Big Horn Mountain fire in Wy that could have been stopped

[Faster horses]

We were in Buffalo, Wyoming Aug. 26 and 27 and we saw this fire on the
Big Horn Mountains get larger as we watched. We called 9-11 and told
that they probably already knew about it, but we were calling just in case.
Mr. FH knew exactly where the fire was as that was his old stomping grounds. The dispatcher said they knew about it, that it had been burning
for 2 weeks and the Forest Service was 'keeping an eye on it.'
Well, they kept an eye on it for sure, and now it is costing 1.46 million
dollars to date to fight it. Letting fires burn must be some kind of a racket!!
This fire could have been easily stopped at one point!!
Now it has burned over 3900 acres on the Big Horn Mountains. Crazy stuff
this allowing fires to burn!

Here is one story in the Buffalo, Wyoming local paper.
http://www.buffalobulletin.com/news/gileadfiregrowingalmost4000acresundersiege.html

Progress continues on northeast flank of Gilead fire

Published: Thursday, September 6th, 2012


Progress continues on the Gilead fire. Firefighters are progressing on the northeast flank. The dozer line was completed to Cougar Canyon.

Structure protection continued around Ginger's Cabin. In addition, firefighters removed a hunter's camp near Ginger's Cabin.

The Gilead Fire began on Aug. 14 with a lightning strike on the Bighorn National Forest. The San Juan Hotshots, a helicopter, and local firefighters reconned the fire, determining that the terrain precluded putting firefighters on the ground.

Helicopter bucket drops continued for the better part of two weeks. On Aug. 29 the fire grew from 15 acres to 700 acres. Chuck Russell's Type 3 Incident Management Team assumed command of the fire on Aug. 30.

Crews will improve line on the eastern flank and remove pockets of unburned fuel.

Construction of dozer line on the southeast flank will extend to the south.

Firefighters will continue structure protection at Ginger's Cabin.

Night operations will patrol and maintain public awareness. Structure assessments will continue south of the fire toward Paradise and Hunter Mesa.

Additional resources continue to arrive. Four helicopters (one light, two medium, and one heavy) Three hotshot crews, one five-person fuel module, two Type 2 crews, 14 engines, two dozers, and one water tender, for a total of 191 personnel are assigned to the fire. A mobile fire retardant base has been set up in Buffalo to allow for quicker turnaround times to the fire for a retardant plane. Cost to date is $1.46 million.

 

[cure]

It is amazing how they fight fires on public ground verses private last week we had one start by lighting right next to our summer permit and they came in with a dozer cut a fire line had it out in about five hours on public they are so scared of leaving a mark on the ground that they would sooner spend millions and waste time thinking about it that by the time they pull their finger out of their a$$ the fire is out of control

 

[Silver]

I cant speak to those fires, but in this province we have created our own scary set of circumstances by being too eager to put fires out. Fire is natures way of taking out the trash, so preventing this just creates bigger problems down the road.
Seems to me when Yellowstone burnt a few years ago it had something like 100 plus years of fuel to burn up because no fire had been allowed to do its thing for that time because folks wanted it to stay "natural". What was natural about that?
Anyway, I'm sure every situation is different, that's just my take on things from up here where nobody lives so it doesnt matter to anyone but Canfor if trees burn down.

 

[Faster horses]

I cant speak to those fires, but in this province we have created our own scary set of circumstances by being too eager to put fires out. Fire is natures way of taking out the trash, so preventing this just creates bigger problems down the road.
Seems to me when Yellowstone burnt a few years ago it had something like 100 plus years of fuel to burn up because no fire had been allowed to do its thing for that time because folks wanted it to stay "natural". What was natural about that?
Anyway, I'm sure every situation is different, that's just my take on things from up here where nobody lives so it doesnt matter to anyone but Canfor if trees burn down.

I understand where you are coming from, Silver. But they killed the logging insdustry in this country and if the gov. had let the loggers in, even after
the forest had burned, we would all be a lot better off. So much of the
timber is old and rotting when it could have been harvested in a timely
manner for building things. It's really sad to see logging trucks bring in logs from private property that doesn't amount to much. It's hard to grow timber on the plains...

I don't know if you know it or not, but when a timber permit is let on
National Forest, any one can protest it and stop it. That's been going on
down here for a long, long time and that's why there is so much old and rotting timber. When the loggers go in, they replant the trees. It was a sad day when an industry was destroyed by government. And its' not fair when
someone in New York City can stop a timber sale in Montana or any of
the western states.

 

[floyd]

It has taken a generation to understand putting every fire out has just kicked the can down the road. It may take another generation to get a handle on it.

 

[Shortgrass]

We have allowed well intentioned, but ignorant people to destroy the lumber industry, and the forests in the process. Our forests should be kept clean by removal, and use of mature trees, and nature would not have to use her process of fire. Grazing is also a necessary tool to manage our public lands.

 

[jeff in ca]

Used to be people made money in the lumber and timber business. That was supported private industry. That has been swapped for a fire industry that is totally government supported. In my town we traded a saw mill for a Starbucks, at least the "Eco-Freaks are happy.

 

[Silver]

We have allowed well intentioned, but ignorant people to destroy the lumber industry, and the forests in the process. Our forests should be kept clean by removal, and use of mature trees, and nature would not have to use her process of fire. Grazing is also a necessary tool to manage our public lands.

The land still needs the fire, Shortgrass.

 

[Faster horses]

This fire was/is ten miles from town and headed towards it. High wind
warnings are out...

I think there is a happy medium between burning and using the rescources,
so far it seems to me pretty much one way. The town we lived in, in
sw Montana was a logging/agricultural town. As I say, the loggers
HARVEST the timber and replant the trees. We don't grow trees here
like you do in Canada, (or Washington or Oregon) Silver. Trees are hard
to come by even in the forest. They say the Pine Beetle problem would
not have been such, if the loggers had been allowed to harvest the trees
in a responsible manner.

I have a problem with someone in the east stopping a timber sale in the
west.

 

[floyd]

Well, if the timber sale in on USFS or BLM land it is land owned by the public & mis-managed by multiple abuse.

So I guess some folks are a little tired of seeing mile square clearcuts that still cannot support trees because all the soil went into the creek the first time the snow melted off it.

It would help if recently harvested units could be protected from grazing until the trees the loggers planted have a chance to get established.

Just more of that multiple abuse mgmt.

 

[Faster horses]

Well, if the timber sale in on USFS or BLM land it is land owned by the public & mis-managed by multiple abuse.

So I guess some folks are a little tired of seeing mile square clearcuts that still cannot support trees because all the soil went into the creek the first time the snow melted off it.

It would help if recently harvested units could be protected from grazing until the trees the loggers planted have a chance to get established.

Just more of that multiple abuse mgmt.

I hear you about clear-cutting, but to my knowledge that practice has
been stopped long ago. If I recall correctly, it is against the law in the USA.

 

[floyd]

Not stopped, just managed differently. Foresters try to look at the "viewshed" in visible areas. I still see some 40 ac blocks here.

The mile sq cuts were long ago & I'm glad we learned from it.

Some places in western OR look bad because BLM may have every other section in some areas. Those old RR lands like in NW MT.

Clear cut need not be a swear word, just need to do a little research before laying a sale out. Some things need clearcut.


One jusrt hopes the white man gets to it before a fire does. Harvesting is harvesting. Little of it is pretty.

 

[Shortgrass]

Managed is the key word. Managed by knowlegable people who have health of the resource in mind, rather than controlled by unknowlegable people who are emotion controlled, and don't want to damage a tree.

 

[mustang]

It is amazing how they fight fires on public ground verses private last week we had one start by lighting right next to our summer permit and they came in with a dozer cut a fire line had it out in about five hours on public they are so scared of leaving a mark on the ground that they would sooner spend millions and waste time thinking about it that by the time they pull their finger out of their a$$ the fire is out of control

I believe the same way you do. On that fire in Kane County, east of Duck Creek, the County had a dozer up there the afternoon that it started and the wonderful Forest Service wouldn't let them use it. All the local people who saw what happened said the fire could have been stopped in no more than a day or two if not for the stupidity of the Forest Service. On man I talked to said the Forest Service brought a cat in from Tennessee. You just can't get much more stupid than that. If you know a good investigative reporter, who isn't afraid of the Government, I'd like to talk with him.