Bad overgrazing
- Thread starter Jinglebob
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k_ranch
Well-known member
Jinglebob said:
Good answer,And pay the bills
All that overgrazing you should be ashamed of yourself Jinglebob
Storage tanks at the windmills look like a great idea for those hot still days in the summer. I put a check valve under the windmill cylinders and hang a submersable pump under that with the electric wire along side the drop pipe. If the wind stops blowing I can just run the pump with a small gas generator. Pumps past the leathers and up the drop pipe, fills a bottomless tank in short order with a 10 or 12 gpm pump.
Beats moving the cows around when there is other work to do.
Nice place don't you be selling out to those big money boys :!:
Jinglebob
Well-known member
CattleRMe said:
When a big bunch of cattle come up to get a drink, the windmill can't keep up with the demand.
Jinglebob
Well-known member
k_ranch said:Storage tanks at the windmills look like a great idea for those hot still days in the summer. I put a check valve under the windmill cylinders and hang a submersable pump under that with the electric wire along side the drop pipe. If the wind stops blowing I can just run the pump with a small gas generator. Pumps past the leathers and up the drop pipe, fills a bottomless tank in short order with a 10 or 12 gpm pump.
Beats moving the cows around when there is other work to do.
Nice place don't you be selling out to those big money boys :!:
Good idea! I've been trying to figure out a way to do something like that, so that I could use a well for water at a house and still have the windmill, for when the electricity goes off.
As long as I can make a living here, I don't think I'd sell out. It would be like selling great grampa's, grampa's and dad's graves.
Of all the places I've been and seen, the dust bothers me the least at this one! :wink:
I heard on the news last night that the wind blew so hard it blew a couple of semi's right off the road. You holdin' up ok down there?
That's quite the grazing program you got there, is that native grass? Looks hardy. But it appears your overgrazing has dun wiped the trees right off you pasture land! :shock: :wink:
That's quite the grazing program you got there, is that native grass? Looks hardy. But it appears your overgrazing has dun wiped the trees right off you pasture land! :shock: :wink:
Tap
Well-known member
Jinglebob is to be commended for the undertaking of getting his program going. I know I am not the first to grab on to change, but we put a grazing system into place, and I can sure see the good it has done us. One year my dad and I set 18 rubber and bottomless tanks ourselves, and the next year we put the fencing in for our rotational system. I think adding units could be a benefit, but my main goal was to keep more grass on the ground during the dormant season. Old grass sure gives our new grass a good start, especially in the drier years.
One purpose of the rotational systems is to give all areas an equal amount of rest, and that equates into a longer time for the grasses to recover. One one 5 pasture rotation, we start moving the cattle every 6-7 days, and by the end of the summer it may be 2 weeks before we move again. This gives more chances for your pastures to benefit from the summer showers that green things up too. It is just a win/win situation all together. We backed our calving dates up too along with the rotational grazing, and our weaning weights actually got heavier! We start 2 weeks later than we were calving a few years ago.
Jinglebob, I am interested in the days of rest you give your pastures between moves. How many pastures per rotation, and how many days do you stay in a pasture.
We have an OUTSTANDING NRCS man here. We are damn lucky to have him.
One purpose of the rotational systems is to give all areas an equal amount of rest, and that equates into a longer time for the grasses to recover. One one 5 pasture rotation, we start moving the cattle every 6-7 days, and by the end of the summer it may be 2 weeks before we move again. This gives more chances for your pastures to benefit from the summer showers that green things up too. It is just a win/win situation all together. We backed our calving dates up too along with the rotational grazing, and our weaning weights actually got heavier! We start 2 weeks later than we were calving a few years ago.
Jinglebob, I am interested in the days of rest you give your pastures between moves. How many pastures per rotation, and how many days do you stay in a pasture.
We have an OUTSTANDING NRCS man here. We are damn lucky to have him.
Jinglebob
Well-known member
Silver said:
Yup, grazed them dang trees right off! Stupid cattle! :wink:
What was in the pictures was native. We've got some old hay fields that are going back to native, on thier own.
Part of the reason I like this system is that the cattle learn to eat what they maybe don't like as well, so that every species of grass has an equal chance to grow and restore itself. I've had the best luck with yearlings as they haven't sarted a pattern of what kinds of grass they like and don't like. An ol' cow can get awful picky, if she has a choice. But with the competion by the other cattle, she learns to eat what is in front of her, whether it's her favorite or not. Yearlings don't seem to care so much as long as they have something to eat.
Jinglebob
Well-known member
Tap said:
There is no set pattern to the days of rest. When I go out an look and the cattle have taken the most good, while trying to leave about 3 inches tall grass left, it's time to move.
Some pastures I move faster, in order to try and get certain species when they are at their best or before they get a chance to seed. As the summer goes on, the cattle get into bigger pastures and stay longer.
If I was really doing this the proper way, I'd go back and subdivide every pasture again.
The beauty of this system is that you can't hardly mess it up, if you just watch the cattle, they will tell you when the good is gone and it's time to move. And moving them just amounts to opening a gate or two and the next day going back and shuting them off from the pastures they have been in. If it wasn't pretty foolproof and easy, I sure as heck couldn't do it! :wink:
One of my biggest problems is getting the guys who I summer for, to let me put all of their cattle together. With a bigger bunch, I can create more competition and do a better job and I only have one bunch to rotate thru' instead of two or three. And only one bunch of cattle to cheak!
In the spring when the crested is good, I've got to hit it hard and by the time I get it all grazed off the way I want, it's time to go back and get it again. By then the warm season grasses are ready to be grazed.
I ain't very good at this stuff, but it sure has made a difference in how many more cattle I can run and how much grass I leave. Basicly, I'm trying to cut grass as most would with a swather or haybine. But when I do it, I'm also fertalizing and working the ground a little with hoof action. And I don't have to go back and bale it. Simplify, simplify! LOL
Give me a call Tap and we'll visit. Some of the stuff that works down south or southeast of here works a little different up here in our country. And there is no right or wrong to it, as long as you are getting the grass grazed, the way you want to and the cattle are doing well. there is a feller over by Wibaux, who puts cattle in a psture and they don't get to leave until all the sagebrush is gone. then he'll rest that pasture for two years. Sounds like he's running more cattle and got more grass than al of his neighbors.
As far as ovewrgrazinbg goes, what does a chunk of farm ground look like when you tear it up. but it grows back and if you did it right, it will be better than before. You can do the same thing with cattle and not have to own a piece of machinery or set on a danged ol' tractor!
Think about turning a kid into a resturant and telling him he can eat anything he wants, but he has to stay there for 6 months. You can bet he'll eat all the sweets and candy like stuff at first and the vegetables will be last and then he'll only eat them because he was starved into it. And they sure won't taste very good after setting there for 4 or 5 months!
Thats what we used to do with our cows. By the time they had to eat the grass they didn't lke, it was way past and had little food value. I'm just making them eat a balanced diet, like my mom used to do to me! :wink:
Face it, I'm just lazy and there isn't a lot of hard work involved with this!
All of those who say this type of system won't work on their place, just mean that it can't, as they are too comfortable doing things the way they always have. And thats fine with me. Everybody has got to hoe their own row! :wink:
And change comes real hard to all of us hard headed ol' ranchers and cowboys! :lol: :lol:
I wouldn't be doing it if I wasn't kind of forced into it, just cuz I wanted to pay ALL of my bills, instead of just a few every month! :shock: :lol: :lol:
Jinglebob JR
Member
Its is a good system the jb has created though the past few years. I like the results but hate to see all the fences. But i geuss a feller can't gain much without some sacrifice. Through all of my protest Im glad to see the JB had the forsite i did not.
PS dont tell him i said so though. lol
PS dont tell him i said so though. lol
Tap
Well-known member
Jinglebob, thanks for replying to my questions. I might call you sometime when things slack off around here. Our conversations get a little lengthy sometimes :wink: , and I might not be real good company as my eyes get a little heavy this time of year. I really don't mind calving hfrs. too bad though. We have plenty of them this year.
Nice days like today help. :lol:
I hope things are going well around the outfit you are on Jinglebob Jr.
Nice days like today help. :lol:
I hope things are going well around the outfit you are on Jinglebob Jr.
Jinglebob
Well-known member
CattleRMe said:
One well for about 3 to 4 pastures, the way it is fenced now.
You can't do as good a job of selectivley grazing if you have bigger pastures.
Looks good JB, I too am a big fan of high intensity short duration grazing. We have taken some ground that used to be farmed and put electric fences in making cells that we graze from 3 days to a week. When we first put them in there was alot of alfalfa and it worked really well. Now it is almost all crested wheat so it is hard to get it grazed off before some of the cells get too far along and the cows don't want to eat it. With the drought years and an ever increasing elk herd, it has not worked the best the last few years. When we had a botanist come out here and inventory all the plants and animals on this place, she asked me why I never graze all of the ranch. I gave her a Range 101 course and explained that the whole ranch is grazed every year, just for a short time and then it is rested and allowed to regrow. She was impressed. We are done feeding cows for the year as we left so much grass last year that the cows are grazing now, which is mostly crested wheat, so they are eating last years grass (which is softened up with all of this rain ) to get at this years sweet green grass. Happy cows
) to get at this years sweet green grass. Happy cows Jinglebob
Well-known member
Ain't it amazing all of the problems that can be solved by having some grass left over? :wink:
I don't worry about grass tetny in the cows, if they are on native grass or crested with a lot of old grass in amongst the new growth.
I don't know if longhorns can get grass tetny or what, but it ain't been a problem since I've been running them. Of course, since I said that I've probably jinxed myself and will lose one or two now! :shock:
I don't worry about grass tetny in the cows, if they are on native grass or crested with a lot of old grass in amongst the new growth.
I don't know if longhorns can get grass tetny or what, but it ain't been a problem since I've been running them. Of course, since I said that I've probably jinxed myself and will lose one or two now! :shock:
Big Muddy rancher
Well-known member
I just started feeding the Hfrs and some older cows this week and in the process of getting the rest of the cow herd out of the badlands onto fresh (dormant) grass to start calving. I can't do it every year but wintered the cows grazing and with my bossy Bloomer. The cows look real good .
sdcowboy
Member
Jinglebob, have you ever looked at using herbicide to treat your pastures. I ranch in meade county and have greatly been able to increase my grass production and restore balance to my pasture by taking out cactus, sagewort, and snakeweed. Never seen such a release of desirable forbs such as dotted gayfeather. thought it might be something you would be interested in. I'm just getting started in the program but the plan is to use herbicide treatments with a rotational grazing strategy. It's really pretty neat.
Jinglebob
Well-known member
sdcowboy said:
Only time I use herbicide is for thistle and burdock. And I wish I didn't have to do that. If I could just get my cattle trained to eat it and grasshoppers, I'd be set!
We don't have a catus problem.
I'm not sure about snakeweed and I don't worry about sagewort. It ketches the snow in the winter.
Grass will outgrow most any problem forb around here, if given a chance. Tho' if it was real thick, herbicide would probably get the job done quicker. Tho' I'm afraid of the cost. It's cheaper, in the short run anyway, to just trample it down and let the grass outgrow it.
I never want a pure stand of anything. The mixture is what makes it all work, IMO. I know that timely grazing can help get rid of many problem grasses and weeds. If I wasn't so lazy I'd get some goats and sheep to take care of the woody plants and make money off from it instead of cussing it. a weed is just a plant that we ain't figured out a way to make money off from!
I just hate to fence for sheep and goats and I don't want to spend all my time herding. Maybe when I get older, as dad herded sheep as a kid and always said that was what he wanted to do when he got old, as it sure wasn't too hard of a job and was really pretty relaxing. But mom just wouldn't move into a sheep wagon again and hated the thought of telling people she was married to a sheep herder, tho it didn't bother dad any to tell people he herded sheep. It's what kept this place going thru' the 30's! :lol:
PM me and let me know more about where you are, please. You probably have got info I need! :wink:
