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The right to know at what cost

Do consumers have a right to know where exactly?

  • Yes, and the beef industry should flip the bill

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Yes, the government should flip the bill

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Yes, if the consumers pay for it

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • No all they need to know is what country it originated

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    0

bse-tester

Well-known member
Tam wrote to Econ:

Gee are you not sticking your nose into Canadian business here Econ keep you input to YOURSELF.

I thought this board was for all to play an active role on and now it appears that the censor has arrived with a big stick
 

Murgen

Well-known member
I have said on more than one occasion if Canada does indeed produce good fat cattle they will be bought in the U.S. If your product is good, why aren't you proud of it?

It's labelled when it crosses the border, big Canadian flag attached!

What you have to become comfortable with is that you do no produce enough product to meet consumption.

How that effects the markets, has little to do with us! US companys are buying the product they can make a profit on selling. Maybe the US has to start building more cattle producing land etc.!

Quite riding on our shirt-tails, just cause we have the land and resources does not mean that you have to buy our raw products and turn a profit on them.
 

bse-tester

Well-known member
A meat packer in Cardiff, in Wales, UK, told Dr. Bob Church, according to Church himself, that when asked about labeling a meat product, "...we have all kinds of labels we can attach to the product, which kind would you like??"

Dr. Bob Church was one of the guys who came up with the idea known as "President's Choice." He was over there visiting and the plant told him that labeling was basically a game (not a quote) and that any label could be attached to the product so what the heck anyway!! Pick one!!!"

The average consumer when purchaing meat at the their local supermarket will look at the price, the color and the size of the steak!! The only part of the label that interests them is the price!! Get real with the lalbeling and relize that in the intrantional world, country of origin will likely become a world fact. BSE Tested may well be included and even BSE Free might even be adopted - so what!! Whatever it takes to enhance the market and no amount of whining on this board will do anything to change that fact!!

The bottom line is simple - you either want to sell your product or you don't. Which is it!! Get with the program or keep on whining about the sky falling??? Packers can and do put whatever labels on the product that make it look more desirable to the consumer and if that is what it takes to sell the product, that is what they do. How many "B Grade Steaks" have been tagged as Grade "A" beef. None you say??? The Packers wouldn't do that you say???? Wake up people!!! They do it each and every day!!!

Whatever it takes to sell their beef is what they will do and who is to say that the finished product coming out of their plants is Grade "A" or "B" when it is frozen and boxed. The difference is so slight that it generally goes unnoticed by the consumer, but the price the packer gets paid for the difference in cuts is staggering over the course of the plant's life.
 

Tam

Well-known member
Oldtimer said:
Tam said:
Econ101 said:
Tam, MCOOL in the U.S. is a domestic issue, not one for you to have any input on.
Will you not be labeling some imported beef by default with your faulty M'COOL labeling?
And Please Tell us, why Canadians don't have a right to speak about M'COOL but you can stick you nose into every facet of our industry Econ. :roll:

Nobody holding a gun to your head and saying you have to ship it to the US :roll: -- Lots of other countries you could ship to if you don't like the US's rules...Thats what Canadians told us down here for 10+ years about the Anaplas/Bluetongue rule.....
Oldtimer Canada had some high standards when it came to Anna and Blue but guess what, they were not lowered they were DROPPED to accommedate the US producers that wanted to ship cattle into Canada. They were our rules if you wanted to ship here why shouldn't you have had to follow our rules? Who was holding the guns to the heads of the US producers. why didn't they just ship their cattle to another country if they didn't like our rules, there are lots of other countries in the world. It's funny how US importers are expected to FOLLOW your rules but US exporters don't have to follow the rules of the country they are exporting to. :roll: Rules change to accommedate the US beef industry all the time Japans testing, Canada's anna and blue testing , the OIE catagories on risk, you name it rules change, to bad we all seem to be lowering ours so yours don't look so bad. :wink:
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Tam said:
Oldtimer said:
Tam said:
Will you not be labeling some imported beef by default with your faulty M'COOL labeling?
And Please Tell us, why Canadians don't have a right to speak about M'COOL but you can stick you nose into every facet of our industry Econ. :roll:

Nobody holding a gun to your head and saying you have to ship it to the US :roll: -- Lots of other countries you could ship to if you don't like the US's rules...Thats what Canadians told us down here for 10+ years about the Anaplas/Bluetongue rule.....
Oldtimer Canada had some high standards when it came to Anna and Blue but guess what, they were not lowered they were DROPPED to accommedate the US producers that wanted to ship cattle into Canada. They were our rules if you wanted to ship here why shouldn't you have had to follow our rules? Who was holding the guns to the heads of the US producers. why didn't they just ship their cattle to another country if they didn't like our rules, there are lots of other countries in the world. It's funny how US importers are expected to FOLLOW your rules but US exporters don't have to follow the rules of the country they are exporting to. :roll: Rules change to accommedate the US beef industry all the time Japans testing, Canada's anna and blue testing , the OIE catagories on risk, you name it rules change, to bad we all seem to be lowering ours so yours don't look so bad. :wink:

Only one reason the Annaplas/Bluetongue barrier is even being discussed or thought of being dropped now by the Canadians--because Canadas hind end is up a creek without a paddle and you think you have to kiss the US's rear end to get it open--ONLY REASON...Same facts as 10 years ago are there- same facts that said 10 years ago that, as implemented, it was only a trade barrier--but Canada still kept it in place...You are dropping them only to hope to get US producer support so you can start to again ride the US producers shirtails--But like I said its your country do what you want to- but don't tell the US what we have or have not to do...

Same reason we should be able to put whatever rules we want to on cattle/beef coming in from Canada (precedent set by Canada)- require any labels we believe necessary to provide/allow the US or foreign consumers an informed and safe choice--and I surely think 11 years after the birthdate of the last BSE positive is not unreasonable for live cattle and breeding stock , especially since this is the new OIE recognized figure for being essentially BSE free...

NAFTA says we have to trade with Canada- but it didn't give Canadians a right to vote and make the decisions on how the US should be run-Thank God :roll: Or are you one of those border crossers that pack cards for both countries and pick out the loyalty of the day :wink:
 

Econ101

Well-known member
Globalization proponents want countries to cede their responsibilities to their citizens to some "world order". The Japanese citizens have said "no" to this approach when it comes to bse.

What does it profit a country to be responsible to their citizens in the area of food safety if their decisions are trumped by some "world order" set up by the globalists?
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
You are right bse tester, Country of Origin could very well be the thing of the future BUT NOT WITHOUT "M"ID TO ENFORCE IT.

These "M"COOL proponents do not want "M"ID! You can't have one without the other. You can't trace beef without tracing cattle. That's what you get when you have emotionally driven legislation drawn up by emotionally driven R-CALFers who are unwilling to face the consequences of their short sighted actions.


~SH~
 

Econ101

Well-known member
~SH~ said:
You are right bse tester, Country of Origin could very well be the thing of the future BUT NOT WITHOUT "M"ID TO ENFORCE IT.

These "M"COOL proponents do not want "M"ID! You can't have one without the other. You can't trace beef without tracing cattle. That's what you get when you have emotionally driven legislation drawn up by emotionally driven R-CALFers who are unwilling to face the consequences of their short sighted actions.


~SH~

Are you saying that we can't say where cattle have come from if we don't have MID? Perhaps we shouldn't accept any imports without every bit of it being MIDed? How does that go over with your lean trimmings? Are all of those traced back?

If the U.S. can't tell what country beef is coming from when it is imported, we don't need to import it. Period.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Conman,

I thought you said you weren't going to respond to any more of my posts due to my stupidity???

Here it is only one day later and you are back to living a lie again. What a phony you are.


Conman: "Are you saying that we can't say where cattle have come from if we don't have MID?"

You can't PROVE where BEEF comes from without a traceback system.

Nice deceptive spinjob!


Conman: "Perhaps we shouldn't accept any imports without every bit of it being MIDed?"

I'll let the consumers decide that rather than a lying conspiracy theorist like you.


Conman: "How does that go over with your lean trimmings? Are all of those traced back?"

Food service was exempted from Country of Origin labeling due to the difficulties AND RELEVANCE of tracing blended, imported, lean ground trimmings.


Conman: "If the U.S. can't tell what country beef is coming from when it is imported, we don't need to import it. Period."

The consumers will decide that, not some lying conspiracy theorist like you.


~SH~
 

Econ101

Well-known member
No choice, no competition.

I was shopping with my daughter today and went by the food aisle to look at the meat case. There were chickens there but only from Tyson.

No choice, no competition.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
NO CHOICE?????

Consumers have hundreds of source verified beef products they can buy.

If consumers want source verified beef, THEY CAN BUY IT! They might have to make an effort to find it if it's not in their local store but it's available.

You blamers are so lost.



~SH~
 

Econ101

Well-known member
~SH~ said:
NO CHOICE?????

Consumers have hundreds of source verified beef products they can buy.

If consumers want source verified beef, THEY CAN BUY IT! They might have to make an effort to find it if it's not in their local store but it's available.

You blamers are so lost.



~SH~

SH, I was at a sugar plant some time ago. They had bags from Domino, Diamond Falls, and several others that they bagged for.

Can you tell me what kind of choice the consumer had?
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
~SH~ said:
NO CHOICE?????

Consumers have hundreds of source verified beef products they can buy.

If consumers want source verified beef, THEY CAN BUY IT! They might have to make an effort to find it if it's not in their local store but it's available.





~SH~

How big an effort should consumers have to make--Travel 150-300 miles, air freight, :???: Or should just those in the populated areas have a choice of what country their meat comes from?....
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
OT,

SOURCE VERIFIED STEAKS CAN BE PACKAGED AND SENT TO ANYONE'S DOOR.

DELIVERED TO YOUR DOOR!

Consumers have tons of choices!

You guys act like you live in a third world country.....Jordon??? hmmmm??? LOL!



~SH~
 

Econ101

Well-known member
~SH~ said:
OT,

SOURCE VERIFIED STEAKS CAN BE PACKAGED AND SENT TO ANYONE'S DOOR.

DELIVERED TO YOUR DOOR!

Consumers have tons of choices!

You guys act like you live in a third world country.....Jordon??? hmmmm??? LOL!



~SH~

So why are you calling for manditory ID? Do you have a problem with packers or importers having the competence to label meat from across the border as such?
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Conman: "So why are you calling for manditory ID? Do you have a problem with packers or importers having the competence to label meat from across the border as such?"

I'm not calling for "M"ID you damn liar. I'm simply stating that you cannot have an enforceable country of origin mandate without "M"ID.

You packer blamers are the ones who don't trust packers to label beef to it's country of origin yet you want a labeling law that does not have the means necessary to insure that packers do just that.

A typical blamer's contradiction!


~SH~
 

Econ101

Well-known member
~SH~ said:
Conman: "So why are you calling for manditory ID? Do you have a problem with packers or importers having the competence to label meat from across the border as such?"

I'm not calling for "M"ID you damn liar. I'm simply stating that you cannot have an enforceable country of origin mandate without "M"ID.

You packer blamers are the ones who don't trust packers to label beef to it's country of origin yet you want a labeling law that does not have the means necessary to insure that packers do just that.

A typical blamer's contradiction!


~SH~

If you can't have an enforcable labeling law from stuff that enters the border, maybe the borders need to be closed. If the USDA and packers can't tell the difference between roast beef and turkey, they don't have the competence to ship edible products or be in charge of recieving them at the border.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
If the packer is as untrustworthy as you say they are, why would you trust them to label beef to it's country of origin honestly?

There's never any consistancy in an emotional blamer's arguments. They contradict themselves continually because they operate on emotion, not fact or reason.



~SH~
 

Econ101

Well-known member
~SH~ said:
If the packer is as untrustworthy as you say they are, why would you trust them to label beef to it's country of origin honestly?

There's never any consistancy in an emotional blamer's arguments. They contradict themselves continually because they operate on emotion, not fact or reason.



~SH~

I don't. That is why I recommended a system that could be enforced on them as you pointed out. That would be a system that gave enforcement a few tools instead of excuses.
 

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