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About those missing WMD's

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Well-known member
Feb 14, 2005
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Southern SD
March 13, 2005
Looting at Weapons Plants Was Systematic, Iraqi Says

AGHDAD, Iraq, March 12 - In the weeks after Baghdad fell in April 2003, looters systematically dismantled and removed tons of machinery from Saddam Hussein's most important weapons installations, including some with high-precision equipment capable of making parts for nuclear arms, a senior Iraqi official said this week in the government's first extensive comments on the looting.

The Iraqi official, Sami al-Araji, the deputy minister of industry, said it appeared that a highly organized operation had pinpointed specific plants in search of valuable equipment, some of which could be used for both military and civilian applications, and carted the machinery away.

Dr. Araji said his account was based largely on observations by government employees and officials who either worked at the sites or lived near them.

"They came in with the cranes and the lorries, and they depleted the whole sites," Dr. Araji said. "They knew what they were doing; they knew what they want. This was sophisticated looting."

The threat posed by these types of facilities was cited by the Bush administration as a reason for invading Iraq, but the installations were left largely unguarded by allied forces in the chaotic months after the invasion.

Dr. Araji's statements came just a week after a United Nations agency disclosed that approximately 90 important sites in Iraq had been looted or razed in that period.

Satellite imagery analyzed by two United Nations groups - the International Atomic Energy Agency and the Monitoring, Verification and Inspection Commission, or Unmovic - confirms that some of the sites identified by Dr. Araji appear to be totally or partly stripped, senior officials at those agencies said. Those officials said they could not comment on all of Dr. Araji's assertions, because the groups had been barred from Iraq since the invasion.

For nearly a year, the two agencies have sent regular reports to the United Nations Security Council detailing evidence of the dismantlement of Iraqi military installations and, in a few cases, the movement of Iraqi gear to other countries. In addition, a report issued last October by the chief American arms inspector in Iraq, Charles A. Duelfer, told of evidence of looting at crucial sites.

The disclosures by the Iraqi ministry, however, added new information about the thefts, detailing the timing, the material taken and the apparent skill shown by the thieves.

Dr. Araji said equipment capable of making parts for missiles as well as chemical, biological and nuclear arms was missing from 8 or 10 sites that were the heart of Iraq's dormant program on unconventional weapons. After the invasion, occupation forces found no unconventional arms, and C.I.A. inspectors concluded that the effort had been largely abandoned after the Persian Gulf war in 1991.

Dr. Araji said he had no evidence regarding where the equipment had gone. But his account raises the possibility that the specialized machinery from the arms establishment that the war was aimed at neutralizing had made its way to the black market or was in the hands of foreign governments.

"Targeted looting of this kind of equipment has to be seen as a proliferation threat," said Gary Milhollin, director of the Wisconsin Project on Nuclear Arms Control, a private nonprofit organization in Washington that tracks the spread of unconventional weapons.

Dr. Araji said he believed that the looters themselves were more interested in making money than making weapons.

The United Nations, worried that the material could be used in clandestine bomb production, has been hunting for it, largely unsuccessfully, across the Middle East. In one case, investigators searching through scrap yards in Jordan last June found specialized vats for highly corrosive chemicals that had been tagged and monitored as part of the international effort to keep watch on the Iraqi arms program. The vessels could be used for harmless industrial processes or for making chemical weapons.

American military officials in Baghdad did not respond to repeated requests for comment on the findings. But American officials have said in the past that while they were aware of the importance of some of the installations, there was not enough military personnel to guard all of them during and after the invasion.

White House officials, apprised of the Iraqi account by The New York Times, said it was already well known that many weapons sites had been looted. They had no other comment.

Daily Looting Reports

Many of Iraq's weapons sites are clustered in an area from Baghdad's southern outskirts to roughly the town of Iskandariya, about 30 miles south. Dr. Araji, who like many others at the Industry Ministry kept going to work immediately after the invasion, was able to collect observations of the organized looting from witnesses who went to the ministry in Baghdad each day.

The Industry Ministry also sent teams of engineers to the looted sites in August and September of 2003 as part of an assessment undertaken for the Coalition Provisional Authority, the interim American-led administrative apparatus. By then, virtually all of the most refined equipment was gone, Dr. Araji said.

The peak of the organized looting, Dr. Araji estimates, occurred in four weeks from mid-April to mid-May of 2003 as teams with flatbed trucks and other heavy equipment moved systematically from site to site. That operation was followed by rounds of less discriminating thievery.

"The first wave came for the machines," Dr. Araji said. "The second wave, cables and cranes. The third wave came for the bricks."

Hajim M. al-Hasani, the minister of industry, referred questions about looting to Dr. Araji, who commented during a lengthy interview conducted in English in his office on Wednesday and a brief phone interview on Friday.

Dr. Araji said that if the equipment had left the country, its most likely destination was a neighboring state.

David Albright, an authority on nuclear weaponry who is president of the Institute for Science and International Security in Washington, said that Syria and Iran were the countries most likely to be in the market for the kind of equipment that Mr. Hussein purchased, at great cost, when he was secretly trying to build a nuclear weapon in the 1980's.

Losses at Enrichment Site

As examples of the most important sites that were looted, Dr. Araji cited the Nida Factory, the Badr General Establishment, Al Ameer, Al Radwan, Al Hatteen, Al Qadisiya and Al Qaqaa. Al Radwan, for example, was a manufacturing plant for the uranium enrichment program, with enormous machine tools for making highly specialized parts, according to the Wisconsin Project. The Nida Factory was implicated in both the nuclear program and the manufacture of Scud missiles.

Al Qaqaa, with some 1,100 structures, manufactured powerful explosives that could be used for conventional missile warheads and for setting off a nuclear detonation. Last fall, Iraqi government officials warned the United States and international nuclear inspectors that some 377 tons of those explosives were missing after the invasion. But Al Qaqaa also contained a wide variety of weapons manufacturing machinery, including 800 pieces of chemical equipment.

The kinds of machinery at the various sites included equipment that could be used to make missile parts, chemical weapons or centrifuges essential for enriching uranium for atom bombs. All of that "dual use" equipment also has peaceful applications - for example, a tool to make parts for a nuclear implosion device or for a powerful commercial jet turbine.

Mr. Hussein's rise to power in Iraq culminated in his military building not only deadly missiles but many unconventional arms. After the 1991 gulf war, international inspectors found that Baghdad was close to making an atom bomb and had succeeded in producing thousands of biological and chemical warheads.

Starting in 1991, the United Nations began destroying Iraq's unconventional arms and setting up a vast effort to monitor the country's industrial infrastructure to make sure that Baghdad lived up to its disarmament promises. The International Atomic Energy Agency, based in Vienna, was put in charge of nuclear sites, and Unmovic, based in New York, was given responsibility for chemical and biological plants as well as factories that made rockets and missiles.

A Western diplomat familiar with satellite reconnaissance done by the International Atomic Energy Agency said it confirmed some of the Iraqi findings. For instance, he said, it showed that the Nida Factory had been partly destroyed, with some buildings removed, and some rebuilt. He added that the Badr General Establishment was almost entirely dismantled.

By contrast, he said, the agency's photo analysts found Al Ameer untouched, but only as seen from overhead. "The buildings could be totally empty," he said.

The diplomat added that the atomic energy agency's reconnaissance team found that Al Radwan was "significantly dismantled" and that Al Qadisiya had almost vanished. At the sprawling Hatteen base, he said, "parts are untouched, and parts are 100 percent gone."

Before the invasion, the United Nations was monitoring those kinds of sites. Two senior officials of the monitoring commission said in an interview that their agency's analysis of satellite reconnaissance photos of Iraq showed visible looting and destruction at five of the seven sites that had been cited by Dr. Araji.

The officials cautioned that the agency zeroed in on certain buildings of special interest in its monitoring work on unconventional weapons and that other structures or warehouses at a particular identified site might still be intact.

"You might have a place with 100 buildings but we'd have an interest in only 3 of them," an official said.

Officials at the United Nations monitoring agency said some areas of the sprawling Qaqaa installation involved in chemical processing had been wrecked by fire and possible extensive looting. Unknown is the fate of such equipment there like separators, heat exchangers, mixers and chemical reactors, all of which can be used in making chemical weapons.

The Badr General Establishment, they said, had been systematically razed. "It's fairly significant," one official said of the looting and disappearance of important buildings.

The Radwan site has been dismantled, they said, with the destruction quite extensive. And the Qadisiya small arms plant has been razed, they said, as have the buildings the agency monitored at the sprawling Hatteen installation. The two officials said the agency had no information on the condition of the Nida Factory or the Ameer site.

No Saudi or Iranian Replies

The recent monitoring agency report said Unmovic had asked Iraq's neighbors if they were aware of whether any equipment under agency monitoring had moved in or through their countries. Syrian officials, it said, replied that "no relevant scrap from Iraq had passed through Syria." The agency, the report added, had yet to receive a response from Iran and Saudi Arabia.

Dr. Hasani, the Iraqi industry minister, said the sites of greatest concern had been part of the Military Industrialization Commission, a department within the ministry until it became a separate entity in the 1990's. The commission, widely known as the M.I.C., was dissolved after the fall of Baghdad, and responsibility for its roughly 40 sites was divided between the ministries of industry and finance, Dr. Hasani said. "We got 11 of them," he said.

Dr. Araji, whose tenure with the ministry goes back to the 1980's, is now involved in plans to use the sites as manufacturing centers in what the ministry hopes will be a new free-market economy in Iraq. He said that disappointment at losing such valuable equipment was a prime reason that the ministry was determined to speak frankly about what had happened.

"We talk straight about these matters, because it's a sad thing that this took place in Iraq," Dr. Araji said. "We need anything that could support us here."

"When you have good factories that could support that move and that transformation," he said, "it would be good for the economy of the country."

In an interview, a senior atomic energy agency official said the agency had used the reconnaissance photos to study roughly 100 sites in Iraq but that the imagery's high cost meant that the inspectors could afford to get updates of individual sites only about once a year.

In its most recent report to the United Nations Security Council, in October, the agency said it "continues to be concerned about the widespread and apparently systematic dismantlement that has taken place at sites previously relevant to Iraq's nuclear program."

Alarms to Security Council

Agency inspectors, in visiting other countries, have discovered tons of industrial scrap, some radioactively contaminated, from Iraq, the report noted. It added, however, that the agency had been unable to track down any of the high-quality, dual-use equipment or materials.

"The disappearance of such equipment," the report emphasized, "may be of proliferation significance."

The monitoring commission has filed regular reports to the Security Council since raising alarms last May about looting in Iraq, the dismantlement of important weapons installations and the export of dangerous materials to foreign states.

Officials of the commission and the atomic energy agency have repeatedly called on the Iraqi government to report on what it knows of the fate of the thousands of pieces of monitored equipment and stockpiles of monitored chemicals and materials.

Last fall, Dr. Mohamed ElBaradei, director general of the International Atomic Energy Agency, put public pressure on the interim Iraqi government to start the process of accounting for nuclear-related materials still ostensibly under the agency's supervision. Iraq is obliged, he wrote to the president of the Security Council on Oct. 1, to declare semiannually changes that have occurred or are foreseen.

In interviews, officials of the monitoring commission and the atomic energy agency said the two agencies had heard nothing from Baghdad - with one notable exception. On Oct. 10, the Iraqi Ministry of Science and Technology wrote to the atomic agency to say a stockpile of high explosives at Al Qaqaa had been lost because of "theft and looting."

During the American presidential election last fall, news of that letter ignited a political firestorm. Privately, officials of the monitoring commission and the atomic energy agency have speculated on whether the political uproar made Baghdad reluctant to disclose more details of looting.

James Glanz reported from Baghdad for this article, and William J. Broad from New York. David E. Sanger contributed reporting from Washington.
lightninboy said:
Alex Jones to this day says there were no WMDs in Iraq.

So, were there WMDs in Iraq?

without rehashing an old argument again and again for every doubter in the world..

in the buildup to the invasion hundreds if not thousands of gallons of barrels of chemicals were dumped by Iraqis in the rivers,

so much so that ships could not enter the ports or run evaps near shore..

soon after the invasion medical units were overwhelmed by Iraqis with chemical burns..

add that to the many chemical dumps with pesticides that were found.

and one might understand where saddam stood with nerve agents..

if your willing to look up and see the connection between pesticides and nerve agents.. I might take a few minutes to explain it all again..
Steve said:
if your willing to look up and see the connection between pesticides and nerve agents.. I might take a few minutes to explain it all again..
Pesticides and nerve agents...not really WMDs, are they?
That's all?
I am sure that if you ask the kurds that were gassed and killed 5000 in just one instance they would definitely call it MASS

500 tons of uranium shipped from Iraq, Pentagon says


July 07, 2008|From Brianna Keilar and Larry Shaughnessy CNN

The United States secretly shipped out of Iraq more than 500 tons of low-grade uranium dating back to the Saddam Hussein era, the Pentagon said Monday.

The U.S. military spent $70 million ensuring the safe transportation of 550 metric tons of the uranium from Iraq to Canada, said Pentagon spokesman Brian Whitman.

The shipment, which until recently was kept secret, involved a U.S. truck convoy, 37 cargo flights out of Baghdad to a transitional location, and then a transoceanic voyage on board a U.S.-government-owned ship designed to carry troops to a war zone, he said.
lightninboy said:
Steve said:
if your willing to look up and see the connection between pesticides and nerve agents.. I might take a few minutes to explain it all again..
Pesticides and nerve agents...not really WMDs, are they?
That's all?

? really???? :shock: :? :???: Wow, is this why you use that name?

A weapon of mass destruction (WMD) is a weapon that can kill and bring significant harm to a large number of humans

The most widely used definition of "weapons of mass destruction" is that of nuclear, biological or chemical weapons (NBC)

The acronyms NBC (for nuclear, biological and chemical) or CBR (chemical, biological, radiological) are used with regards to battlefield protection systems, because all three involve insidious toxins that can be carried through the air.

A chemical weapon (CW) is a device that uses chemicals formulated to inflict death or harm to human beings. They are classified as weapons of mass destruction, and have been "condemned by the civilized world". Lethal unitary chemical agents and munitions are extremely volatile and hazardous chemical weapons stockpiled by many nations. The most dangerous of these are nerve agents GA, GB, and VX, (Nerve agents GA (tabun), GB (sarin), GD (soman), and VX)

In 1985 to 1986, Iraq improved the methods of delivery and distribution of chemical gases. Our emergency teams had also been organized more efficiently. Thus, despite of extensive use of nerve gas, in addition to mustard gas, the number of casualties actually decreased.

Nerve agents are a class of phosphorus-containing organic chemicals (organophosphates) that disrupt the mechanism by which nerves transfer messages to organs. The disruption is caused by blocking acetylcholinesterase, an enzyme that normally relaxes the activity of acetylcholine, a neurotransmitter.

As chemical weapons, they are classified as weapons of mass destruction by the United Nations according to UN Resolution 687 (passed in April 1991) and their production and stockpiling was outlawed by the Chemical Weapons Convention of 1993; the Chemical Weapons Convention officially took effect on April 29, 1997.

now that that is clearly cleared up...

check out this short article from the CDC.


and if that article doesn't convince you...
Organophosphate pesticides

In health, agriculture, and government, the word "organophosphates" refers to a group of insecticides or nerve agents acting on the enzyme acetylcholinesterase (the pesticide group carbamates also act on this enzyme, but through a different mechanism). The term is used often to describe virtually any organic phosphorus(V)-containing compound, especially when dealing with neurotoxic compounds. Many of the so-called organophosphates contain C-P bonds. For instance, sarin is O-isopropyl methylphosphonofluoridate, which is formally derived from phosphorous acid (HP(O)(OH)2), not phosphoric acid (P(O)(OH)3). Also, many compounds which are derivatives of phosphinic acid are used as neurotoxic organophosphates.

Organophosphate pesticides (as well as sarin and VX nerve agent) irreversibly inactivate acetylcholinesterase, which is essential to nerve function in insects, humans, and many other animals.

Sarin and VX... gee,.. where did I see that before?

Facts About Sarin
What sarin is

Sarin is a human-made chemical warfare agent classified as a nerve agent. Nerve agents are the most toxic and rapidly acting of the known chemical warfare agents. They are similar to certain kinds of pesticides (insect killers) called organophosphates in terms of how they work and what kind of harmful effects they cause. However, nerve agents are much more potent than organophosphate pesticides.
Sarin originally was developed in 1938 in Germany as a pesticide.
Sarin is a clear, colorless, and tasteless liquid that has no odor in its pure form. However, sarin can evaporate into a vapor (gas) and spread into the environment.
Sarin is also known as GB.

The pesticide tetraethylpyrophosphate (TEPP) is as potent a choliesterase antagonist as Sarin. Estimates of the cutaneous LD50 (does at which half the victims die from a drop on the skin) for a 70 kg adult human (for some reason that's the standard) are 1700 mg for Sarin, and (extrapolating from the per kg LD50 in rats) 1680 mg for TEPP

"both nerve agents and pesticides are organophosphates that interfere with the cholinesterase that controls muscles. Malathion 50% solution distilled down is nearly as lethal as VX a most portent nerve agent."

Nerve agents are chemicals which interfere with the action of the nervous system. Their primary mode of action is inhibition of acetylcholinesterase, resulting in acetycholine accumulation in synaptic junctions, and producing an initial stimulation followed by prevention of cholinergic neurotransmission. Other important effects may be produced by direct binding of some nerve agents to cardiac muscarinic receptors and nicotinic receptors, stimulation of NMDA receptors, and interference with GABA neurotransmission.

The majority of nerve agents belong to a class of compounds known as the organophosphates. In addition there is a class of compounds known as the carbamates which include compounds which act in a similar manner to the organophosphate nerve agents.

now that you get the idea.. nerve agent WMD,, bad.. really bad.. kills.,.. and those who are not killed live a life with medical problems..

pesticide.. same thing if used as a weapon.. pretty simple chemistry..


2009 Declaration

Iraq became a member state of the Chemical Weapons Convention in 2009, declaring "two bunkers with filled and unfilled chemical weapons munitions, some precursors, as well as five former chemical weapons production facilities" according to OPCW Director General Rogelio Pfirter.[117] No plans were announced at that time for the destruction of the material, although it was noted that the bunkers were damaged in the 2003 war and even inspection of the site must be carefully planned.

kinda hard to believe that in 2009 Iraq still had, ""two bunkers with filled and unfilled chemical weapons munitions, some precursors, as well as five former chemical weapons production facilities yet none could be found during the war..

while I can't explain why but there seemed more effort into silencing any evidence of WMDs then there was in proving the existence of..

but then again, some things hit a little to close to home.. and no amount of media brainwashing can remove your doubt. :wink:
Greg Szymanski | July 2, 2005
To date no WMDs have ever been uncovered in Iraq, and serious questions have been raised about America's "rush to judgment" in attacking Iraq.


Rove Admits Bogus Iraq WMD Led to Invasion
Tom Diemer
Politics Daily
March 4, 2010
Karl Rove, the White House adviser whom George W. Bush called his political "architect," admits in a new memoir that the failure to find weapons of mass destruction in Iraq severely damaged the Bush presidency — and he suggests the war might not have occurred had Bush actually known the truth.


NEW VIDEO: Proof Bin Laden Death Another Gov't Lie
Alex Jones & Aaron Dykes
May 12, 2011
Everything has been lie– cooked-evidence about WMDs in Iraq, bogus claims about mobile weapons labs & yellow cake, the Hollywood-scripted Jessica Lynch-incident, the shameful murder of Pat Tillman, the false-flag attacks on 9/11, sticking it to the victims' families & first responders, manufacturing links between Saddam Hussein and al Qaeda, false-flag scenarios in the Downing Street memos, planted flash mobs at the White House & Ground Zero cheering 'We got him' to boost appeal for Obama, phony bin Laden videos faked by assets at SITE and the Intel Center, Osama's CIA identity Tim Osman, secret backing for the Taliban in 1979, fake terror alerts– all of it.


The Military-Industrial Complex is Ruining the Economy
Washington's Blog
January 10, 2010
And we launched the Iraq war based on the false linkage of Saddam and 9/11, and knowingly false claims that Saddam had WMDs.


Indian Leader: US, Zionists prime suspects of 9/11 attacks
Pakistan Observer
October 11, 2010
Afghanistan was attacked on the pretext of 9/11 attacks while Iraq was attacked on the pretext that it had Weapons of Mass Destruction (WMDs). Although both the pretexts were proved wrong.


11 Reasons Why The Threat From Al-Qaeda is Not Real
Saman Mohammadi
The Excavator
December 8, 2010
A recent example of a lie they told was their assertion that Saddam Hussein was in possession of weapons of mass destruction.
Had the truth emerged that Saddam Hussein was not in possession of weapons of mass destruction before America invaded Iraq in March of 2003, there would not have been any public support for the war. True, hundreds of thousands of people around the world protested the invasion of Iraq before it was launched, but many people didn't because they believed the lie that Saddam was a dangerous threat and would use WMDs against America if he wasn't taken out. Leaders in the Bush administration used the oldest trick in the book of war to get the people to support a war that was not in their interest: they created a justification. Basically, they lied.
It is a tragedy that the world did not learn the fact that Saddam did not have weapons of mass destruction a lot sooner.
Leaders in the Bush administration knew all along that Saddam did not have WMDs and was not a threat, but they wanted to go to war so bad that they made stuff up and presented it as the truth to the whole world. Ellen Knickmeyer, a former Washington Post bureau chief in Baghdad and Cairo, said this much and more in an article she wrote in October after WikiLeaks published hundreds of thousands of Iraq war logs. "Recent revelations by WikiLeaks," Knickmeyer said, "show how top American leaders lied, knowingly, to the American public, to American troops, and to the world."
If American leaders truly cared about the rule of law and democracy in Iraq they would have presented their case to the United Nations that Saddam was a war criminal for gassing the Kurds, which would have been met with agreement, and from there a variety of peaceful and legal means would have been recommended by the international community to bring Saddam to justice.


Iraq inquiry: Government 'intentionally and substantially' exaggerated WMD threat
By Rosa Prince
12 Jul 2010
Carne Ross, who was First Secretary responsible for the Middle East at the United Nations, accused the former government of issuing "lies" to the public about the dictator's capacity to launch weapons of mass destruction.


Powell: Unlikely WMD Stocks Will Be Found in Iraq
By Arshad Mohammed
Reuters/September 13, 2004
Secretary of State Colin Powell, who made the case to the world that pre-war Iraq had stocks of chemical and biological weapons, said on Monday he now thought these will probably never be found.


Defector admits to WMD lies that triggered Iraq war
Martin Chulov and Helen Pidd
London Guardian
Feb 15, 2011
Rafid Ahmed Alwan al-Janabi, codenamed Curveball by German and American intelligence officials who dealt with his claims, has told the Guardian that he fabricated tales of mobile bioweapons trucks and clandestine factories in an attempt to bring down the Saddam Hussein regime, from which he had fled in 1995.
The admission comes just after the eighth anniversary of Colin Powell's speech to the United Nations in which the then-US secretary of state relied heavily on lies that Janabi had told the German secret service, the BND. It also follows the release of former defence secretary Donald Rumsfeld's memoirs, in which he admitted Iraq had no weapons of mass destruction programme.
The careers of both men were seriously damaged by their use of Janabi's claims, which he now says could have been – and were – discredited well before Powell's landmark speech to the UN on 5 February 2003.


Dick Cheney's fantasy world
Scott Ritter
London Guardian
Thursday, Dec 18, 2008
Cheney noted that the only thing the US got wrong on Iraq was that there were no stockpiles of WMD at the time of the 2003 invasion. "What they found was that Saddam Hussein still had the capability to produce weapons of mass destruction. He had the technology, he had the people, he had the basic feed stock."
The vice-president should re-check both his history and his facts. Just prior to President Bush's decision to invade Iraq, the UN had teams of weapons inspectors operating inside Iraq, blanketing the totality of Iraq's industrial infrastructure. They found no evidence of either retained WMD, or efforts undertaken by Iraq to reconstitute a WMD manufacturing capability. Whatever dual-use industrial capability that did exist (so-called because the industrial processes involved to produce legitimate civilian or military items could, if modified, be used to produce materials associated with WMD) had been so degraded as a result of economic sanctions and war that any meaningful WMD production was almost moot. To say that Saddam had the capability or the technology to produce WMD at the time of the US invasion is a gross misrepresentation of the facts.
The same can be said about Iraqi biological capability. The discovery after the invasion of a few vials of botulinum toxin suitable for botox treatments, but unusable for any weapons purposes, does not constitute a feed stock. And as for the smoking gun that the Bush administration did not want to come in the form of a mushroom cloud, there was no nuclear weapons programme in Iraq in any way shape or form, nor had there been since it was dismantled in 1991. Cheney's dissimilation of the facts surrounding Iraqi WMD serves as a distraction from the reality of the situation. Not only did the entire Bush administration know that the intelligence data about Iraqi WMD was fundamentally flawed prior to the invasion, but they also knew that it did not matter in the end. Bush was going to invade Iraq no matter what the facts proved.


Darn It! People, WAKE UP to This Wikileaks Fraud
by Jeff Prager
December 12, 2010
Next, Wikileaks supported WMDs in Iraq. This was based on their Iraq data release. I download this junk so you don't have to. Most of you don't. That's perfectly OK but believe me, I download it and read it. This gave support to the Bush regime after the fact and it gave them a wealth of support which then negated the very public claim of NO WMDs.

Whitewing said:
:lol: infowars, prisonplanet, and granddelusion :lol:

One trough, same slop.
Is Reuters, London Guardian, Politics Daily, Washington's Blog, Pakistan Observer and The Excavator slop to you MSM addicts?
lightninboy said:
Whitewing said:
:lol: infowars, prisonplanet, and granddelusion :lol:

One trough, same slop.
Is Reuters, London Guardian, Politics Daily, Washington's Blog, Pakistan Observer and The Excavator slop to you MSM addicts?

I wouldn't trust the MSM. Stop being fooled by them, LB.
Geez I love it when someone insists BUSH LIED about WMD :roll:

Democrat Quotes on Iraq Weapons of Mass Destruction

"One way or the other, we are determined to deny Iraq the capacity to develop weapons of mass destruction and the missiles to deliver them. That is our bottom line."
--President Bill Clinton, Feb. 4, 1998

"If Saddam rejects peace and we have to use force, our purpose is clear. We want to seriously diminish the threat posed by Iraq's weapons of mass destruction program."
--President Bill Clinton, Feb. 17, 1998

"Iraq is a long way from [here], but what happens there matters a great deal here. For the risks that the leaders of a rogue state will use nuclear, chemical or biological weapons against us or our allies is the greatest security threat we face."
--Madeline Albright, Feb 18, 1998

"He will use those weapons of mass destruction again, as he has ten times since 1983."
--Sandy Berger, Clinton National Security Adviser, Feb, 18, 1998

"[W]e urge you, after consulting with Congress, and consistent with the U.S. Constitution and laws, to take necessary actions (including, if appropriate, air and missile strikes on suspect Iraqi sites) to respond effectively to the threat posed by Iraq's refusal to end its weapons of mass destruction programs."
Letter to President Clinton, signed by:
-- Democratic Senators Carl Levin, Tom Daschle, John Kerry, and others, Oct. 9, 1998

"Saddam Hussein has been engaged in the development of weapons of mass destruction technology which is a threat to countries in the region and he has made a mockery of the weapons inspection process."
-Rep. Nancy Pelosi (D, CA), Dec. 16, 1998

"Hussein has ... chosen to spend his money on building weapons of mass destruction and palaces for his cronies."
-- Madeline Albright, Clinton Secretary of State, Nov. 10, 1999

"There is no doubt that ... Saddam Hussein has reinvigorated his weapons programs. Reports indicate that biological, chemical and nuclear programs continue apace and may be back to pre-Gulf War status. In addition, Saddam continues to redefine delivery systems and is doubtless using the cover of a licit missile program to develop longer-range missiles that will threaten the United States and our allies."
Letter to President Bush, Signed by:
-- Sen. Bob Graham (D, FL), and others, Dec 5, 2001

"We begin with the common belief that Saddam Hussein is a tyrant and a threat to the peace and stability of the region. He has ignored the mandate of the United Nations and is building weapons of mass destruction and th! e means of delivering them."
-- Sen. Carl Levin (D, MI), Sept. 19, 2002

"We know that he has stored secret supplies of biological and chemical weapons throughout his country."
-- Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002

"Iraq's search for weapons of mass destruction has proven impossible to deter and we should assume that it will continue for as long as Saddam is in power."
-- Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002

"We have known for many years that Saddam Hussein is seeking and developing weapons of mass destruction."
-- Sen. Ted Kennedy (D, MA), Sept. 27, 2002

"The last UN weapons inspectors left Iraq in October of 1998. We are confident that Saddam Hussein retains some stockpiles of chemical and biological weapons, and that he has since embarked on a crash course to build up his chemical and biological warfare capabilities. Intelligence reports indicate that he is seeking nuclear weapons..."
-- Sen. Robert Byrd (D, WV), Oct. 3, 2002

"I will be voting to give the President of the United States the authority to use force -- if necessary -- to disarm Saddam Hussein because I believe that a deadly arsenal of weapons of mass destruction in his hands is a real and grave threat to our security."
-- Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Oct. 9, 2002

"There is unmistakable evidence that Saddam Hussein is working aggressively to develop nuclear weapons and will likely have nuclear weapons within the next five years ... We also should remember we have always underestimated the progress Saddam has made in development of weapons of mass destruction."
-- Sen. Jay Rockefeller (D, WV), Oct 10, 2002

"He has systematically violated, over the course of the past 11 years, every significant UN resolution that has demanded that he disarm and destroy his chemical and biological weapons, and any nuclear capacity. This he has refused to do"
-- Rep. Henry Waxman (D, CA), Oct. 10, 2002

"In the four years since the inspectors left, intelligence reports show that Saddam Hussein has worked to rebuild his chemical and biological weapons stock, his missile delivery capability, and his nuclear program. He has also given aid, comfort, and sanctuary to terrorists, including al Qaeda members ... It is clear, however, that if left unchecked, Saddam Hussein will continue to increase his capacity to wage biological and chemical warfare, and will keep trying to develop nuclear weapons."
-- Sen. Hillary Clinton (D, NY), Oct 10, 2002

"We are in possession of what I think to be compelling evidence that Saddam Hussein has, and has had for a number of years, a developing capacity for the production and storage of weapons of mass destruction."
-- Sen. Bob Graham (D, FL), Dec. 8, 2002

"Without question, we need to disarm Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal, murderous dictator, leading an oppressive regime ... He presents a particularly grievous threat because he is so consistently prone to miscalculation ... And now he is miscalculating America's response to his continued deceit and his consistent grasp for weapons of mass destruction ... So the threat of Saddam Hussein with weapons of mass destruction is real..."
-- Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Jan. 23. 2003

It sure is funny how everyone seems to forget these pesky little quotes from DEMOCRATS when they are condeming Bush for lieing about WMD. :roll:
lightninboy said:

To date no WMDs have ever been uncovered in Iraq, and serious questions have been raised about America's "rush to judgment" in attacking Iraq.
nice attempt at changing the subject.. :shock: :roll:

but. isn't it amazing how they ignore facts to prove their agenda?

2009 Declaration

Iraq became a member state of the Chemical Weapons Convention in 2009, declaring "two bunkers with filled and unfilled chemical weapons munitions, some precursors, as well as five former chemical weapons production facilities" according to OPCW Director General Rogelio Pfirter.[117] No plans were announced at that time for the destruction of the material, although it was noted that the bunkers were damaged in the 2003 war and even inspection of the site must be carefully planned.

how can Iraq declare it has chemical weapons in 2009, ""two bunkers with filled and unfilled chemical weapons munitions, some precursors, as well as five former chemical weapons production facilities"" yet some still deny that they had any?

This is what still remains after two wars and thousands of bombs attempted to destroy their WMD stockpiles and infrastructure..

how can a person ignore TWO BUNKERS.. filled and unfilled weapons, precursors, and five plants???

the fact is there are today.. """two bunkers with filled and unfilled chemical weapons munitions, some precursors, as well as five former chemical weapons production facilities" in Iraq..

or did Iraq suddenly build the five plants, fill the weapons and hide them in the two bunkers after the war ?
lightninboy said:
Greg Szymanski | July 2, 2005
To date no WMDs have ever been uncovered in Iraq, and serious questions have been raised about America's "rush to judgment" in attacking Iraq.


Scott Ritter
London Guardian
Thursday, Dec 18, 2008

now that is one reputable source...

Arrests and conviction

Ritter was detained in April 2001[33] and arrested in June 2001[34][35] in connection with police stings in which officers posed as under-aged girls to arrange meetings of a sexual nature. The first incident did not lead to any charges.[33] He was charged with a misdemeanor crime of "attempted endangerment of the welfare of a child" after the second, but charges were dropped after he completed six months of probation[36] and the record was sealed on condition that he avoid further trouble for a period of time.[33][37] News of the arrests became public after sealed court records were anonymously provided to the press. Ritter claimed that the timing of the leak was a politically motivated effort to distract attention from his statements about Iraq.[34][35][38]

Ritter was arrested again in November 2009[39] over communications with a police decoy he met on an Internet chat site. Police claim that he showed himself masturbating via a web camera after the officer said she was a 15-year-old girl; Ritter claims he was not made aware of the ostensible age of his correspondent before the act. The next month, Ritter waived his right to a preliminary hearing and was released on a $25,000 unsecured bail. Charges included "unlawful contact with a minor, criminal use of a communications facility, corruption of minors, indecent exposure, possessing instruments of crime, criminal attempt and criminal solicitation".[40] Ritter was found guilty of all but one count against him in a Monroe County, Pennsylvania courtroom on April 14, 2011.[41] He faces up to seven years in prison.[41]

for some reason a child molester doesn't make a credible source...

do ya think maybe saddam knew about ritter's little problem?
lightninboy said:
Greg Szymanski | July 2, 2005

greg szymanski fraud About 117,000 results (0.24 seconds)

Greg Szymanski, JD, invented Eric Samuelson, JD

Szymanski faked an interview with Dr. Morgan Reynolds where he never actually interviewed him, but instead lifted quotes from a previously written article (not even penned by him), and then made-up what appeared to be a real interview. But he never even spoke to Reynolds for this supposed "interview." The whole thing was faked.

this guy has been written more discredited articles then Dan Rather and been personnel discredited as a source for several notorious books and articles..

it seems these guys use each other for sources to build stories they sell to schmucks.. but anyone with a bit of intelligence could easily see this..
lightninboy said:
Steve said:
if your willing to look up and see the connection between pesticides and nerve agents.. I might take a few minutes to explain it all again..
Pesticides and nerve agents...not really WMDs, are they?
That's all?

You decide:
Pesticides can be toxic to humans and lower animals. It can take a small amount of some toxins to kill. And other toxins that are slower acting, may take a long time to cause harm to the human body.

Pesticide production can be dangerous, too. One disaster at a pesticide manufacturing plant was in Bhopal, India. The plant accidentally released 40 tons of an intermediate chemical gas, methyl isocyanate, used to produce some pesticides. In that disaster, nearly 3,000 people were killed immediately, overall approximately 15,000 deaths occurred. Today nearly 100,000 people suffer from mild to severe permanent damage as a result of that disaster.¹In China, it's estimated that 500,000 people suffer pesticide poisoning annually, and some 500 of them die.²

Children seem to be greatly susceptible to the toxic effects of pesticides. The Natural Resource Defense Council has collected data which recorded higher incidence of childhood leukemia, brain cancer and birth defects. These results correlated with early exposure to pesticides.³
Well then, former pres. Bush should never have admitted there were no wmd's in Iraq. At least thats what he said in the interview I saw.
TSR said:
Well then, former pres. Bush should never have admitted there were no wmd's in Iraq. At least thats what he said in the interview I saw.

Please post that interview!!

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