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nortexsook

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U.S. EPA Grants Waiver for 15% Ethanol in Gas for Newer Vehicles

By Steve Geimann

Oct. 13 (Bloomberg) -- The U.S. Environmental Protection
Agency is permitting higher concentrations of ethanol in
gasoline for vehicles made in 2007 and later, granting a request
from producers of the corn-based fuel additive.

The agency announced its decision to allow 15 percent
ethanol in fuel today in an e-mailed statement.


FOOD SHORTAGES HERE WE COME!!!!!!![/b]
 
Ethanol has been a scapegoat for far too long. It has way less influence on the price of corn then it has been made out to have. Do you honestly think that two dollar corn would come back if ethanol suddenly went away. For alot of farmers the cost of production for the 2011 corn crop will be over four dollars a bushel. I just bought seed corn today. The highest priced seed I bought was right at $250 a bag. I get three acres out of a bag. I also bought my fertilizer today and fertilizer is going up faster then corn is right now.
 
So sorry the fertilizer companies are bending you over.

Yes corn prices would drop greatly if ethanol were shelved. 30% of the corn crop is going to ethanol.

BOONDOGGLE.
 
That 30% goes back as feed. Ever heard of distillers grains? The dollar and China have way more to do with the price of corn the ethanol ever will. With corn going up more ethanol won't made with the 15% level allowed unless crude goes to $150 a barrel anyway.
 
And another thing the price of corn at my local elevator is ninety-five cents under the board today. I have four ethanol plants within forty miles of my door. I bet your basis is not that wide in Texas or Oklahoma without those four big plants so close.
 
Bullhauler said:
That 30% goes back as feed. Ever heard of distillers grains? The dollar and China have way more to do with the price of corn the ethanol ever will. With corn going up more ethanol won't made with the 15% level allowed unless crude goes to $150 a barrel anyway.
Click to expand...

You get 30% useable by product out of 30% total production of corn.

That's pretty efficient, did you mean to type something else?

The USD has a lot to do with the price of commodities, and the spending that you have advocated and supported is a variable in the devaluation of the USD.

subsidies for ethanol production are part of the spending. subsidies for food ....

well you get the pictture, or not.

when are people going to learn that progressivism and big government are negatives, not positives in the big picture?
 
Sure makes the grass genetics look a whole lot better :D - that and the average age of the cattle producer continually going up- that no longer want to calve out cows -nor fight winter calving-and would rather run yearlings or grassers...
The sign of the times- with the older folks wanting lower birthweights that can calve on grass- and others only using their pasture for grassing yearlings- or selling out to the big-big multi thousand animal outfits that do the same because they don't want to pay the input cost of the help to do anything else....

The name of the game anymore is low input-and using the alternative feeds-- and if you have cows you have to stuff 30-40 lbs of hay and supplements to in the winter- and have to stuff the calves full of grain to produce than it may get harder- especially when competing with all the imports/poultry and hogs that the packers would just as soon profiteer from.... :wink:
 
I calve in late April-May and I'm working toward the goal of keeping all of my calves over to be yearlings. The cracked corn/DDG mix at my local elevator costs around $200/ton. It works out to about 16% protein and calves love it once they figure it out.

After calves are weaned and turned out I feed it sparingly to heifers and only on the coldest days to steers along with my best hay. The cows get wintered on hay and salt/mineral. Haven't fed cake or ear corn to adult livestock for years. For me, a later calving season has significantly reduced suppliment feed costs to maintain cow condition.
 
There ain't enough grass in the U.S. to finish 1/10 of the fats killed here. :roll:

When corn gets too expensive to finish them, something else will come along to take it's place.
 
Mike said:
There ain't enough grass in the U.S. to finish 1/10 of the fats killed here. :roll:

When corn gets too expensive to finish them, something else will come along to take it's place.
Click to expand...

But you hit on why that will be a huge problem. Cattle (and chickens and hogs) will have to eat something that is GROWN. There are only X number of arable acres available. When more and more of those are devoted to the boondogle it will not allow for a "substitute".
 
nortexsook said:
Mike said:
There ain't enough grass in the U.S. to finish 1/10 of the fats killed here. :roll:

When corn gets too expensive to finish them, something else will come along to take it's place.
Click to expand...

But you hit on why that will be a huge problem. Cattle (and chickens and hogs) will have to eat something that is GROWN. There are only X number of arable acres available. When more and more of those are devoted to the boondogle it will not allow for a "substitute".
Click to expand...

Hogs and chickens can "graze" also. If we're gonna have a "grass only" mindset, might as well pasture them too. :lol:
 
Mike said:
nortexsook said:
Mike said:
There ain't enough grass in the U.S. to finish 1/10 of the fats killed here. :roll:

When corn gets too expensive to finish them, something else will come along to take it's place.
Click to expand...

But you hit on why that will be a huge problem. Cattle (and chickens and hogs) will have to eat something that is GROWN. There are only X number of arable acres available. When more and more of those are devoted to the boondogle it will not allow for a "substitute".
Click to expand...

Hogs and chickens can "graze" also. If we're gonna have a "grass only" mindset, might as well pasture them too. :lol:
Click to expand...

Chickens could just about have lived on grasshoppers here this summer. Then feed the chickens to the hogs. :shock: :shock: :shock: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :wink:
 
nortexsook said:
So sorry the fertilizer companies are bending you over.

Yes corn prices would drop greatly if ethanol were shelved. 30% of the corn crop is going to ethanol.

BOONDOGGLE.
Click to expand...


What is that? I guess I dont read enough?
 
There are other more efficient options for ethanol production, we used a 50% ethanol mix after sanctions were imposed in 1965, all produced from excess sugar. When sanctions were lifted in 1980, no changes were made and even today, the 50% mix is what is available at the pump in Zimbabawe.
The pig and poultry sector are less influenced by internal grain prices than is realised, Smithfields owns a dock and grain silos at Wilmington NC, and constantly looks for cheaper grain and soya on the world markets, to help give them an edge for the Murphy/Brown hog farms, and Butterball turkeys.
 
Where, or how, does the climate and even micro-climate variations in the USA and Canada fit the puzzle of comparisons between grass fed food animals and grain fed?

I know the arid, extremely hot and cold 'Great American Desert' of the upper midwest is some of the best cattle country in the world but it requires pretty big acreages per cow-calf pair per year and probably isn't the most conducive to economical 'grass finished' beef; yet the more favorable climates in either the more arid southwest or the more wet southeast USA and similar climates in Canada that seem more likely conducive to 'grass finished' animals where more animals can be run, PER ACRE in some enviable places!

So, how does one even begin to figure the benefits versus the downhill end of the possibility of profitability in either grain or grass finished beef? What other variables need to be considered?

mrj
 
I do not have a grass fed operation but have spent a lot of time trying to learn about them as a way of enhancing the potential of what we do have.

To be able to conduct a good grass fed operation requires a very high degree of management and knowledge. I think some of the comparisons of grass fed and conventional are done by people who quite frankly are clueless about the dynamics of an all forage operation.

Some of the important terms such as ''forage chain'' and ''brix level'' don't mean much to many cattlemen but are important elements of an all forage operation. To be able to put an acceptable level of finish on forage alone requires adequate gain even in times where normally forage resources are declining. A ''forage chain'' is necessary to do that so in some areas a progression of perennial forage as well as summer and winter annuals may be required. For instance cool season grass in the spring, warm season grass in early to midsummer. Grazing corn, or another summer annual in late summer early fall and on to wheat, rye, triticale in fall. ''Brix'' level indicates the amount of sugar available in forage which is an important part of being able to have adequate gains.

That is a tiny analysis of a grass fed operation. I think people would be surprised where some grass fed operations are being conducted. There are some on this board that can do a much better job. I commend your interest mrj.
 
I would hazard a guess that a grass finished model could happen in most area's that grass grows. But only a few would be anything more than seasonal. Using the tools Angus 62 described we can successfully have beeves ready on grass in the mid Sept to late Oct range. Other places would have a slightly different season. If mine were the only model then it would mean a lot of freezer expense for a year round supply. It makes sense to therefor use both the grass and grain models.

I only read the last page of this thread so if I missed the mark on this conversation feel free to ignore my comments.
 

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