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What's Stopping Illegals From Voting?

Mike

Well-known member
Not much, it seems......................Especially not Democrats!!!!
As more states begin providing illegal immigrants and their children with driver's licenses and ID cards, officials are concerned some also are registering to vote -- some by mistake, and others on purpose.

The problem came to light recently in North Carolina, which compared its voter rolls against a federal immigration database. The cross-check of 10,000 voters found 1,425 likely non-citizen voters, including 109 illegal immigrants or so-called "Dreamers." Almost 10 percent registered to vote when getting their driver's license. But election officials say the problem is nationwide.

"In terms of a check and balance that would prevent an individual who is a non U.S. citizen from registering to vote, that doesn't exist. There's absolutely nothing stopping them," said Neal Kelley, Orange County registrar of voters and chairman of the California Association of Election Officials.

The problem, officials say, dates back to the 1993 federal Motor Voter Act, which requires states to offer residents the ability to register to vote when they obtain a driver's license or ID card. In some states, the driver's license and voter registration application are on the same form, and the applicant simply signs. In small print, the form says applicants acknowledge they are U.S. citizens. In other states, voter registration is a separate form and applicants check a box. In either case, once signed, the forms are automatically sent to the county or state registrar of voters, and the name is added to voter rolls.

State DMV officials are not required to authenticate citizenship.

"They're asked to check a box that they're a U.S. citizen, but that's not good enough," said Kris Kobach, Kansas secretary of state. "We have so many aliens on our voter rolls who check that box -- either because they're trying to break the law or because they didn't know exactly what they were doing."

There are two ways to eliminate or slow the problem. While only U.S. citizens can vote, only four states require proof before registering: Kansas, Arizona, Georgia and Alabama. States can also compare voter rolls to a federal immigration database known as SAVE, or the Systemic Alien Verification System for Entitlements. Four states tried, but the ACLU and others sued, stopping Virginia, Iowa and Florida from purging voter rolls of non-citizens.

"We want the public to understand that people are not being proactive in dealing with this massive problem," said Jay DeLancy, director of the North Carolina Voter Integrity Project. "Any state that has DACA licenses, any state that offers any sort of driver's licenses to people who are not citizens has the problem."

The ACLU claims the federal immigration database isn't perfect and could disenfranchise voters.

Under the National Voter Registration Act, states are required to remove from their registration lists ineligible voters. But U.S. Attorney General Eric Holder refuses to enforce the statute. Not a single such lawsuit has been filed since the beginning of the Obama administration, according to author John Fund.

"This is such a huge problem," Kobach said. "And once the aliens get on the voter rolls, solutions don't solve the problem. If you want to work with the federal government, they’re going to make you jump through a whole bunch of hoops."

Use of the SAVE database, while not perfect, isn't cheap. Each name cross checked costs a state or county 50 cents.

In Maryland, a voter integrity group obtained a list of residents who were removed from jury duty because they were non-citizens. Among them, 509 were also registered to vote. The group, Virginia Voters Alliance, claims up to 7 percent of Maryland's registered voters could be non-citizens.

"Yes that can occur," said Kelley. "Whether they're a felon on parole or a non-U.S. citizen or somebody else who may be ineligible to register to vote, they can end up on the rolls."
 

Steve

Well-known member
It is pretty much an honor system...

and considering the illegal already broke the law coming here... why would they break a law to vote as well?
 

Steve

Well-known member
littlejoe said:
unlike you mikey mosta them can reads sos it's pwobry something elsie

funny... (not really )

but.. in the first page... of the voter guide...

it says... "for US Citizens"..

http://www.eac.gov/assets/1/Documents/Federal%20Voter%20Registration_1209_en8242012.pdf

then in the first paragraph..
Who Can Use this Application
If you are a U.S. citizen who lives or has an address
within the United States, you can use the application in
this booklet to:
Register to vote

seems like the instructions are fairly clear fro a person who can read ....

and then on the application itself..

[/quote]I have reviewed my state's instructions and I swear/affirm that:
I am a United States citizen
so if a person votes.. and didn't read the form.. then what excuse do they have?
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Steve said:
littlejoe said:
unlike you mikey mosta them can reads sos it's pwobry something elsie

funny... (not really )

but.. in the first page... of the voter guide...

it says... "for US Citizens"..

http://www.eac.gov/assets/1/Documents/Federal%20Voter%20Registration_1209_en8242012.pdf

then in the first paragraph..
Who Can Use this Application
If you are a U.S. citizen who lives or has an address
within the United States, you can use the application in
this booklet to:
Register to vote

seems like the instructions are fairly clear fro a person who can read ....

and then on the application itself..
I have reviewed my state's instructions and I swear/affirm that:
I am a United States citizen
so if a person votes.. and didn't read the form.. then what excuse do they have?
[/quote][/quote]

Steve- what suggestion do you have ?

I have no problem with requiring ID to vote BUT will that fix the problem?Most illegals already have fake ID when they enter the country or within a few days.... $1000 gets them an ID that is indistinguishable from real identification documents...

Are you promoting the mandatory REAL ID proposal for everyone? The one that gives true Constitution backers and Libertarians the vision of Gestapo standing at the train station saying "Papiere bitte"...

As a freedom loving Libertarian the thought of having to pack ID with you all the time makes me cringe.... The ex-Cop in me says "what a wonderful idea- no more trying to figure out who someone is- they can sit in jail until identified....
Bad enough its required thru the Patriot Act - have we progressed to the point that it now will be a new alltime requirement.... :???:

BUT I always remember what one Agent told me one time- everything made by man can be counterfeited- and every security plan made by/designed by man can be breached and trespassed upon...
 

S.S.A.P.

Well-known member
Oldtimer said:
I have no problem with requiring ID to vote BUT will that fix the problem?Most illegals already have fake ID when they enter the country or within a few days.... $1000 gets them an ID that is indistinguishable from real identification documents...

Are you promoting the mandatory REAL ID proposal for everyone? The one that gives true Constitution backers and Libertarians the vision of Gestapo standing at the train station saying "Papiere bitte"...

As a freedom loving Libertarian the thought of having to pack ID with you all the time makes me cringe.... The ex-Cop in me says "what a wonderful idea- no more trying to figure out who someone is- they can sit in jail until identified....
Bad enough its required thru the Patriot Act - have we progressed to the point that it now will be a new alltime requirement.... :???:

BUT I always remember what one Agent told me one time- everything made by man can be counterfeited- and every security plan made by/designed by man can be breached and trespassed upon...

Sorry to divert from the topic at hand but I was lmao at Oldtimer's above post. His passion for proof of identity/documentation for raw meat is of so much more value to the USA than undocumented/illegal voters.

Gestapo (aka Oldtimer) talking to the meat packaged in the display counter saying "COOL Papiere bitte"
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
S.S.A.P. said:
Oldtimer said:
I have no problem with requiring ID to vote BUT will that fix the problem?Most illegals already have fake ID when they enter the country or within a few days.... $1000 gets them an ID that is indistinguishable from real identification documents...

Are you promoting the mandatory REAL ID proposal for everyone? The one that gives true Constitution backers and Libertarians the vision of Gestapo standing at the train station saying "Papiere bitte"...

As a freedom loving Libertarian the thought of having to pack ID with you all the time makes me cringe.... The ex-Cop in me says "what a wonderful idea- no more trying to figure out who someone is- they can sit in jail until identified....
Bad enough its required thru the Patriot Act - have we progressed to the point that it now will be a new alltime requirement.... :???:

BUT I always remember what one Agent told me one time- everything made by man can be counterfeited- and every security plan made by/designed by man can be breached and trespassed upon...

Sorry to divert from the topic at hand but I was lmao at Oldtimer's above post. His passion for proof of identity/documentation for raw meat is of so much more value to the USA than undocumented/illegal voters.

Gestapo (aka Oldtimer) talking to the meat packaged in the display counter saying "COOL Papiere bitte"

And your view is definitely not comical to me- in fact its just the opposite :( ...

S.A.P.'s belief that the only way they can sell their product is to allow the packers to fraudulently label it and pass it off as US domestic raised product is actually very sad... And then your support of this type fraudulent marketing technique is really reprehensible... Definitely not an image of the good honest Canadian neighbors that I know....
 

Soapweed

Well-known member
Oldtimer said:
S.S.A.P. said:
Oldtimer said:
I have no problem with requiring ID to vote BUT will that fix the problem?Most illegals already have fake ID when they enter the country or within a few days.... $1000 gets them an ID that is indistinguishable from real identification documents...

Are you promoting the mandatory REAL ID proposal for everyone? The one that gives true Constitution backers and Libertarians the vision of Gestapo standing at the train station saying "Papiere bitte"...

As a freedom loving Libertarian the thought of having to pack ID with you all the time makes me cringe.... The ex-Cop in me says "what a wonderful idea- no more trying to figure out who someone is- they can sit in jail until identified....
Bad enough its required thru the Patriot Act - have we progressed to the point that it now will be a new alltime requirement.... :???:

BUT I always remember what one Agent told me one time- everything made by man can be counterfeited- and every security plan made by/designed by man can be breached and trespassed upon...

Sorry to divert from the topic at hand but I was lmao at Oldtimer's above post. His passion for proof of identity/documentation for raw meat is of so much more value to the USA than undocumented/illegal voters.

Gestapo (aka Oldtimer) talking to the meat packaged in the display counter saying "COOL Papiere bitte"

And your view is definitely not comical to me- in fact its just the opposite :( ...

S.A.P.'s belief that the only way they can sell their product is to allow the packers to fraudulently label it and pass it off as US domestic raised product is actually very sad... And then your support of this type fraudulent marketing technique is really reprehensible... Definitely not an image of the good honest Canadian neighbors that I know....

Personally I'd a lot rather have my fellow voters documented (and legal) with country-of-origin labeling than I would the meat I eat. One of these days we will be caring more about "if" we get to eat than "what" we eat, if these illegals vote in more ding-a-lings to run the country. Oldtimer, you need to get your priorities straight.
 

S.S.A.P.

Well-known member
Oldtimer said:
S.S.A.P. said:
Oldtimer said:
I have no problem with requiring ID to vote BUT will that fix the problem?Most illegals already have fake ID when they enter the country or within a few days.... $1000 gets them an ID that is indistinguishable from real identification documents...

Are you promoting the mandatory REAL ID proposal for everyone? The one that gives true Constitution backers and Libertarians the vision of Gestapo standing at the train station saying "Papiere bitte"...

As a freedom loving Libertarian the thought of having to pack ID with you all the time makes me cringe.... The ex-Cop in me says "what a wonderful idea- no more trying to figure out who someone is- they can sit in jail until identified....
Bad enough its required thru the Patriot Act - have we progressed to the point that it now will be a new alltime requirement.... :???:

BUT I always remember what one Agent told me one time- everything made by man can be counterfeited- and every security plan made by/designed by man can be breached and trespassed upon...

Sorry to divert from the topic at hand but I was lmao at Oldtimer's above post. His passion for proof of identity/documentation for raw meat is of so much more value to the USA than undocumented/illegal voters.

Gestapo (aka Oldtimer) talking to the meat packaged in the display counter saying "COOL Papiere bitte"

And your view is definitely not comical to me- in fact its just the opposite :( ...

S.A.P.'s belief that the only way they can sell their product is to allow the packers to fraudulently label it and pass it off as US domestic raised product is actually very sad... And then your support of this type fraudulent marketing technique is really reprehensible... Definitely not an image of the good honest Canadian neighbors that I know....

Good Canadian beef stamped as USDA "INSPECTED" versus YOUR support of fraudulently labelled voters. :roll: :D Still laughing at your priorities!
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Soapweed said:
Oldtimer said:
S.S.A.P. said:
Sorry to divert from the topic at hand but I was lmao at Oldtimer's above post. His passion for proof of identity/documentation for raw meat is of so much more value to the USA than undocumented/illegal voters.

Gestapo (aka Oldtimer) talking to the meat packaged in the display counter saying "COOL Papiere bitte"

And your view is definitely not comical to me- in fact its just the opposite :( ...

S.A.P.'s belief that the only way they can sell their product is to allow the packers to fraudulently label it and pass it off as US domestic raised product is actually very sad... And then your support of this type fraudulent marketing technique is really reprehensible... Definitely not an image of the good honest Canadian neighbors that I know....

Personally I'd a lot rather have my fellow voters documented (and legal) with country-of-origin labeling than I would the meat I eat. One of these days we will be caring more about "if" we get to eat than "what" we eat, if these illegals vote in more ding-a-lings to run the country. Oldtimer, you need to get your priorities straight.

And Soap- you apparently can't read... I said I support ID for voting... BUT I question the reliability of it...
One of the reasons all the Politicians who've been caught for hiring illegals as nannies and housekeepers, and the reason given why no administration has wanted to enforce the Reagan law making it a criminal act to hire illegals, is because the illegals all have fake ID's and its almost impossible to verify their status....

One of the reasons- I hoped/supported the E-Verify program- that got buried in Congress for years...
 

S.S.A.P.

Well-known member
Oldtimer said:
I said I support ID for voting...

Oldtimer said:
Are you promoting the mandatory REAL ID proposal for everyone? The one that gives true Constitution backers and Libertarians the vision of Gestapo standing at the train station saying "Papiere bitte"...

You apparently can't read your own writing ...
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
S.S.A.P. said:
Oldtimer said:
I said I support ID for voting...

Oldtimer said:
Are you promoting the mandatory REAL ID proposal for everyone? The one that gives true Constitution backers and Libertarians the vision of Gestapo standing at the train station saying "Papiere bitte"...

You apparently can't read your own writing ...

And you apparently missed this- Aye?

I have no problem with requiring ID to vote BUT will that fix the problem?Most illegals already have fake ID when they enter the country or within a few days.... $1000 gets them an ID that is indistinguishable from real identification documents...

Soap- I was just reading up on the E-VERIFY program to see what the accuracy rate was now--- and the article I read says it has the errors rate down to about 8% of the time (which was why most Republicans/ACLU/Chamber were opposing it).... But one of the main opponents is the farm/ranch group- American Farm Bureau Federation...

Good old politics- principles only last as long as they don't start effecting your own pocket book... :wink: :lol: :lol:

As the accuracy of the program in finding unauthorized workers is a mere 46% according to internal reports, the program has been claimed as inaccurate. However, the margin of error, currently around 8%, is decreasing, as many of the errors came from changing last names after marriage or not informing the government of changes in citizenship status.[citation needed]

Chris Calabrese of the American Civil Liberties Union opposes E-Verify, citing concerns that it could expand into an onerous national ID system: "Employers are not police officers, except in this one context where we suddenly want them to be law enforcement agents who are going to police their workforce."

The American Farm Bureau Federation opposes E-Verify and stated in July that it "could have a significant, negative impact on US farm production, threatening the livelihoods of many farmers and ranchers in labor intensive agriculture."
 

Steve

Well-known member
Steve- what suggestion do you have ?

I have no problem with requiring ID to vote BUT will that fix the problem?Most illegals already have fake ID when they enter the country or within a few days.... $1000 gets them an ID that is indistinguishable from real identification documents...

locally we have real ID,.. no different from the past drivers' license I carried or the military ID I carried for many years... out here ID is a matter of fact....


unless your an illegal... I see them pulled over all the time.. they get a ticket and walk...

you can tell the states without real id , or the plate stays with the car... .. as that is the states the illegals use to get car plates from..


I have seen most of the fake ID's as Annie used to work in a check cashing place... it costs alot to get one that is even close to looking real... most of the time they use the fat that we don't know what all the state ID's look like...

It is in the address verification that the illegals have trouble... they tend to move alot... and the out of state ID that is good enough to fool an employer who wants to be fooled often will not fool a poll worker or police...



can't get the problem solved if we do not start somewhere... a verified state photo ID is a good start..
 

Mike

Well-known member
I am already "Real ID" compliant. No big deal. No more information is required that they don't already have.....Except for illegals...........

It's the only thing that will work to keep illegals from voting.

All current Alabama Driver Licenses and ID cards will be accepted for official federal purposes until December 1, 2014**. Beginning on that date, those persons born after December 1, 1964 will be required to have a REAL ID compliant document* if they wish to board commercial aircraft or access other regulated federal facilities. On December 1, 2017, this regulation will go into effect for those born on or before December 1, 1964.

*Those persons who hold a valid United States passport may use this document in place of the required REAL ID compliant identification.

**While the REAL ID Act of 2005 includes the deadlines Dec. 1, 2014, and Dec. 1, 2017, the U.S. Department of Homeland Security has announced it will implement its enforcement phase no sooner than 2016.

In response to these requirements, the Alabama Department of Public Safety has developed the STAR✭ID program. Persons who meet the issuance requirements for Alabama Driver Licenses and Non-Driver Identification cards are afforded the opportunity to go a step beyond the standard requirements to obtain a STAR✭ID. In addition to the standard requirements of the Alabama Department of Public Safety, those who select STAR✭ID will be required to present additional documents specified by the REAL ID act of 2005. Upon presenting these documents and fulfilling the issuance procedures required, these applicants will receive an Alabama STAR✭ID, which will serve as valid identification for official federal government purposes.
 

S.S.A.P.

Well-known member
Oldtimer's principles ....

Oldtimer - accusing others - said:
Good old politics- principles only last as long as they don't start effecting your own pocket book... :wink: :lol: :lol:
Oldtimer - as one of the "others" - said:
(US) access to cheaper Canadian cattle so they could drive market prices down during a time when without imports coming in US ranchers were seeing record prices...
 

Big Muddy rancher

Well-known member
S.S.A.P. said:
Oldtimer's principles ....

Oldtimer - accusing others - said:
Good old politics- principles only last as long as they don't start effecting your own pocket book... :wink: :lol: :lol:
Oldtimer - as one of the "others" - said:
(US) access to cheaper Canadian cattle so they could drive market prices down during a time when without imports coming in US ranchers were seeing record prices...

Isn't it funny how with a open border (except for COOL) we are seeing record prices. :?

I thought the packers would be buying these Canadian cattle to suppress prices. :roll:
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
S.S.A.P. said:
Oldtimer's principles ....

Oldtimer - accusing others - said:
Good old politics- principles only last as long as they don't start effecting your own pocket book... :wink: :lol: :lol:
Oldtimer - as one of the "others" - said:
(US) access to cheaper Canadian cattle so they could drive market prices down during a time when without imports coming in US ranchers were seeing record prices...

Actually S.S.A.P. I've told you this story of how I became involved in the M-COOL matter many times- but like most women you are purposely short on the memory on things you don't want to remember... :wink:

Back right after the NCBA proposed and was supporting the M-COOL plan, we were asked by some NCBA folks to look into the illegality of the Packers taking cheap Canadian beef and slapping a USDA stamp on it and then passing it off as USA domestic beef... Neighboring Sheriff's Office and County Attorney looked into it with us - and its blatently a flat out fraud under Montana law ! In further checking we found out its a violation of most states laws- but when the attorneys and AG discussed it we were told since it involved interstate transport and foreign trade that the Federal government had jurisdiction and since the USDA was allowing their label to be used that way - there was nothing the states could do...

But to me committing a fraud is an illegal act- and promoting committing a fraud to profit from it makes one a crook!

That is my principles- and they haven't changed...
 

hopalong

Well-known member
Something else hasn't changed oldtimer,,, woman bashing,,, not to forget false accusation lying about supposed claims, yet failing to offer proof,,, tht puts you in an a special group of hypocrites
 

loomixguy

Well-known member
hopalong said:
Something else hasn't changed oldtimer,,, woman bashing,,, not to forget false accusation lying about supposed claims, yet failing to offer proof,,, tht puts you in an a special group of hypocrites

Yup. The Fatman is definitely "special". Kinda like Randy Hickey on "My Name is Earl"... :lol: :lol:
 
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