• If you are having problems logging in please use the Contact Us in the lower right hand corner of the forum page for assistance.

vote on Turkish Genocide

Sandhusker

Well-known member
HR 106: How Did They Vote?
The House Foreign Affairs Committee voted 27-21 to pass the non-binding House Resolution 106 to be put to the full House for a vote . . .

Here's how they voted:

There are 27 Democrats, and 23 Republicans on the committee.

19 Democrats and 8 Republicans voted for the measure.
8 Democrats and 13 Republicans voted against the measure.
2 Republicans did not vote.
The vote was 27-21 for the measure.


Voting for the measure: 27 (19 Democrats, 8 Republicans)

Tom Lantos (D-CA), Chairman,
Gary Ackerman (D-NY),
Howard Berman (D-CA),
Jim Costa (D-CA),
Joseph Crowley (D-NY),
William Delahunt (D-MA),
Eliot Engel (D-NY),
Eni F. H. Faleomavaega (D-SM*),
Gabrielle Giffords (D-AZ),
Gene Green (D-TX),
Sheila Jackson Lee (D-TX),
Ron Klein (D-FL),
Donald Payne (D-NJ),
Linda Sanchez (D-CA),
Brad Sherman (D-CA),
Albio Sires (D-NJ),
Diane Watson (D-CA),
Lynn Woolsey (D-CA),
David Wu (D-OR),

Gus Bilirakis (R-FL),
Steve Chabot (R-OH),
Elton Gallegly (R-CA),
Donald Manzullo (R-IL),
Michael McCaul (R-TX),
Dana Rohrabacher (R-CA),
Edward Royce (R-CA),
Christopher Smith (R-NJ),


Voting against the measure: 21 (8 Democrats, 13 Republicans)

Russ Carnahan (D-MO),
Ruben Hinojosa (D-TX),
Gregory Meeks (D-NY),
Brad Miller (D-NC),
David Scott (D-GA),
Adam Smith (D-WA),
John Tanner (D-TN),
Robert Wexler (D-FL).

Gresham Barrett (R-SC),
Roy Blunt (R-MO),
John Boozman (R-AR),
Dan Burton (R-IN),
Jeff Flake (R-AZ),
Jeff Fortenberry (R-NE),
Luis Fortuno (R-PR),
Bob Inglis (R-SC),
Connie Mack (R-FL)
Mike Pence (R-IN),
Ted Poe (R-TX),
Illeana Ros-Lehtinen (R-FL),
Thomas Tancredo (R-CO), Currently running for President of the US,


Did not vote:

Ron Paul (R-TX) Currently running for President of the United States (Libertarian),
Joe Wilson (R-SC)
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
The Congressional Caucus on Armenian issues has 156 House members-- one of the largest in Congress- huge in comparison to the size of the country and # of people represented- while they were saying on TV tonight, the Turkish Caucus has less than 40 members....

Looks like I was right-- the Armenians in the US are putting up big bucks to get a 156 member Caucus :wink: :lol:

http://www.armenpac.org/110thCongressionalCaucus.pdf
 

Ben H

Well-known member
First of all it was the Ottoman Empire that killed the Armenians, Do you still call Italy the Roman Empire, or Russia the Soviet Union?

Second, the Armenians in the US aren't pushings for this.

Third, this is treason. The only reason they are trying to get this 100 year old issue voted on now is to piss on the face of one of our allies in a hot region of the world on the brink of islamic extremism. Doing this will likely cause Turkey to cut us off. 70% of our supplies for the military go through Turkey or through their airspace.

This is the Socialist's, who call themselves Progressive Democrats, way of ending the war in defeat so that they can be right in saying it's lost when we are clearly gaining ground.
 

Red Robin

Well-known member
Oldtimer your man ron paul couldn't find the time or courage to vote?

Vote these traitors our of office.
Voting for the measure: 27 (19 Democrats, 8 Republicans)

Tom Lantos (D-CA), Chairman,
Gary Ackerman (D-NY),
Howard Berman (D-CA),
Jim Costa (D-CA),
Joseph Crowley (D-NY),
William Delahunt (D-MA),
Eliot Engel (D-NY),
Eni F. H. Faleomavaega (D-SM*),
Gabrielle Giffords (D-AZ),
Gene Green (D-TX),
Sheila Jackson Lee (D-TX),
Ron Klein (D-FL),
Donald Payne (D-NJ),
Linda Sanchez (D-CA),
Brad Sherman (D-CA),
Albio Sires (D-NJ),
Diane Watson (D-CA),
Lynn Woolsey (D-CA),
David Wu (D-OR),

Gus Bilirakis (R-FL),
Steve Chabot (R-OH),
Elton Gallegly (R-CA),
Donald Manzullo (R-IL),
Michael McCaul (R-TX),
Dana Rohrabacher (R-CA),
Edward Royce (R-CA),
Christopher Smith (R-NJ),
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Ben H said:
First of all it was the Ottoman Empire that killed the Armenians, Do you still call Italy the Roman Empire, or Russia the Soviet Union?

Second, the Armenians in the US aren't pushings for this.

Third, this is treason. The only reason they are trying to get this 100 year old issue voted on now is to p*** on the face of one of our allies in a hot region of the world on the brink of islamic extremism. Doing this will likely cause Turkey to cut us off. 70% of our supplies for the military go through Turkey or through their airspace.

This is the Socialist's, who call themselves Progressive Democrats, way of ending the war in defeat so that they can be right in saying it's lost when we are clearly gaining ground.

Sure doesn't look to me like those were all what you call "Progressive Democrats" that voted for it-- or that were one of the 156 members of the Armenian American Caucus..... I have a hard time putting GW in any label called "progressive" and as you remember passing this was one of his campaign promises...... :wink: :lol:

Nope Lou Dobbs has it figured out pretty good-- a totally dysfunctional government (D's & R's) that is so sold out to the corporate world that they no longer function to do anything for the the good of the people-- like guaranteeing our food safety- or working to better a failing economy....They're at the stage that all they can do is throw piss balloons at each other in the opposing party, because then they don't have to make a decision to upset any benefacor...
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Pelosi apparently said today that she's not going to push this Resolution. Maybe it was just a little reminder to the Bush Administration that there's a new Congress in town. :wink:

"WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Citing the militarily strategic importance of Turkey for U.S. foreign policy, five House Democrats on Wednesday underscored their strong opposition to the House resolution that labels the mass killings of Armenians during World War I as a "genocide."

Reps. John Murtha of Pennsylvania, Alcee Hastings and Robert Wexler of Florida and John Tanner and Steve Cohen of Tennessee urged House Democratic leadership to stop the resolution, which passed the House Foreign Affairs Committee last week and is slated to go to the House floor for a vote.

The Bush administration, military commanders, and former government officials have opposed the resolution, citing the importance of Turkey as a military resupply hub and their belief that passage of the resolution could hurt the U.S.-Turkey relationship. One fear is that the Turks would pull the plug on Incirlik Air Base in southern Turkey, a scenario the military is planning for.

Democrats are now emerging to reassess the wisdom of voting for a non-binding symbolic measure for moral reasons when national security issues are at stake. (Posted 12:32 p.m.)"

http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/europe/10/17/wednesday/index.html
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
"The House majority leader is signaling that a full House vote on the nonbinding Armenian "genocide" resolution could be put off as Democratic lawmakers rethink their stances on a tragic historical conflict that still touches raw nerves among Turks and Armenians.

At the urging of top Bush administration officials and some leading Democrats, House Majority Leader Steny Hoyer is hedging on his pledge to bring the Armenian genocide resolution to the House floor for a vote before the House breaks for the holidays.

"I said I thought we would bring this up prior to us leaving here," Hoyer, D-Md, said Tuesday. "I have not changed on that, although I would be less than candid to say that there are a number of people who are revisiting their own positions. We will have to determine where everybody is."

Last week, the House Foreign Affairs Committee adopted the non-binding resolution by a 27 to 21 vote formally identifying the killings of an estimated 1.5 million Armenians by the Ottoman Empire -- the predecessor of modern Turkey -- as "genocide." Turkish officials acknowledge the killings of Armenians during World War I but vehemently object to the designation of "genocide." (Posted 9:13 a.m.)"

http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/europe/10/17/wednesday/index.html
 

Goodpasture

Well-known member
What I find absolutely amazing is that people today dismiss the Turkish empire as just an event of history. It is the Turkish living and breathing heritage that they take more pride in than Americans do over the Declaration of Independence. Attaturk (whose picture is on their money) is revered more than George Washington is here or the Queen is in Canada and the UK. In Istanbul you can be arrested if you slap the paper money on a counter to pay for something. Because Attaturks picture is on it, slapping it down is considered disrespect and WILL get you arrested. To claim that the Turkish Empire practiced genocide is as strong an insult to the Turks as can be done. I really wish those politicians could spend a few weeks on the street with the people of the countries they are trying to pass resolutions about. The Turkish people are warm, friendly, hospitable, tolerant of others, and one of the proudest people in the world.

What is going to blow up in our faces in the VERY near future is our failure to contain the Iraqi Kurds. Just like Iran is staging incursions into Iraq, the Iraqi Kurds are staging incursions into Turkey with the avowed purpose of producing a Kurdish state. Watch and see if Turkey absorbs northern Iraq (along with their oil) and see what our government does to one of our only middle eastern allies and a member (they are soon to be or just became a member) of the European Union.
 

Ben H

Well-known member
I didn't read everything in full, but in case someone missed it, the Turkish Army has been granted Parlimentary Permission to invade Northern Iraq to fight the Kurds. They've already been shelling them and already have some troops inside Iraq. It will be interesting to see where this goes.

Maybe we should allow Kurdistan to become a nation as we did Israel after WWII, got to let these people have a state. Then we can have one more country to protect and have the rest of the middle east hate us for.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Tonight on the O'Reilly Factor they were discussing all this Turkey-Kurd problems-- and I heard Bill O'Reilly say something I never thought I'd hear him say--that he wished we had never done an invasion of Iraq- and that it was a "mistake".... :shock: :shock:
 

aplusmnt

Well-known member
ff said:
Pelosi apparently said today that she's not going to push this Resolution. Maybe it was just a little reminder to the Bush Administration that there's a new Congress in town. :wink:

She found out that even her Democratic brethren were not going to support her in it. I think the rest of the Dems are starting to realize Pelosi was a mistake. She is going to cost them the majority in congress. At least I hope so, especially if OT is right and Hillary is the next president.

Hillary as president and Obama as vice with Pelosi as 3rd in line. Talk about confusing anyone thinking of assassination. Would be hard to figure out if it would be wise or not.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Goodpasture said:
So now, Bill is a traitor? :shock: Can it be? Is Rush next??????? :shock:

I think you may be hearing a greater outcry from the public about how this war was/is run--and the effects the dragging it out into a quagmire is having ...I just saw in the paper yesterday that another "leaked" pentagon source had said that 8 more Brigades of National Guard had been notifed of callup for deployment to Iraq after the first of the year....

The war remains impersonal to many-- until its the group from your state or town, your nephew or employee, your church member or coworker thats being called up and put in harms way.....I can't see where this will help the Repub's during the next year...

If I remember right one of the units that the "leaker" mentioned was from Oklahoma- and one from Alabama.......Some were repeat units and some were first timers....About 30,000 troops in all......
 

aplusmnt

Well-known member
Oldtimer said:
Tonight on the O'Reilly Factor they were discussing all this Turkey-Kurd problems-- and I heard Bill O'Reilly say something I never thought I'd hear him say--that he wished we had never done an invasion of Iraq- and that it was a "mistake".... :shock: :shock:

He also said that we need to support the troops and win now since we did go there.

The conversation of rather we should have went in the first place is old and really needs no more further conversation. Bush is the only one to be held accountable for going in and his term is almost over and he can no longer run for public office. The republican Congress can not be held accountable for voting to go into Iraq because then you would also have to hold the Democrats accountable.

Now the question is should we stay and win or quit and loose? We are done fighting with the Iraq army and Saddam so do we stay and fight terrorist. Do we stay and help rebuild a country that so many of you believe we should not have went into in the first place.

I find it funny that you anti war people will say we should not have went into Iraq in the first place out of one side of your mouth, and then out of the other side say we should pull out. If we made a mistake and should have never went there in the first place then we have a moral responsibility to stay and make Iraq whole again. We should stay until we have exasperated all options for return them to the stability they had before our invasion.

And with reports showing things are getting better, then we for sure have a responsibility to continue to return these people to the condition we left them in. We should rebuild every school, every home, every hospital. If we should not have went in first place then we made one of the worse catastrophes in history and we owe these people.

It is funny that if we should have never went to Iraq in the first place then we should stay longer than if the invasion was justified.

Libs do not want to talk about moral responsibility to right the wrong they believe we committed with our invasion. They want to say whoops we made a mistake now you people deal with the anarchy caused by our blunder! How unmoral is that?
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
He also said that we need to support the troops and win now since we did go there.

You are correct-- he did say that too....And I totally agree we need to give our fullest support to the troops- a hell of a lot more then the Administration is now with their everyday changing rules of engagement-and extension of tours/enlistments and filing charges against every troop that some raghead complains about...Problem that exists are these are military troops-- not policemen-- and they shouldn't have to be judged on a policemans rules of engagement...


Now the question is should we stay and win or quit and loose? We are done fighting with the Iraq army and Saddam so do we stay and fight terrorist. Do we stay and help rebuild a country that so many of you believe we should not have went into in the first place.

My first question is-- with the way we are going can we win? And win what? And win for who? Many of the good people that could (including many of the elected officials) have fled the country... We've now heard from 7 NCO's (2 of which gave their lives for their country) and 12 Captains (that for some reason gave up a military career) that say they believe it is unwinnable with the manpower available and the direction we keep heading....This is 5 years into this "war"...What does it take to show that the troops on the ground are more and more frustrated & tired of the "war"-- maybe this is the reason that Ron Paul, the only Republican that says "Get Out" is receiving 50% of the campaign money coming in from military people... :???:
And both groups say (and what all returning veterans have told me) that no matter what we do it will break out in full civil war once we leave--whether now or 5-10 more years from now....You don't change 1000 years of tribal/religious conflict in 5 years or maybe even 5 generations...

Then we have the other 6 billion dollar question-- How do we know when we've won?
 

Ben H

Well-known member
I've been there, done that, seen Iraq up close and personal. First let me say that before going over there, I probably had to do maybe 10 hours of culture and language classes as part of the pre-mob. The Army teaches the moderate perspective and how we're fighting extremists. Knowing what I know now about what the Koran actually says, I believe the GWOT will finally end when one of two things happens. There is no longer an Islam, or the world prays to Allah 5 times a day. I have to give credit to guys like Glenn Beck who bring up the point that you don't hear an outcry from the Moderates, you may hear a couple, but as a percentage of the religion it doesn't amount to squat. Are these people in fear or do they not denounce the actions of what we label as extremists. I don't call them extremists, I feel they are only doing what the Koran tells them to. It is every Muslim's duty to see to it that Sharia law is implemented because Allah's law is above Man's law.

Maybe this isn't a good comparison, maybe it is. Who gets Kit Pharro's newsletter, he has no problem talking about religion. His opinion that upsets some is he doesn't like the denomination churches that tweak what the bible says to fit their lifestyle. He promotes finding a church where people bring there own bibles and go by the bible. I can relate to this as a Lutheran, Martin Luther wrote the Bible in German so everyone could read it for themselves. Now there is acceptance to same sex relationships, I feel this is bending things to fit your lifestyle and make the religion more palatable to more people, where does it end. Before I go too far off, the comparison is you have people who bend things to make it fit better into modern society, with people who try to follow the Bible as it is written and not bend things to fit their lifestyle, rather change their lifestyle to one of God's intent, do you call them Extremists?
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Oldtimer said:
Goodpasture said:
So now, Bill is a traitor? :shock: Can it be? Is Rush next??????? :shock:

I think you may be hearing a greater outcry from the public about how this war was/is run--and the effects the dragging it out into a quagmire is having ...I just saw in the paper yesterday that another "leaked" pentagon source had said that 8 more Brigades of National Guard had been notifed of callup for deployment to Iraq after the first of the year....

The war remains impersonal to many-- until its the group from your state or town, your nephew or employee, your church member or coworker thats being called up and put in harms way.....I can't see where this will help the Repub's during the next year...

If I remember right one of the units that the "leaker" mentioned was from Oklahoma- and one from Alabama.......Some were repeat units and some were first timers....About 30,000 troops in all......

"The Washington National Guard’s 81st Brigade Combat Team has been put on notice for another possible deployment to either Iraq or Afghanistan, The News Tribune has learned.
Senior leaders in the brigade and Washington Guard were notified Thursday by e-mail that Secretary of Defense Robert Gates had signed an order placing the brigade on alert. Official orders will likely follow today.

Brigade commanders have been directed to notify their soldiers by 9 a.m. today.

The alert does not necessarily mean that the brigade, which spent a year in Iraq in 2004-05, will be deployed again, the message states.

“This is an alert message only,” according to the note by Lt. Col. Andy Leneweaver, the Washington Guard’s plans, training and mobilization officer.

The message written to Washington Guard and 81st brigade leaders was obtained by the newspaper.

“The 81st HBCT has been alerted for potential mobilization and deployment in support of the Global War on Terrorism. Upon final determination of the need for the 81st HBCT, (Army headquarters) may publish a mobilization order, which will contain the mobilization date and the designated mobilization station.”

The message says it “is not to be released to the news media” and directs all media inquiries to the Washington Guard’s public affairs office.

Those officials at Camp Murray, south of Tacoma, couldn’t be reached Thursday evening.

Most of the brigade’s 3,500 soldiers operated in Baghdad and in Balad during the last deployment.

The brigade’s primary missions were to provide security at the big U.S. logistics base called Anaconda, in Balad, and at forward operating bases in the Iraqi capital.

The alert order follows reports out of the Pentagon on Wednesday that U.S. military officials would soon notify eight National Guard brigades that they’ll be needed over the next couple of years – seven brigades for duty in Iraq, and one in Afghanistan.

The move is intended to maintain troops levels, ease some of the strain on the active duty Army, and provide security for ports, convoys and other installations.

Soldiers from the 56th Stryker Brigade Combat Team in the Pennsylvania National Guard received a similar order Thursday, news media there reported.

In the Washington alert, commanders were instructed to tell their soldiers not to make immediate changes in their personal lives.

“Soldiers will not terminate rental contracts, employment, schooling or any other event currently on-going in their personal life during this alert phase,” the message said.

“This alert may or may not transpire into a mobilization.”

Michael Gilbert: 253-597-8921

[email protected]"

http://www.thenewstribune.com/front/topstories/story/182731.html
 
Top