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bull_ _ _ _?

Well,
I believe that stockdog and Jason are right in my case. We have had a couple inches of rain in the area over the past month or so after a bad dry spell and the grass is up green and pretty strong because of the small amounts of rain at a time. Seems like right when it's about to turn brown it rains another half inch and puts the color back in it. The Klein grass I have on the place is really doing well, too, and some of the weaker looking early winter type grasses have come up in the shade. It's cooled off some and the mads dogs and Englishmen have been joined by regular dogs and folks outside--even in the noonday sun.

Anyway, Saturday I saw a cow in the mesquites and wanted to "talk" to them so I pulled out a bag of cubes and hollered at them to round up, and they came running...

Except for Guapo (the bull) and a young cow, #63. I call her Big Red because she is as tall as any I have. They finally came busting out of the woods together a minute later with him riding her and her stopping occasionally to let previously Mr. Passive get it worked out. I fed them and in the time it took for them to clean up 50 pounds of cubes he bred her again as she stood for him. No height problems, no obvious physiological or method problems, etc. This was the first time I had seen him mount a cow, and I saw him mount her and try to mount another later in the day. The other one wasn't standing yet, though.

I think I didn't feed him enough this summer and this is my fault. I also noticed that he is filling out and his frame is growing, too. He is larger now than most of the cows now except for Big Red, a pig called LBar, and Fat Yellow.

I think it is really strange how you can know a lot of stuff and have things like this happen to you anyway. I mean, I'm not Charles Goodnight, but I know cattle and it's odd how things like this that should be so obvious to you don't hit you until somebody says, "Look, dummy."

You know, a bull usually looks pretty slick until he's real sick and my cows look pretty good, too. The way bulls are muscled and such really makes it harder to tell when a bull is stressed. He won't show rib or hip as quick, etc., and I think I just didn't realize early on that this fella was needing more than he was getting. Now, unless he is stunted, I think he will fill out and be more productive. I have fed him some and will continue to make sure he gets what he needs.

Thanks for all the advice and stories. The one about a bull only being able to mount a trough actually made me laugh out loud.
 
kwebb, the key to knowing you have a bull problem is that you would see the cows coming in heat, but, more importantly, you would see the same cows coming back in heat. 21 days from the time you saw the bull breed those cows, check them again...if he is breeding them again, get a new bull!

I disagree with feeding a bull...if he can't maintain himself or grow while with the cows, you need a better bull. The cow on the same feed has to maintain herself, raise a calf, and come in heat...all the bull has to do is breed the cows and a good one should only do that once per cow. If a bull, even a young one, is losing condition while the cows are maintaining theirs(under their heavier work load), he is a poor doing bull or was too fat and over-fed to begin with. And being fat and over-fed is the biggest problem with poor fertility bulls.

I noticed you had a cow, "a pig called LBar"...if she is out of Laurie's herd and pig fat, all your cows should be calving in 21 days. 40% of your BBU cows will require 18-24 months to rebreed...that's why I only have one BBU cow left in my herd(came from Don House), the rest are Lasater genetics.

Please don't take any offense...just my opinion, Robert
 
RobertMac:
Thanks for writing in.

I'm sorry but I am a little confused. Talk to me about your last paragraph. Yes, my cows are all BBU...and this Lbar is a 5502 daughter about 5 years old out of Lasater's herd. She has always been real barrel shaped, but breeds back fast. She just never really gets drawn down no matter what. I guess she got in real good shape at one point and has just been able to maintain that through calves.

Until now I have not yet had to wait 18 to 24 months on breed backs...and don't want to. I don't take offense at all--just want to improve my herd. Aren't the cattle you get from Lasater BBU papered?

After a couple of years of owning a cow I look at their calving dates. If they are going to calve every 18 to 24 months, we won't be buddies for long. I want them to calve every 12 to 13 months or so...if they go sooner than that they seem to have shorter calving lives, other problems, etc. I don't mind a cow trying to get her feet under her for a month while she's got a 4 month old calf on her and about to build a new one inside.
 
Most people only have their bulls with the cows 60 days some even less if they dont get bred in that time can the open cows and if they are all open can the bull or feed all of them better.
 
kwebb, I apologize...I should qualify that paragraph.

All registered Beefmasters are now papered under Beefmaster Breeders United. Before there were two organizations, Beefmaster Breeders Universal and Foundation Beefmaster Association. The Lasaters, the breed developers, were FBA (along with many other fine cattlemen) advocated raising Beefmasters for functional efficiency by selecting for Tom Lasater's Six Essential traits...disposition, fertility, weight, conformation on the hook, hardiness, and milking ability. Traits that are requirements for commercial cattlemen to make a living.

The 'Universal' breeders wanted to live in the other purebred cattle world of the showring. Many of these breeders are what Kit Pharo calls 'Plastic Pedigree Breeders'...they decide what their cattle should look like(or pedigree, or epd) and then do what ever it takes to make them work. The fad in BBU(as well as most all other breeds) is to turn them black and make them work. These breeders follow the sale consultants, not the needs of commercial cattlemen.

To be fair, this is not the philosophy of all 'Universal' breeders...but when you buy seedstock, you are buying the cattle raising philosophy of that cattleman. The 40% figure is the actual percent of my Universal cattle in my father-in-laws herd...in the same herd, same conditions, his commercials bred back in the upper 90%. In 1994 I took over the herd after he passed away. In 1998 I was fedup with this lack of performance(and the low prices) and started taking away all the crutches and buying my genetics from the Lasaters. Last year my cows bred back just over 90% on forage and hay ONLY. When you apply the pressure, the cream will rise to the top...as did the Lasater genetics.

I'll get off my soapbox now.
Take care, Robert

(I am in no way connected with the Lasaters and received no payments) :wink: :D
 
Dear RMac:
I appreciate you writing to explain those things as I didn't know about the FBA deal. A cow can have a crooked unicorn and nine teats, but if she drops a good calf every 12 months, she'll be my favorite.

And I have been guilty, too, of taking "bargains" from time to time. You think, "That 5502 daughter costs $2200, but I can get that other one there for half that."

And I'll be darned if she isn't exactly half that or less when it comes time to do her part.

I went to Lasater's sale last year and sat on my hands for fear of having to sell my pickup in the parking lot to pay for the cows. This next time around I will be prepared to do what it takes on them.
 
oh boy your talking some money when you go to the LBar sale.im going to get into reg beefmasters soon.been buildind fences an pastures for them right now.im planning on buying the best cows i can get for the money.right now im looking at the cows costing me between $2000 an $2500 a head.
 

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