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Animal ID isn't the answer

Jinglebob

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 14, 2005
Messages
5,962
Location
Western South Dakota
I posted this on the bull session also. Thought I'd post it here for those who don't go over there anymore.

This is why I belong to this organization.


Animal ID isn't answer

By Kenny Fox, chairman of the South Dakota Stockgrowers Association Animal ID Committee.

BELVIDERE - Members of the South Dakota Stockgrowers Association are ranchers who make a living raising cattle - true experts in cattle-raising. We are circulating a petition to determine how many people statewide and nationwide oppose a mandatory national animal ID program, as our members do.

Brand inspection areas such as western South Dakota are not only capable of tracking our cattle, we are doing it already. Every day. We record movement of cattle every time they change ownership or travel outside of western South Dakota.
In fact, when Canada discovered their very first case of BSE in May 2003, the Montana Department of Livestock contacted our chief brand inspector about some bulls that had been sold from Canada into Montana and subsequently into South Dakota. The bulls were half-brothers to the infected cow. Within about three hours, our chief brand inspector called the Montana department back with full details about the movements of each bull, all the way to slaughter. And Judy Martz, then the governor of Montana, commended him with a personal letter of thanks. Brand inspection works.
Tattoos are another nearly permanent and very low-cost method of identification. Several states still require brucellosis tags and tattoos on breeding stock, and while South Dakota is not one of those states, a good share of S.D. producers bangs vaccinate, tag and tattoo their breeding herd - yet another tracking system already in existence.
Producers from Colorado, Florida, Kansas, Michigan, Minnesota, Montana, Missouri, Nebraska, New York, North Dakota, Oklahoma, Oregon, Tennessee, Texas, Washington and all over South Dakota are now circulating petitions. Obviously they, too, believe the proposed ID program brings with it more costs than benefits. Ranchers aren't asking for more animal ID.
Sticking a tag in an animal's ear does not provide any sort of assurance of quality or animal health. Industry integrity and profitability all the way from the producer to the retailer, is the only thing that can provide that assurance. Contrary to the boasts made by supporters of the NAIS, tags can be cut out, lost and tampered with. A brand is forever.
I've yet to hear Japan request that the U.S. implement mandatory animal ID. Obviously, USDA has now tainted our credibility with Japan by allowing shipment of bone-in beef. This had absolutely nothing to do with the presence or absence of a tag, and everything to do with a lackadaisical agency that is a watchdog only when it's convenient and politically acceptable to the multinational food companies. Foreign countries aren't asking for animal ID, they want honest communication and respect.
Our organization has yet to talk to a U.S. consumer who would feel safer buying beef from a steer that lived its life with a computer chip in its ear. The proposed national animal ID program is not intended to provide one shred of information to consumers. No farm, state or country of origin labeling information. Nothing. Consumers would still be unable to identify whether the hamburger in their grocery cart bearing that same old USDA stamp is a product of Canada, Japan, Mexico, Ecuador or all of the above. Consumers aren't asking for animal ID.
Consumers have, however, teamed up with grassroots producers to lobby diligently for mandatory country of origin labeling, yet have been out-dollared and out-maneuvered by the meat-packing giants and their pocket politicians.
The only supporters of an unnecessary mandatory animal identification program are the companies who stand to sell billions of dollars worth of equipment, USDA who wants a feather in their cap by deceptively claiming that they are somehow "managing disease" and the large meatpacking and retailing companies who want ever more information about the location, age and number of livestock worldwide to give them more control over the market and to further integrate the cattle and beef industries.
The meat and grocery industries, while lobbying for free trade agreements with developing countries who grow food in unsafe and unsanitary conditions, favor a burdensome mandatory animal ID program for U.S. producers, but do not acknowledge the need to differentiate or even track imported food or livestock. It's not only a backward approach, it gives consumers a false sense of security while masking the real potential for disease problems - foreign food and animals raised in substandard conditions.
Until about three years ago, our federal government's policy was to prevent the introduction of foreign animal diseases. A very good policy with a remarkable record of success. Now USDA has done a 180 and decided that borders can be eliminated, if we can just "track animals" and "manage disease." If the USDA would protect our borders from unsafe imports of beef and cattle, the threat of a disease outbreak would substantially decline and we could once again prevent disease instead of managing it.
 
Interesting prospective,not much I can really say about the tags,In Canada we HAVE to do it :? But a question I have for you Americans,if you own cattle do you have to have them branded?Canadians don't,so Greg and I tag and brand,our nieghbor doesn't brand,so when siesmic left gate open this fall and ours and niebors cattle mixed it was REAL nice ours were branded,easy to pick ours out!Greg says we will always brand for this reason.So if you don't all brand,how will that work for ID ing cattle,are you going to make it compulsary??
 
Mrs.Greg said:
So if you don't all brand,how will that work for ID ing cattle,are you going to make it compulsary??

I find this whole US M_ID thing rather interesting. I was involved in Canada's M_ID program, on the periphery, and heard many of the same arguements as I see being put forward in the US.

The CCIA heard the branding arguement. I don't think the author has even remotely thought it out, because there weren't enough animal locations, letters, and symbols to cover off all the cattle producers in Canada for the next 20 years. So the US, with its 10 times as many cattle producers will somehow be able to find more letters and locations on a cow? Plus branding, for those who don't do it, and there are not many who do anymore, is far more labor intensive than a simple ear tag or a lifetime bolus.

Ditto the tatoos. Even individual breed associations are starting to wonder if they'll need to increase the number of letters on ear tatoos because they are in danger of running out. Think about it. 4 locations by 26 letters. ~456,000 combinations. When will you run out? And tatooing is also more labor intensive than an eartag or bolus.

Don't get me wrong, the longer the US bickers internally about traceback, the more competitive and attractive the Canadian product becomes on the world stage. The rest of the world has asked for traceback systems to become the norm, and if the author hasn't heard the calls, he's been listening in the wrong areas. So bicker away. Please :) :wink:

Please don't take this as being critical of your producers, associations or government. Its simply an alternate viewpoint that you may want to consider.

Rod
 
Rod if our lack of having a NAIS in place is helping you supply beef to the world market instead of us, you should be in good standing for a long time. NAIS is as dead as a door knob. It'll not happen in the U.S. in the near future IMO.
 
I'm confused{doesn't take much} but is it the IDing you guys are against,or just the tag IDs?Don't you think a trace back system is important?Rod brought up good points about the branding 26 years ago when we went to registar a brand we had to put in a number of options before we could actually get one....don't you think that is going to be a huge pain in the butt? How are you going to know everyone is branding? How many years before thats implemented??Just some questions I'm wondering about!
 
Mrs.Greg said:
I'm confused{doesn't take much} but is it the IDing you guys are against,or just the tag IDs?Don't you think a trace back system is important?Rod brought up good points about the branding 26 years ago when we went to registar a brand we had to put in a number of options before we could actually get one....don't you think that is going to be a huge pain in the butt? How are you going to know everyone is branding? How many years before thats implemented??Just some questions I'm wondering about!

As far as MID goes, we don't believe in mandatory anything. Let the market decide. If people will pay more for an animal with an eartag, producers will do it, so as to put more money in their pockets. Kind of like all the shots we give now that nobody used to use.

As for branding, there are 8 spots you can brand a cow. Jaw, shoulder, rib and hip. Both sides.

If we really wanted to identify any animal, there can be a code, just as our zip codes are. I have a different address than anyone else in the world. Any mail I send can be traced back to me and any mail that is sent to me, gets to my address.

I would suggest a prefix for each state. SD for South Dakota and so on, just like on our mail. Right now, every state has a two letter designation for it. use that for the brand in each state. Designate a spot for it to be placed on the animal, such as the jaw, as there are few if any brands there now.

The whole point of the story was that we found three bulls, within a matter of hours. Our system already is working. If it ain't btroke, don't fix it.

Not being argumentitive, just offering my opinon. If any one wants to argue about it, go to the thread on bull session and lets keep it friendly here. :-)
 
Why couldn't something like the chip ID system used for dogs and cats work for cattle and hogs, etc???

Having reg. stock I have to tag and tattoo ANYWAY...so it's not an extra step for me and I keep good records anyway for what goes where, etc.

I don't know what the cost would be for farmers/ranchers but like with anything if you have to print, create anything in bulk it's cost always goes down.

Just a rumination on my part.........
 
But a question I have for you Americans,if you own cattle do you have to have them branded?

No.
In Nebraska, and both Dakotas, the western part of the state brands, the eastern half doesn't have to. It's optional there and most producers don't. West of us, so far as I know, most states require branding. But east of us, most states do not require branding.

And while JB has an excellent point that a system is already in place in some areas (mine included), it also bears mentioning that many areas in the US don't require any sort of identification, brand, Bangs, etc.
 
Oh I wasn't trying to argue,honestly,just wondering.When the ID was implemented in Canada,it just seemed it happened,no time to protest it.We just go along with it,no other choice.Was interested in how you guys are looking at different options,just had a few questions.
 
kolanuraven said:
Why couldn't something like the chip ID system used for dogs and cats work for cattle and hogs, etc???

Having reg. stock I have to tag and tattoo ANYWAY...so it's not an extra step for me and I keep good records anyway for what goes where, etc.

I don't know what the cost would be for farmers/ranchers but like with anything if you have to print, create anything in bulk it's cost always goes down.

Just a rumination on my part.........

When I see one of my cows in the neighbors, I don't need a chip reader, I can visually see my brand. To me, that is the biggest benefit of the brand over all other systems. And you could cut a chip out, but a brand is harder to get rid of or change and even if it's changed, you can tell if you skin the critter out and look at the flesh side, that it has been changed.
 
JB wrote "As far as MID goes, we don't believe in mandatory anything. Let the market decide. If people will pay more for an animal with an eartag, producers will do it, so as to put more money in their pockets. Kind of like all the shots we give now that nobody used to use. "


Do you have a drivers licence? Are your vehicles registered?
Do you stop at Stop signs? I knew i shouldn't have asked that one.
 
Just wanted to jump in here to let folks know that all of North Dakota requires brand inspection.

I do know that eastern South Dakota does not, and would sure like to see that changed. Makes for headaches as a brand inspector and an open door for thieves.

Do any of you South Dakotans have thoughts on this?

Trust your neighbors, brand your calves!
 
Some states require brand inspection but do they require BRANDS? If they do would that not be MANDATORY? Like MANDATORY BRAND INSPECTIONS.
GEE looks like we all live with some mandatory things in our lives and businesses.
 
Big Muddy rancher said:
JB wrote "As far as MID goes, we don't believe in mandatory anything. Let the market decide. If people will pay more for an animal with an eartag, producers will do it, so as to put more money in their pockets. Kind of like all the shots we give now that nobody used to use. "


Do you have a drivers licence? Are your vehicles registered?
Do you stop at Stop signs? I knew i shouldn't have asked that one.

Nope. Nope.
Not unless I'm forced too. Yup, you shouldn't have.

You better go wash your woolies. :wink:
 
Big Muddy rancher said:
Some states require brand inspection but do they require BRANDS? If they do would that not be MANDATORY? Like MANDATORY BRAND INSPECTIONS.
GEE looks like we all live with some mandatory things in our lives and businesses.

In our state, you don't have to brand. Sure makes it nice when you can catch some mavericks and slap a brand on as then they legally belong to you. You just don't want to do it to a calf that is still sucking a cow tho'! :shock:

By the by old chap, why don't you go fix your problems in Canada and stay out of our business in the US? :???: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Yup, we have to live with mandatory because of fools, idiots, theives and LIBERALS! Do you fit any of those? :???: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Gott'a quit playing with you BMR, and go to work, to pay the bills, so I can buy some foreign stuff. :wink:


:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
 
In Indiana no ID is required but I have always branded on the left hip and ear taged with my name, address and phone number on the back of the tag and individual ID on the front.

In the last thirty years twice it has paid off much more than the cost and effort I have put into it and on an ongoing basis I feel it helps me with the management decisions I need to make.

Possibly I feel it should be mandatory and that it would help weed out problems.
 
Brands are great to identify ownership but they will not work for indivdual ID. Tags may not be perfect but if put in properly they work very good. Last year we lost 2 tags out of over 2000hd. The brand inspectors messed up more than that. It will not cost near as Mr. Fox thinks it will ($192/HD).
 
I have been using Temple tags for several years and the retention is great - - - I did have one pulled out of a cows ear this winter as I missed a piece of plastic twine and it slit her ear completly. I found it still hanging on the round bale feeder.

I buy the most expensive tags they make without the reader in them and with my custom fronts ( this year they will have K601 thru K650 ) and custom backs ( name, address, and phone number) they are still less than $1.00@

I will tag the calf with the same last two digits as the cow so it is easy for anyone to match them up.

Just don't let your young daughter order the tags as mine got very creative with the colors and it is hard for my old eyes to read some of them. I did my own ordering this year and the calf tags are yelow with black markings so I can read them.
 

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