• If you are having problems logging in please use the Contact Us in the lower right hand corner of the forum page for assistance.

Stockgrowers Quarterly Open fields discussion

Help Support Ranchers.net:

S

SJ

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 26, 2005
Messages
282
Reaction score
0
Location
ludlow, SD
Open Fields discussion;Stockgrowers quarterly,Monday, June 6th, Belle Fourche, SD 4:00 pm--downtown at the Belle Fourche community Hall.


The education/taxation/legislation, wildlife management and federal lands committees will gather to discuss current issues. "The Ag and Natural Resources Committee meeting at 4:00 pm. will feature a panel on the open fields doctrine. This event has generated a lot of interest, and we anticipate a fairly large audience," said Davis. The panel will include Game, Fish and Parks Secretary John Cooper, Assistant Attorney General Bob Mayer, a former game commissioner, Harding County ranchers Bob Johnson and Larry Nelson, and Jarrod Johnson, a Sioux Falls-area landowner.
 
This is the schedule taken from the Stockgrowers press release. I'm looking forward to asking Mr. Cooper some questions.

South Dakota Stockgrowers Announce Summer Meeting
Record turnout hoped for

The South Dakota Stockgrowers Association is inviting local cattle producers and others to join them in Belle Fourche, S.D., June 6, 2005, for the June Quarterly Meeting.

Stockgrowers District 2 Directors Cliff Crago and Chance Davis, both of Belle Fourche are urging everyone to gather downtown at the Belle Fourche Community Hall for registration at 8:00 am on Monday.

"This meeting looks to be one of our best yet," said Crago. "We will address current issues affecting the cattle business including animal health and animal identification, brand inspection and international marketing – and that's all before lunch."

After lunch, Crago says a panel of legislators, a former legislator and a former city councilman will address the issue of ag property taxes.
Then, the education/taxation/legislation, wildlife management and federal lands committees will gather to discuss current issues. "The Ag and Natural Resources Committee meeting at 4:00 pm. will feature a panel on the open fields doctrine. This event has generated a lot of interest, and we anticipate a fairly large audience," said Davis. The panel will include Game, Fish and Parks Secretary John Cooper, Assistant Attorney General Bob Mayer, a former game commissioner, Harding County ranchers Bob Johnson and Larry Nelson, and Jarrod Johnson, a Sioux Falls-area landowner.

Dinner will be served after the panel discussion, followed by two speakers, says Davis. "Ren McCoid from Harding County will present his state History Day-winning speech about hot branding, then R-CALF USA's lobbyist Jess Peterson will speak."
Lunch and dinner will consist of USA Beef and will be served at the community hall.

"We hope to see a record turnout at this meeting. The issues we will discuss affect every producer's bottom line," said Crago. "It's important for ranchers to get involved in the South Dakota Stockgrowers Association – to help shape decisions that can better their businesses."

The South Dakota Stockgrowers Association Board of Directors will meet the following morning, June 7, 2005 at American West at 7:45 am.
 
Just something to think about.


These are some dissenting opinions by judges I find them quite interesting or at least worth thinking about.



"The rule of probable cause is a practical, non-technical conception affording the best compromise that has been found for accommodating…often opposing interests. Requiring more would unduly hamper law enforcement, TO ALLOW LESS WOULD BE TO LEAVE LAW ABIDING CITIZENS AT THE MERCY OF THE OFFICERS WHIM OR CAPRICE."



"If subjective good faith on the part of an arresting officer alone were the test, the protections of the Fourth Amendment would EVAPORTATE, and the people would be "secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects" ONLY AT THE DISCRETION OF THE LAW OFFICER."



If GF&P's interpretation of the "open fields doctrine" is correct---no one has a right to privacy in South Dakota, rural or urban. If your yard isn't fenced with a solid fence you have no right to privacy. If the definition of Curtliage is left to the discretion of the officer, there is no protection from violation at the whim of that officer. It follows that if your home has windows and the curtains are open you have shown no expectation of privacy, therefore you could be subject to a warrant-less search.
 
SJ quoting dissenting judge: "The rule of probable cause is a practical, non-technical conception affording the best compromise that has been found for accommodating…often opposing interests. Requiring more would unduly hamper law enforcement, TO ALLOW LESS WOULD BE TO LEAVE LAW ABIDING CITIZENS AT THE MERCY OF THE OFFICERS WHIM OR CAPRICE."

This is precisely why SB122 had probable cause as the sole reason that Conservation Officers would have been allowed to come on to private land without waiting for permission from the landowner. As law abiding citizens, we refuse to submit ourselves to the whim or caprice of a conservation officer who may have a hidden agenda.

SJ quoting dissenting judge: "If subjective good faith on the part of an arresting officer alone were the test, the protections of the Fourth Amendment would EVAPORATE, and the people would be "secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects" ONLY AT THE DISCRETION OF THE LAW OFFICER."

Amen!! We're not willing to lose our constitutional rights because a game warden may have an ax to grind or is merely on a "fishing expedition". We've already seen that GF&P operates using a whole different set of rules for themselves at the expense of hunters and landowners.

Thanks for posting these SJ. It's interesting to see the other side of this issue.
 
The only reason that the urban person may have more of a right to privacy is because urban law enforcement hold their right to privacy to a higher standard Than GF&P law enforcement.
 
Fact - Conservation Officers cannot search houses or buildings within the curtilage without a search warrant.

Fact - Conservation Officers cannot search buildings or vehicles outside of the curtilage without probable cause.

Fact - SJ and LB have admitted that they have never seen a Conservation Officer on their place.

Fact - If SJ and LB can paint Conservation Officer's checking hunters on private land as search and seizure without warrant, they can create support for their cause.


Nobody has stepped forward to reveal abuse of the privelage of Conservation Officers checking hunters and fisherman on private land for game law compliance.

Open Fields just happens to be the "cause of the hour".



~SH~
 
Just tell me SH how do they determine someone is actively hunting or is it that during hunting season CO's can stop anyone?

Can they only make these determinations from public land and roads?

Tell me how curtilage is determined?
 
It amazes me that every other law enforcement agency needs either a search warrant or probable cause to enter private property, yet GF&P doesn't think it has to abide by the same laws that the real law enforcement agencies do. Is it because shooting too many deer or using the wrong tag is so much more dangerous to the public than apprehending murderers and busting meth labs?

Landowners and hunters are presumed by GF&P to be guilty of breaking the law just because they, in the case of hunters, are walking out in my pasture, wearing orange and carrying a rifle during hunting season. Landowners are assumed to be breaking law simply because we have "large parcels of land" according to our governor. Because GF&P can't see every inch of these "large parcels of land", they take it for granted that the private landowner is doing all sorts of lawless activity and must be stopped, irregardless of the Fourth Amendment.

Our legal system was founded on the premise that we are innocent until proven to be guilty. Why should GF&P be allowed to trample on that principle? Hitler had his brown shirted thugs too, and they also trashed property rights with impunity. The parallel between GF&P and Hitler's Brown Shirts in both dress and actions is becoming increasingly more disturbing.
 
SJ: "Just tell me SH how do they determine someone is actively hunting or is it that during hunting season CO's can stop anyone?"

Ahhhhhh????????


Three possible answers............

1. A man in a cowboy hat is seen with a 4-wheeler pulling a trailer full of fencing supplies along a fence. Ocassionally he stops along the fence and uses a post mall to drive a steel post in the ground.

2. It is hunting season and a person is spotted walking along a brushy draw with a gun in his hand wearing a blaze orange vest following the sound of gun shots. A shiny new Suburban is spotted on top of the hill above him.

3. A ranch couple is seen in a familiar old 4 wheel drive pickup moving cattle through a gate.


Hum along to the jeoprody song as SJ determines which of the preceeding senerios would be considered hunting ............................

do DO do do do DO do.....do DO do DO DO do do do do do do



SJ: "Can they only make these determinations from public land and roads?"

Where could you make that determination from?



SJ: "Tell me how curtilage is determined?"

Do your own research on curtilage.



~SH~
 
If you can't answer them, just say you can't answer them Scott.

What are you going to be when you grow up?
 

Latest posts

Top