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Australias Phantom Cattle

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Wasn't this the ID system that USDA said we should model ours after :???:

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BEEF NEWS
Australia's phantom cattle number 11 million

by Pete Hisey on 6/8/2006 for Meatingplace.com

Mix-ups in Australia's national cattle identification data base have resulted in some 11 million "phantom" cattle, according to the Australian Beef Association.

The database has some 38 million registrations; Australia's cattle population is about 27 million. The difference is probably the result of cattle that already have been slaughtered; tag inventory on shelves; damaged tags and the like, but ABA has asked the government how it will know which are which.

ABA chairwoman Linda Hewitt pointed out that a traceability program that purports to trace back animals in under 48 hours is unlikely to return accurate results with 11 million extraneous tags. "How do staff at the database know which tags are actually in live cattle and which are still on shelves?" she asked.

Hewitt said that the basic system is flawed and that mistakes and malfunctions are not corrected in the database, meaning that the promise of traceability is deceptive.

A database spokesman indicated the system needed to be rebooted, but was unclear how that would correct the 11 million phantom cattle.
 
various state Govts. have subsidised the initial issue of tags & for that reason many have bought as many as they can , this probably accounts for the numbers . As soon as the tag is sold to a producer its number is credited to their data base account if they have been attatched to an animal or not.
Regards
Marbl :-) :-) :-)
ps it has just started raining here after a major dry spell 8)
 
Well when ABA chairwoman Linda Hewitt pointed out that a traceability program that purports to trace back animals in under 48 hours is unlikely to return accurate results with 11 million extraneous tags. "How do staff at the database know which tags are actually in live cattle and which are still on shelves?" she asked.

Hewitt said that the basic system is flawed and that mistakes and malfunctions are not corrected in the database, meaning that the promise of traceability is deceptive.

With a database that works only on tag info,even the counterfieters could put tags in. Since all tags purchased belong to the owners and the tags are never accounted for at each movement,the Austrailian system is doomed to failure with verification and accuracy over a period of time.You just can't have 11 million extraneous tags floating around or even 1. ScoringAg still has the only accurate database system running worldwide with traceback as fast as google.
 
Your statement that the tags are not accounted for at each movement is incorect, The tags are scanned & transfered at all movements .At the sale yard(salebarn ) I work from the animal is not allowed to leave the premises without a working device attatched & the buyers refuse to take delivery of cattle that have not been scanned & transfered.I know this because scanning & transfering has become a major workload increase for me ..but no tag no sale is the rule & there is no bending of it.
Regards
Marbl
 
And further to the point, why would they ever be trying to trace a non used tag number?

The purpose of the tag is to trace an animal that has tested positive for a monitored disease.

Oh gee there is a tag on the shelf I wonder where the cow that belongs to it is? Duh! :roll:
 
Jason said:
And further to the point, why would they ever be trying to trace a non used tag number?

The purpose of the tag is to trace an animal that has tested positive for a monitored disease.

Oh gee there is a tag on the shelf I wonder where the cow that belongs to it is? Duh! :roll:
Click to expand...

This whole ID thing is for the government to catch diseases (in the case of bse) that they did not catch at the border with adequate measures. It is funny that we now have as undersecretary at GIPSA one of the regional enforcement officers that failed in that respect at Aphis.

Sometimes the USDA has a knack for compounding the problem and putting the food and animal safety back on producers. They even promote this incompetence within their own ranks.

Work of the foxes again. Here is more of their work:

"Protecting American agriculture" is the basic charge of the U.S. Department of Agriculture's (USDA) Animal and Plant Health Inspection Service (APHIS). APHIS provides leadership in ensuring the health and care of animals and plants. The agency improves agricultural productivity and competitiveness and contributes to the national economy and the public health.
In the News More - In The News

USDA Allows Importation of Untreated Citrus From Mexico for Processing in Texas
Johanns Announces $100 Million in Citrus Canker Compensation
USDA Corrects Final Rule Regarding the Importation of Animals and Animal Products From the European Union
USDA Proposes to Amend Regulations Regarding the National Veterinary Accreditation Program
Click to expand...

These "foxes" have lost their minds in their blind march towards globalization and packer policies.
 
econ: This whole ID thing is for the government to catch diseases (in the case of bse) that they did not catch at the border with adequate measures.

still in denial over homegrown bse!! what a joke! when you identify the problems you have maybe you can start to deal with them.
 
don said:
econ: This whole ID thing is for the government to catch diseases (in the case of bse) that they did not catch at the border with adequate measures.

still in denial over homegrown bse!! what a joke! when you identify the problems you have maybe you can start to deal with them.
Click to expand...

don, I don't doubt there is a possibility of "homegrown" bse. The fact that tyson has been feeding mbm to their poultry operations that cattle have access to is a real problem.

I am not knocking Canada for this ID thing. They are in the same boat as the U.S. is in now with both countries having bse risks because our govt. officials did not stop it at the border for both our countries. It seems that the producers in both countries are having to pay for the mistakes of the processors on this one and the food/animal safety systems in both of our countries.

In fact, I have argued that companies like Creekstone should be allowed to go beyond the low standards of food safety that the packers in both our countries have achieved. The mess up came first with the introduction of bse into the country in both our countries. These were govt. functions. Why should they not be held accountable? The government can not be trusted to be the only arbitors of truth and deference. They are too prone to political influence and hanky panky.

ID is not the answer. Adequate and honest testing and then follow up is what is required. Heck, the USDA hasn't been able to get a successful recall on meat when there is a recall called---the big packers drag their feet so most of the meat is sold and not recalled. How can we trust them to run an ID system fairly and efficiently?
 
id is part of the answer. more and responsible testing (as opposed to usda's sham program) is another part of the answer. a testing program like creekstone's could add to the small pool of knowledge we now have about bse as well as open markets. id is needed to add efficiency to disease control so that when the inevitable happens the origin can be narrowed down quickly and accurately. canada's id does part of the job and does the easy part very cost effectively by identifying the origin of the animal which is probably the most important clue to the origin of a disease outbreak.
 
don said:
id is part of the answer. more and responsible testing (as opposed to usda's sham program) is another part of the answer. a testing program like creekstone's could add to the small pool of knowledge we now have about bse as well as open markets. id is needed to add efficiency to disease control so that when the inevitable happens the origin can be narrowed down quickly and accurately. canada's id does part of the job and does the easy part very cost effectively by identifying the origin of the animal which is probably the most important clue to the origin of a disease outbreak.
Click to expand...

I have doubts that the USDA could run an ID program without it being a sham.

Their track record isn't very good.

Go read the OIG report if you want a little proof.
 
the animal is not allowed to leave the premises without a working device attatched*****SInce Iam also a ScoringAg rep.,I have a QUESTION,Do You Know whose animal HAD THE MISSING DEVICE AND iF YOU HAD THE ANIMAL IN A CHUTE ,HOW WOULD FIGURE OUT who was the owner??? that you put a new device on to provide ID for Traceability

& the buyers refuse to take delivery of cattle that have not been scanned & transfered.******I heard and read that there is a lot of rustling going on in Austrailia and people cut out tags and put their own tags in to sell stolen cattle.A Brand would work better and if it was in the same database you would have 2-3 proofs of whose cattle were missing the devices.
 
All stock consigned for sale are accompanied by a signed declaration . Identifying the owner & describing the cattle. The rest is just common sense. Person A consigned 23 angus cows delivered to pen 126 ,person B consigned 18 hereford steers delivered to pen 127 etc.etc.... There are responsible people handling these movements & preparing cattle for the auction , Number brands(paint) are applied when the cattle are being mouthed ,drafted,penned etc & there are other identifying marks,brands,ear marks,management eartags & I can't remember any cattle being misplaced in the process. If an animal arrives without an rfid tag it is sent home ,full stop & anybody silly enough to consign cattle without checking if they all have tags deserves to wear that expense.This is pretty basic stuff & the rule of common sense prevails.Stock theft is a problem in any country & brands can be altered,the legendary hot skillet has deleted many a brand in the past. Thieves will always find ways around a system if the reward is big enough.I am not saying the system we have is perfect but it is more perfect than no system at all & until it is replaced with a better one people like me will be trying our best to make it work.
ps 1.5" rain overnight,first good fall in about 3 months
regards

Marbl
 
Marbl said "I am not saying the system we have is perfect but it is more perfect than no system at all & until it is replaced with a better one people like me will be trying our best to make it work."



Well said Marbl, We have a system in Canada as well. It may not be perfect but Australia and Canada are a long way ahead of the USA in having a viable traceback system.

Don't worry about what ECON says , He's just a wannabe Cattleman / economist. Was nearly dragged to death on the Grocery store pony until a little kid ran up and unpluged it.
 

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