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Zer0 Setting Us Up For $5 Gas

Mike

Well-known member
Tuesday, February 10, 2009
Obama Setting Us Up For $5 Gas
Now with gas prices down near $2, the United States should be attempting to twist the knife on our enemies in Venezuela, Russia, and Iran. Instead, we are allowing the same old policies continue, i.e., the opposite of change. The government may overturn President Bush's allowance of oil drilling off the coasts of the United States.

While this drilling would not end our dependence on foreign oil, it would definitely take a big bite out of it. And to use this time, the time of a recession, to squash jobs-producing work which would stimulate the economy is the wrong sign.

We could continue the drilling, and give tax credits for the drilling of natural gas. We could fund coal-to-oil synthetic fuel plants and have the offshore rigs be powered by solar panels. But we have to do something. Sitting around blaming Bush for doing something good is not only stupid, but counterproductive.

The Bush proposal "opened the possibility of oil and gas leases along the entire Eastern seaboard, portions of offshore California and the far eastern Gulf of Mexico with almost no consultation from states, industry or community input," Salazar said at a news conference in Washington. "In my view it was a headlong rush of the worst kind."

Oh boy. It's going to be a long four years. :roll:
 

Faster horses

Well-known member
Gas in Billings yesterday was $1.75.
A barrell of oil was less than $38 yesterday as reported by Bloomberg.

That doesn't make sense.

Along that line, the oil field around Baker is shutting down because oil is under $40/barrel...seems we could find a middle ground. Oil companies shutting down now is not what we need.

Another thing I'm wondering about, before zer0 was elected, he said he was going to TAX the coal companies so high that it would shut them down. Now how is that going to help unemployment? HUH? HUH? HUH? :shock:

And one more thing--the libs do all this talk about ALTERNATE ENERGY...
I heard yesterday that the wind chargers are made of plastic. Guess what is used to make plastic? OIL!!!
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Faster horses said:
Gas in Billings yesterday was $1.75.
A barrell of oil was less than $38 yesterday as reported by Bloomberg.

That doesn't make sense.

Along that line, the oil field around Baker is shutting down because oil is under $40/barrel...seems we could find a middle ground. Oil companies shutting down now is not what we need.

Another thing I'm wondering about, before zer0 was elected, he said he was going to TAX the coal companies so high that it would shut them down. Now how is that going to help unemployment? HUH? HUH? HUH?
:shock:

And one more thing--the libs do all this talk about ALTERNATE ENERGY...
I heard yesterday that the wind chargers are made of plastic. Guess what is used to make plastic? OIL!!!

But on the other thread- they're complaining because the Jobs/Stimulus package contains money for building new clean air coal plants- which generates thousands of instant new jobs and hundreds of permanent jobs while taking away more of our foreign dependence :???: What do you want :???:
 

Sandhusker

Well-known member
Obama is going to pissaway millions to build coal plants that he has promised to bankrupt, and you're defending the man? You can't see the contradictions here?
 

Mike

Well-known member
There was nothing in the Original "House" Bill to go towards Clean Coal.

Some Republicans tossed a trial balloon to the press about adding something, but the "Enviro-Whackos" jumped on it like a duck on a Junebug. They backed off.

The comes along Byrd, who is from a large coal producing state, WV, and language goes in for Loan Guarantees for Clean Coal upgrades.

How is that not "Pork", or an "Earmark"? Tell us please how that is not benefitting WV? :roll:
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Mike said:
There was nothing in the Original "House" Bill to go towards Clean Coal.

Some Republicans tossed a trial balloon to the press about adding something, but the "Enviro-Whackos" jumped on it like a duck on a Junebug. They backed off.

The comes along Byrd, who is from a large coal producing state, WV, and language goes in for Loan Guarantees for Clean Coal upgrades.

How is that not "Pork", or an "Earmark"? Tell us please how that is not benefitting WV? :roll:

The plant they think it will build is in Illinois- and probably use Montana or Wyoming coal...Thats where those plants get most now..

Both the enviro's are complaining because they don't want coal plants- and the rightwingers because they think it is an earmark...

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/02/is-the-futuregen-clean-coal-project-back-in-the-stimulus-bill.php

Really doesn't bother me that much as if its a ready to go plant- thats great- kill 3 birds with one stone- create jobs, use Montana coal, and reduce our dependency on foreign oil....

I know both the proposed natural gas electric plant near Great Falls and the coal gasification/charring plant an Aussie firm wants to build in SE Montana have been waiting on/somewhat dependent on the new energy loan money availabilty thats in the Jobs/Stimulus bill...
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Mike said:
So...... I guess you're OK ith $5 gas? :roll:

We'll never get away from the threat of it- or even higher priced gas until we make a massive change in our energy direction...
And we don't have enough oil in this country to take care of it- Like old Boone says "we can't drill our way out of this problem"....

But we do have massive amounts of natural gas- and estimates of 600-1000 years worth of all the energy production the US needs in coal- just in MT, WY, and ND...And areas that have unlimited amounts of sun and wind power....

I agree with what Obama said- this is America - theres no reason we can't find safe and clean ways to utilize coal and these other sources- if we just put our priorities in that direction--- instead of aiding and abetting the profiteering of the oil magnates, cartels, and speculators....
 

Tam

Well-known member
Oldtimer said:
Mike said:
So...... I guess you're OK ith $5 gas? :roll:

We'll never get away from the threat of it- or even higher priced gas until we make a massive change in our energy direction...
And we don't have enough oil in this country to take care of it- Like old Boone says "we can't drill our way out of this problem"....

But we do have massive amounts of natural gas- and estimates of 600-1000 years worth of all the energy production the US needs in coal- just in MT, WY, and ND...And areas that have unlimited amounts of sun and wind power....

I agree with what Obama said- this is America - theres no reason we can't find safe and clean ways to utilize coal and these other sources- if we just put our priorities in that direction--- instead of aiding and abetting the profiteering of the oil magnates, cartels, and speculators....

IF Obama said he was going to tax coal so high it went bankrupt, what good is 600 to 1000 years worth of coal going to do MT, WY and ND if the companies mining it are BANKRUPT. :roll: :roll:
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Tam said:
Oldtimer said:
Mike said:
So...... I guess you're OK ith $5 gas? :roll:

We'll never get away from the threat of it- or even higher priced gas until we make a massive change in our energy direction...
And we don't have enough oil in this country to take care of it- Like old Boone says "we can't drill our way out of this problem"....

But we do have massive amounts of natural gas- and estimates of 600-1000 years worth of all the energy production the US needs in coal- just in MT, WY, and ND...And areas that have unlimited amounts of sun and wind power....

I agree with what Obama said- this is America - theres no reason we can't find safe and clean ways to utilize coal and these other sources- if we just put our priorities in that direction--- instead of aiding and abetting the profiteering of the oil magnates, cartels, and speculators....

IF Obama said he was going to tax coal so high it went bankrupt, what good is 600 to 1000 years worth of coal going to do MT, WY and ND if the companies mining it are BANKRUPT. :roll: :roll:

Tam- read the next paragraph...Why would Obama be including money for new clean coal plants in the stimulus bill if their longterm energy plan didn't include coal... Some right wingnut picked up on that and ran with it- but if you had went to his website and read his energy plans- you'd of found he supports immediately building several "clean" coal plants- while allowing the others to switch over to the new cleaner technologies....The Air Force is building a new "clean" coal gasification plant.... The last I read, it was still planned for Great Falls- because besides access to coal- they need water..
 

Sandhusker

Well-known member
So then what did Obama mean when he said that cap and trade would bankrupt coal fired plants? Or do you want to refute his comments?
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Sandhusker said:
So then what did Obama mean when he said that cap and trade would bankrupt coal fired plants? Or do you want to refute his comments?

From what I read- he meant if those plants didn't come up to the clean technologies they wouldn't exist-but that the new clean ones would take their place--- but he definitely isn't anti coal as some have put out...

I should probably be one of those shouting "drill, drill, drill- since I own 2000 acres of land with the mineral rights on right in the new discovered Bakken field with oil companies having leases on them going back to the 50's----BUT I realize that while we'll probably be using oil for another 70-100 years- I can look futher ahead than the end of my nose- and realize that we nowhere can produce enough oil for the increasing energy needs- and that we need to look at new sources....

And I'm getting tired of Arabs, foreigners, and Big Oil telling us what to do or they'll hold us hostage over oil...
 

hopalong

Well-known member
kolanuraven said:
Faster horses said:
Kinda like holding our grandkids hostage to pay for this spending bill.
Right, OT?


Grandkids were stuck with a HUGE debt before Obama even declared himself running for Pres....

And now we are adding another $800 billion on top of that? Lots of logic in that arguement kolo.
There goes that special dump valve for you Cessna lol lol lol
 

Sandhusker

Well-known member
Oldtimer said:
Sandhusker said:
So then what did Obama mean when he said that cap and trade would bankrupt coal fired plants? Or do you want to refute his comments?

From what I read- he meant if those plants didn't come up to the clean technologies they wouldn't exist-but that the new clean ones would take their place--- but he definitely isn't anti coal as some have put out...

I should probably be one of those shouting "drill, drill, drill- since I own 2000 acres of land with the mineral rights on right in the new discovered Bakken field with oil companies having leases on them going back to the 50's----BUT I realize that while we'll probably be using oil for another 70-100 years- I can look futher ahead than the end of my nose- and realize that we nowhere can produce enough oil for the increasing energy needs- and that we need to look at new sources....

And I'm getting tired of Arabs, foreigners, and Big Oil telling us what to do or they'll hold us hostage over oil...

Instead of reading what some liberal kool-aid drinker said, read Obama's exact words;
"Let me sort of describe my overall policy.

What I’ve said is that we would put a cap and trade system in place that is as aggressive, if not more aggressive, than anybody else’s out there.

I was the first to call for a 100% auction on the cap and trade system, which means that every unit of carbon or greenhouse gases emitted would be charged to the polluter. That will create a market in which whatever technologies are out there that are being presented, whatever power plants that are being built, that they would have to meet the rigors of that market and the ratcheted down caps that are being placed, imposed every year.

So if somebody wants to build a coal-powered plant, they can; it’s just that it will bankrupt them because they’re going to be charged a huge sum for all that greenhouse gas that’s being emitted.

That will also generate billions of dollars that we can invest in solar, wind, biodiesel and other alternative energy approaches.

The only thing I’ve said with respect to coal, I haven’t been some coal booster. What I have said is that for us to take coal off the table as a ideological matter as opposed to saying if technology allows us to use coal in a clean way, we should pursue it.

So if somebody wants to build a coal-powered plant, they can.

It’s just that it will bankrupt them
.

-----------------------------------

To understand what this moron is saying, you have to understand that the technologies to burn coal with no carbon emissions DOESN'T EXIST. "Clean Coal" today is a goal, not a reality. He's going to tax their emissions - lowering the amount that they can produce each year - which will increase costs every year until the costs to produce coal energy is more than what its worth.

Then this idiot claims that those fees will fund alternative energy, but doesn't realize that bankrupt companies don't pay fees!

So we're back to this flipping idiot spending OUR money on coal fired plants that he plans on increasing taxes on until they go bankrupt - and this is to fix the economy.

Heaven help us all.
 

Denny

Well-known member
kolanuraven said:
Faster horses said:
Kinda like holding our grandkids hostage to pay for this spending bill.
Right, OT?


Grandkids were stuck with a HUGE debt before Obama even declared himself running for Pres....

She should have stated Great Great Grandkids but anyone with a 3rd grade education should be able to see the writeing on the wall.The cure for debt is'nt more debt.
 

aplusmnt

Well-known member
badaxemoo said:
Mike said:
So...... I guess you're OK ith $5 gas? :roll:

Painful in the short to medium term.

Beneficial in the long term.

It's time to take some bad-tasting medicine for our own good.

I agree, no stimulus, no bailouts, not one! and lets flush out the crap before my kids have to pay for our mistakes! You with me?
 
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