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Womens rights

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olsonl

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Bill Napoli is a hillbilly moron who should go back to working on motorcycles not sticking his big ignorant nose into womens rights. He wants us to live according to his moral standards. I say teach your children morals, send your kids to sunday school and take them to church to teach them the morals you want them to believe, but dont you try to inject your extremist moral values onto me. I have my own beliefs and morals and I say women have worked hard and long for their rights in this country and this state. We dont need Bill Napoli or a bunch of western South Dakota hillbillies subjecting us to their extremist values.
I say if this anti choice law does ever go into effect, all of us women with unwanted, illegitamate, or unplanned children should bring them to Napoli's door step and let him raise them. South Dakota does not need more childrens homes and more unwanted illegitamate children who turn out to be a burden to the state and a lot of times criminals. We dont need to find more babies in the dumpsters or dumpgrounds. We dont need more young women dying because of back alley abortions. We dont need Bill Napoli.
 

olsonl

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We pro choicers do not condone abortion, but we believe in the womans right to choose. We dont think someone who lives in a little close knit community who knows nothing about the real world should try to make laws to limit our freedom. If you want to see the real world go to an Indian reservation, or to a childrens home. See how real poor people live in South Dakota and the rest of the country. See how children of alcoholics are raised. See how children of abusive parents are raised. See what the real world has to offer neglected unwanted abused children.
 

Steve

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If you want to see the real world go to an Indian reservation, or to a childrens home. See how real poor people live in South Dakota and the rest of the country. See how children of alcoholics are raised. See how children of abusive parents are raised. See what the real world has to offer neglected unwanted abused children.

so what you are saying is that I should have been aborted?

Because I was born to a poor family?

Because I was born in South Dakota? lived on the reservation?

because my mother and step father were alcoholics?

Because they were abusive towards me?

I saw how children were raised on the reservation....

I saw how children of alcoholics were raised....

I saw what it was like to be dirt poor.....

I saw how it was to be abused......

because I am the child you just described.......and you would disgard me with an abortion?

look at me now....I have raised myself above all that was my pitiful childhood.......

I served my country......and gave my best for her....

I traveled the world......

I went back earned my high school diploma, so when my son was born I could say an education is important.....

I went back and earned a degree, so I could look him straight in the eye, and say go to college make your self better the I will ever be.....

I married a terrific woman and stood beside her as she gave me a son..and a fine son at that.......

I stood beside her as she fought cancer.......

I have helped many of my friends....ran my business honestly, became a christian, served my GOD, .I have gave alot...and still have more to give.....but you would take it all from me by aborting me, for a pitiful upbringing I had no control over?

as I am the child you described so well in your justification for aborting me.....

Thank GOD you didn't have your way......
 

olsonl

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I think your mother should have the right to decide. I dont say that you should tell your mother that since you and everyone you know turned out to be the perfect citizens, she should give up any rights she has and let you decide for her. After all it is you who believe that she and everyone in this country should follow your morals, and your religious beliefs or superstitions, whichever it may be. If you believe in the great spirit or ghost dancing that doesnt mean I should have to. If you believe a prophet climbed a mountain and saw god and he told him to write a book, that doesnt mean I should believe that either. If you believe that all infidels should be killed, that doesnt mean I should. If you believe that Osama Bin Ladin is your hero, that doesnt mean I should have to believe it. If you and your freinds make a law that I have to believe in your moral values and force them onto me you are no better then the Taliban.
 

Cal

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I say if this anti choice law does ever go into effect, all of us women with unwanted, illegitamate, or unplanned children should bring them to Napoli's door step and let him raise them.

You would probably be doing them a huge favor, but the loving thing to do would be to put them up for adoption as newborns.
 

Hanta Yo

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Here we go again :mad: Cal posted a website, www.silentscream.org. Watch it, olsonl and see if you could ever go through with that. There arealternatives to birth control and abortion isn't one of them (IMHO). The best thing to do, and the loving thing to do as Cal said is to give the baby up for adoption and bless a family who cannot have children!

It's sad too many women see abortion as the only "out" for an inconvenience. I'm sure glad my parents didn't abort me, but my better half posted on the thread started by Old Dogs/New Tricks some time ago what his wonderful ex-wife did to him (Yup, I remember the comment you made about your ex-wife, Mike, I think sw feels the same :wink: ). Too doggone easy to get an abortion and what ticks me off is that my daughter can get one without my permission or knowledge!!

I think I better get off my band stand before I get really ticked :mad: :mad:

soapbox.gif
 

olsonl

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Maybe you should teach your daughter your morals and your beliefs instead of forcing them onto others :???: You just want the government to do it for you. Pass the buck. There are a lot of children in childrens homes people can adopt NOW. Its just that these people are choosy when they adopt and the kids end up living in these homes until they come of age. If you see it your way and the government takes over, your daughter could instead go to a back alley abortionist and possibly end up dead. Would it be worth that? Having a law against abortion will not stop it, it just makes it illegal and people like your daughter could have a felony hanging over her head for the rest of her life, if she lives through it. If you are old enough to remember before Rowe vs Wade as I am you would remember how horrible it was with the back alley abortionists and the dead and disfigured girls. Having a law against drugs never stopped the drug dealers did it. SD is among the highest in the nation with meth use.
 

Jinglebob

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olsonl said:
I think your mother should have the right to decide. I dont say that you should tell your mother that since you and everyone you know turned out to be the perfect citizens, she should give up any rights she has and let you decide for her. After all it is you who believe that she and everyone in this country should follow your morals, and your religious beliefs or superstitions, whichever it may be. If you believe in the great spirit or ghost dancing that doesnt mean I should have to. If you believe a prophet climbed a mountain and saw god and he told him to write a book, that doesnt mean I should believe that either. If you believe that all infidels should be killed, that doesnt mean I should. If you believe that Osama Bin Ladin is your hero, that doesnt mean I should have to believe it. If you and your freinds make a law that I have to believe in your moral values and force them onto me you are no better then the Taliban.

So if someone is an inconvienience to you or anyone else, you should have the right to kill them. Thats what abortion is. Killing. An innocent child.

Get some guts and just admit that you want the right to kill anyone who YOU feel is a mistake. Go ahead. It won't make me feel any different about you. Well, maybe I would think at least you had some guts.

Gee, if you had your way, all you would have to do is hunt Napoli down and kill him. Then he wouldn't bother you any more. Boy, wouldn't that be great!

People who believe in abortion just want to exclude anyone who they don't deem fit to live. And without the bother of a trail by their peers. Seems to me there is something in the Bill of Rights or the Constitution about that. Hmmm. I'll have to go look it up to make sure.

Killer.

:roll:
 

Liberty Belle

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If you believe that Osama Bin Ladin is your hero, that doesnt mean I should have to believe it. If you and your freinds make a law that I have to believe in your moral values and force them onto me you are no better then the Taliban.
Boy, are you ever twisted!!! I’m sure glad you live on the other side of the river from us “hillbilly morons”, although I would be much more comfortable if you lived in Iraq or Iran… or at least Massachusetts.

It’s the abortionists, the murderers of innocent babies, who just happen to be on the wrong side of the birth canal, that are no better than the Taliban who killed three thousand people in our country on 9/11. The real Taliban in this country are the abortionists who have put millions of innocents to death since Roe vs. Wade became the “law of the land”, not because of any law passed by Congress, but because of the very liberal Supreme Court’s judicial activism.

Who gives you the right to say which baby should live and which should be sliced into bloody pieces, without anesthesia, and dragged from its mother’s womb because it is an “inconvenience” for her? If the mother doesn’t want the child she has conceived, she can give it up for adoption to one of the thousands of people trying desperately to adopt a child. It shouldn’t have to be murdered for the sins of its mother or father.

Who appointed you God that you should decide whether a guiltless human should live or die? Who made you judge, jury and executioner of a little child unable to speak for itself?

Thank God for the statesmen like Sen. Napoli who have chosen to stand between an innocent child that cannot protect itself and a bloody executioner intent on butchering an innocent child that has seen no evil, heard no evil, done no evil and deserves the same chance at life that its parents had.

Our system treats mass murderers with more consideration than it does these most helpless and guiltless members of the human race. Where are your priorities?

Now if they would make abortion retroactive and we could pick who should live and who should die because of the way they live their lives after birth, maybe I could be talked into going for it - but I'm very sure you wouldn't care for my choices... :twisted:
 

Red Robin

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If it's a baby at conception, it is protected by the constitution and provided certain unalienable rights, life, liberty, and the persuit of happiness. It's alive. It's a baby. Half of them are a different sex than the mother. It deserves protection.
 

Red Robin

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stevec said:
Red Robin said:
If it's a baby at conception, it is protected by the constitution and provided certain unalienable rights, life, liberty, and the persuit of happiness. It's alive. It's a baby. Half of them are a different sex than the mother. It deserves protection.

Protected by the Constitution? That's a bit of a stretch. The Constitution doesn't even protect full grown adults from slavery.

No one thinks that abortion is "good." Like alcoholism, drug addictions, etc., people are driven to destructive behaviors. Rather than trying to control the adult, maybe you need to think in more compassionate terms. If you have 100% compassion for the child, and 0% for the mother, then what did you gain?

The sad fact is that people need to be free to make mistakes. Without the ability to make mistakes, then there is no such thing as freedom. Of course, you are free to maintain America as a fascist state, if that pleases you. Freedom is a double-edged sword. Faith and moral taboo are much stronger than laws, but we are a nation of little faith, which is why the Democrats and Republicans are constantly arguing over laws.

The blind lead the blind.

Matthew 7:3
"Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye?

Have mercy on these troubled women. Use the law to help them, not to persecute them.
Have mercy on the troubled babies. Use the law to protect them not kill them.
 

Martin Jr.

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It's in the Declaration of Independence:

" We hold these truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their creator with certain unalinable Rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness -- That to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men, "

Doesn't abortion take away these rights? Does the declaration mean nothing to the pro-abortion people? 8)
 

Hanta Yo

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olsonl said:
Maybe you should teach your daughter your morals and your beliefs instead of forcing them onto others :???: You just want the government to do it for you. Pass the buck. There are a lot of children in childrens homes people can adopt NOW. Its just that these people are choosy when they adopt and the kids end up living in these homes until they come of age. If you see it your way and the government takes over, your daughter could instead go to a back alley abortionist and possibly end up dead. Would it be worth that? Having a law against abortion will not stop it, it just makes it illegal and people like your daughter could have a felony hanging over her head for the rest of her life, if she lives through it. If you are old enough to remember before Rowe vs Wade as I am you would remember how horrible it was with the back alley abortionists and the dead and disfigured girls. Having a law against drugs never stopped the drug dealers did it. SD is among the highest in the nation with meth use.


I've brought my daughter up with the best moral attitude I can do as a parent. You obviously didn't understand what I meant. Anyone's daughter can go get an abortion without parents' knowledge, yet stores check ID for purchasing cigarettes and booze. Some attitudes toward life (not mine) seems to have evolved into something so insignificant (as to use abortion for convenience and birth control) when it entails killing a live baby. My daughter has to have a signed card giving the school permission to give her aspirin or any other over-the-counter pain reliever. However, she can get an abortion without my permission.

I was going to apologize for jumping all over you, since you are new here. It is a sensitive subject for me, and if I can't take it, I don't need to go here. I will behave myself.
 

Liberty Belle

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stevec,

Not to hurt your feelings or anything, but do you realize that you are a colossal idiot and no one on this board, liberal, conservative, or moderate, cares what you think?

Would you just wonder off and let us hold rational conversations without having to skim over your intellectual vomit? No one actually reads what you have to say anyway, and you clutter up the board with your mindless drivel.

Would you please just get lost…

Oh, sorry. Guess you already are.
 

Cal

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stevec said:
So Steve and Cal are Pro-Life and Pro-War.

Figures.

Doulethink wins again.

If the Empire wants to kill somebody, it is okay, but if a woman wants to remove a few cells from her body, then that is a case for the Empire to control her.

What ever happened to the Bill of Rights and protections of the individual against government? Isn't that what all these wars are supposedly meant to defend?

Just to be clear, my position is Pro-love. Have sex, have the child, don't be afraid. A woman who is burdened by fear of her own child is not going to be helped by laws. If laws could make the world better, then all we would need to do is pass laws. Unfortunately, that is not how reality works.
So let's see, you're pro-life-- sort of but not really, but wouldn't lift a finger to protect it...Go figure. And since you don't think laws are of value, would you legalize rape and incest...as well as drug use?
 

Martin Jr.

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The "right" to abortion laws were not made to help women. They were made by men lawyers who wanted to take away from men the responsibility of having to support children they fathered
Abortion does not help women, it hurts women. Many women are suffering from an abortion that they really didn't want, but were talked into it by boy friends, parents, etc.
Doesn't life mean anything to the pro-abortion people?
 

Steve

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People who believe in abortion just want to exclude anyone who they don't deem fit to live.

seemed to me that I wasn't worth haveing according to baby killer....just because of what I little I had in childhood.....but made up for as an adult....

her response for some reason didn't seem to make up for her wanting to kill me......maybe she is haveing trouble getting her foot out of her mouth.......
 

Liberty Belle

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Martin, you're right about abortion not protecting women.

Let me tell you a story about a couple friends of mine who will remain nameless for obvious reasons.

My first friend comes from a broken home, like many other young people, and because of bad choices she became pregnant just after she turned 14. Her mother dragged her to an abortionist and made her terminate the pregnancy, an act that will affect her for the rest of her life.

She is now married to a fine man, mother to several children and there is not a day that goes by that she doesn't mourn the loss of what would have been her first-born. She and her husband have been foster parents for numerous abused children taken from their parents by the courts and they have been a positive influence in the lives of many others, including several young women contemplating abortion.

I have another friend that I grew up with who came from a very affluent home with rather "relaxed" moral standards. This friend had three abortions that I know of, the first two while still in high school, and, although at the time she thought of abortion as a form of birth control, those abortions have almost destroyed her.

She has also married and had more children, never telling her husband about the earlier abortions, and the memories of the children she aborted are destroying her. She is an alcoholic, abuses prescription drugs and has attempted suicide several times and you'll never convince her that aborting those babies did anything to protect her from anything but responsibility for her own actions.

Her twin sister also became pregnant and after seeing what a mess abortion had made of her twin's life, she married the father of her baby and gave birth to a son that has been the joy of her life. That marriage didn’t last, but she is now married for the third time to a wealthy developer and would die before she let anything happen to that son she could have so easily aborted, had not she seen what abortions had done to her sister.

Every abortion has two victims and always results in at least one death. It is unconscionable that a minor can have a life threatening surgery such as abortion without her parent’s knowledge, but can’t have her ears pierced, get a tattoo or obtain a driver’s license without her parent’s permission. Where is the sense in this? Why not give both the mother and her unborn baby a chance at life?
 

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