of Sinclair and he was the owner of N Bar Ranch at Grass Range and that's where the cattle came from. He knows them like the back of his hand.......the Emulation 5522 cattle had better dispositions.......He has had as solid of a breeding program as there is in the country. I don't remember things as good as I used to, but if I recall correctly, EXT is Emulation N Bar EXT...

EXT can fix the udders on just about any old cow critter...

Hope this helps! :D
 
I used Sinclair Extravagant 6x7 AI. He is an Ext son. Only used 20 straws on some really tame heifers. Really good calving ease but culled two really nice yearlings for disposition and kept 3 in herd. Only one is a decent dispositioned cow. They make my Game Day 449 daughters look like barn pets and they get a little nervous in tight quarters.

In my opinion there are better maternal options available today than Ext but as they say to each their own and some truly have to live it to understand.
 
WB said:
In my opinion there are better maternal options available today than Ext but as they say to each their own and some truly have to live it to understand.
Click to expand...

i agree.

when you look through Sinclair's sire directory, most of the DOC EPDs are pretty damn low, many in the negative :shock:
 
FH: You are probably right. Been 6-8 years I was visiting with a gentleman from Western SD about N-Bar genetics (which his family had used quite a lot of) and I asked about the disposition situation and he replied that they have a little sting to them. He also went on to say that they just turn them loose and see them basically twice a year. Once at branding and once at weaning.

On our operation we have made continued progress in having cattle that are easier handling and more user friendly. Going backwards in disposition would be a huge mistake as labor is hard to find and getting harder to find by the day. We have found that we don't need Ext up close in the pedigree to have good mothers and while not all of our cows have perfect udders we are making continued progress in that area as well.
 
To be fair here, we got into some disposition problems without using EXT.
At our place, cattle have every reason TO NOT act that way. We know where it came from as we had been buying bulls pretty much at one place for a few years. Darn discouraging and frustrating. Mr. FH always said, "on our Ma and Pa outfit, we don't need mean or wild cows."
 
We've used Sinclair Extra 4X13 AI only ever got one bull calf but 13 daughters they are'nt nuts like NR would say the Ohlde bred cattle we have have more of a disposition problem than the Extra daughters and this fall all 13 of those females were bred and we had 10% opens last fall.They look to be wintering well as we grazed them thru 12" of snow for 3 weeks then they went on a swamp grass diet for 30 days and have been on a long stem hay and mineral diet. I don't know if they have any sons this year of Extra but thats my take on them. Mc Cumbers own Extra and have lots of daughters Scott Shively seen over a hundred yearling daughters some years back and said one was just like the next and thats what I see here. I just ordered more semen on him to get more of those females. If a cow stays in good flesh has a nice udder and good feet and legs can have and raise a calf on her own without human intervention what more do you want.
 
Sinclair genetics will give you lot of good cattle.
You will cull some disposition. That has to be done.
If you stick with them they will look like Sinclair cattle, and that's better than most.
 
Of the disposition problems some of you have had, do they tend to be only at calving or a year-round issue? I know I'll have to cull some goofy ones. Guess I'd rather cull a few crazy mamas that I don't have to touch than deal with gentle ones that won't mother up or have to be culled for structure, udders, poor-doers, etc.

Yes, I am aware there are other maternal lines out there. Last year I bought some Shoshone-bred bulls, and have some yearling heifers sired by Cedar Ridge. Dad loved his EXT cows - easier to deal with cranky mamas than a cranky old man...I can always sell the cows, its harder to get rid of the old man :D
 
I can't say that the EXT cows we had were that bad for their disposition towards us humans. What we got tired off was the cows calving, standing up, turning around, and literally try to KILL their own calves. The would beller, get down their knees and try to rub the calve clear to china. Heaven forbid the calf would get up or they would hit them and send them flying. Craziest bitches I have ever seen. We avoid EXT in pedigrees as much as we can and it seems if it is farther down the line and diluted we don't have the problems. He is hard to avoid as he is in a lot of the angus pedigrees.

I agree there is a lot of other genetics that can do that same things without the problems. Albeit lots of folks say if they aren't nuts they make wonderful mommas.
 
For what its worth I just looked up his docility EPD.
-11

That is the lowest I have ever seen. I wonder if there is any lower.
 
I just looked up the angus breed and there is quite a few lower. Lowest was bull named ISU Imagine Q 5228 at DOC -35
 
EXT's grandsire Emulation 31 is DOC -21...
A bull I am questioning some first calf heifers on now is OCC Magnitude who's mgs is EXT... His docility has dropped to -9 and a couple of granddaughter heifers are pretty high headed and might not make the cut- altho their sire was plumb quiet... Nice looking heifers- but if I see anything more, they will be hitting the road... I'll be offering LCP a good deal on some heifers! :wink:
Nothing wild or mean stays around here either... I'm getting too old to play rodeo clown...
 

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