Thanks mrj..we all know there's good times and bad times. I tell my sons if it wasn't for the bad, we wouldn't know how to recognize or appreciate the good. I live 120 miles north of the big fire that was in southern Kansas. The smoke made us aware. Then, we had a copycat in our area who tried to start a few fires. Fortunately, they didn't amount to anything. I got a call at 2am that the pasture where I winter my bulls was on fire. Nothing gets a person moving quicker than a call like that. Highway patrol saw the flames and called it in. 3 volunteer fire depts responded, one of which had just returned from the Anderson Creek Fire. I didn't lose much grass and was more than happy to fix the fence they cut to access the fire. Thank God for the volunteers on our rural fire departments. :clap: :tiphat: :heart:
Calving 2016
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Calving is going great so far - - - 12 heifers, 3 bulls and 3 to go - - - One bull turned in June 20th and the first calf came March 28th - - - 2 of the 3 are looking heavy and the one that is late preg checked about a month later so I expect an early May calf from her.
Nesikep
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It's been a heifer year for me too.. I'm at 11 heifers and 8 bulls.. thankfully a lot of my best cows have been the ones with heifers, and I have a cull list for fall 2017.
Around here it's been unseasonably warm for a long time.. I don't think we have had a frost since Feb sometime.. Apples are in full bloom, choke cherry is just finishing up, it was in it's glory over the weekend, with a whole lot of buzzing in there, and the smell.. it was nearly overpowering, and you could smell it from a few hundred yards away. My oldest calves are 45 days old now, and some are real thumpers.. the first steer is WIDE, and an absolute pest.. he will come and greet anyone and play with them, and every heifer seems to be well settled down.. I get mobbed whenever I go in there
Around here it's been unseasonably warm for a long time.. I don't think we have had a frost since Feb sometime.. Apples are in full bloom, choke cherry is just finishing up, it was in it's glory over the weekend, with a whole lot of buzzing in there, and the smell.. it was nearly overpowering, and you could smell it from a few hundred yards away. My oldest calves are 45 days old now, and some are real thumpers.. the first steer is WIDE, and an absolute pest.. he will come and greet anyone and play with them, and every heifer seems to be well settled down.. I get mobbed whenever I go in there
For the first time in a long time the steers are ahead of the heifers. We had some very large calves this year, thick and fat. I wonder if it wasn't the easy winter let those cows put more into their calves. They weren't all big, but there were sure some that way too big for my liking. It is good to be done though..... well same thing as done, there are 11 long faced freeloaders out there yet to calve but they are not getting much attention from me anymore 
Faster horses
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Silver said:For the first time in a long time the steers are ahead of the heifers. We had some very large calves this year, thick and fat. I wonder if it wasn't the easy winter let those cows put more into their calves. They weren't all big, but there were sure some that way too big for my liking. It is good to be done though..... well same thing as done, there are 11 long faced freeloaders out there yet to calve but they are not getting much attention from me anymore
If you will check, Silver, it is cold weather that makes calves bigger. More nutrients go to the calf when it's cold. It is probably genetic. But don't take my word for it. :gag:
Faster horses said:Silver said:For the first time in a long time the steers are ahead of the heifers. We had some very large calves this year, thick and fat. I wonder if it wasn't the easy winter let those cows put more into their calves. They weren't all big, but there were sure some that way too big for my liking. It is good to be done though..... well same thing as done, there are 11 long faced freeloaders out there yet to calve but they are not getting much attention from me anymore
If you will check, Silver, it is cold weather that makes calves bigger. More nutrients go to the calf when it's cold. It is probably genetic. But don't take my word for it. :gag:
Well, I've heard that but haven't seen the evidence to prove it. In fact I would dispute that quite strongly. I think those that make that claim haven't seen a truly cold winter. Fat cows make fat calves, that I have seen with my own eyes. Vets claim cows will put extra protein above and beyond what they need for their own use into the calf, kinda makes sense. I not talking about calves with larger frames than normal, I'm talking big, thick, fat calves.
Faster horses
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And I'm talking about research. Doesn't make any difference to me.
Here is the first research I found when doing a google search:
http://beef.unl.edu/impacts-of-cold-weather-on-calf-weights
The relationship also exists in cattle, according to a UNL study in the 1990's (Climate Affects Calf Birth Weights and Calving Difficulty,1999 Nebraska Beef Report, PDF 355KB). Researchers are still not clear why spring calving cows in colder winters have larger calf weights, but the study shows that for every 1 degree F decrease in average winter temperature, there is an increase in calf birth weights by 1 pound.
The UNL beef researchers studied the effect of colder than normal temperatures on calf birth weights. The six-year study found the coldest winter (11 degrees colder than the warmest winter) resulted in calf birth weights 11 pounds heavier when compared to the warmest winter. The exception was the winter of 1995-1996 when above normal average temperatures resulted in numerically (not statistically) heavier calf birth weights. One possible reason could be the colder than normal temperatures in January when the cows were in their last trimester (the cows calved in mid-February to April 1st).
AND ANOTHER:
http://www.iowafarmertoday.com/news/regional/cold-winters-bring-heavier-calves/article_8dd4c2c1-6fba-51d5-9788-ee62d71e82d7.html
As cold weather moves into the region, cattle producers may want to pay close attention to how far the temperature drops.
The severity of winter weather could cause calving problems come spring.
For years, Glenn Selk, Oklahoma State University (OSU) Extension cattle specialist, heard talk of large calves born after a harsh winter causing problems for cows and heifers.
Both heifer and calf genetics were the same each year and fed similarly before calving.
"Some ranchers and veterinarians alike believe that calves born after a very long, cold winter have larger calves than those born after warmer weather," he says.
Researchers from OSU and the University of Nebraska looked at the effect temperature during winter has on calf birth weights and difficulties in spring-born calves.
The University of Nebraska collected data on 400, 2-year-old heifers at its North Platte location over three years.
While calving difficulty can occur in heifers due to genetics and nutrition, researchers found that climate adds to the problem.
When a bred animal is exposed to cold temperatures, blood is concentrated internally to maintain its core body temperature.
Researchers found during prolonged periods of cold weather, the fetus might receive more nutrition because more blood flows to the uterus.
Selk explains, "During hot weather blood is shunted away from internal organs toward outer extremities to dissipate heat, while the opposite is the case in very cold weather with blood flow directed toward internal organs in an effort to conserve heat and maintain body temperature."
The result, he says, is the change in maternal blood flow may affect fetal growth in a small way, but "result in a measurable difference."
Other research from the University of Georgia attribute the increase in fetal weight during winter to increased feed intake from supplemental feeding by the cow.
Whether it is redirection of blood or supplemental feeding, or a little of both, researchers found calf weights did increase after a cold winter.
The Nebraska research shows calves averaged 11 lbs. heavier with a 22 percent increase in calving difficulty when temperatures and wind chills were 10 to 11 degrees colder.
To help cattle producers estimate potential problems associated to weather, the researchers concluded calf birth weights will increase one pound, and calving difficulty will increase by 2.6 percentage points for each 1 degree reduction in average temperature
Here is the first research I found when doing a google search:
http://beef.unl.edu/impacts-of-cold-weather-on-calf-weights
The relationship also exists in cattle, according to a UNL study in the 1990's (Climate Affects Calf Birth Weights and Calving Difficulty,1999 Nebraska Beef Report, PDF 355KB). Researchers are still not clear why spring calving cows in colder winters have larger calf weights, but the study shows that for every 1 degree F decrease in average winter temperature, there is an increase in calf birth weights by 1 pound.
The UNL beef researchers studied the effect of colder than normal temperatures on calf birth weights. The six-year study found the coldest winter (11 degrees colder than the warmest winter) resulted in calf birth weights 11 pounds heavier when compared to the warmest winter. The exception was the winter of 1995-1996 when above normal average temperatures resulted in numerically (not statistically) heavier calf birth weights. One possible reason could be the colder than normal temperatures in January when the cows were in their last trimester (the cows calved in mid-February to April 1st).
AND ANOTHER:
http://www.iowafarmertoday.com/news/regional/cold-winters-bring-heavier-calves/article_8dd4c2c1-6fba-51d5-9788-ee62d71e82d7.html
As cold weather moves into the region, cattle producers may want to pay close attention to how far the temperature drops.
The severity of winter weather could cause calving problems come spring.
For years, Glenn Selk, Oklahoma State University (OSU) Extension cattle specialist, heard talk of large calves born after a harsh winter causing problems for cows and heifers.
Both heifer and calf genetics were the same each year and fed similarly before calving.
"Some ranchers and veterinarians alike believe that calves born after a very long, cold winter have larger calves than those born after warmer weather," he says.
Researchers from OSU and the University of Nebraska looked at the effect temperature during winter has on calf birth weights and difficulties in spring-born calves.
The University of Nebraska collected data on 400, 2-year-old heifers at its North Platte location over three years.
While calving difficulty can occur in heifers due to genetics and nutrition, researchers found that climate adds to the problem.
When a bred animal is exposed to cold temperatures, blood is concentrated internally to maintain its core body temperature.
Researchers found during prolonged periods of cold weather, the fetus might receive more nutrition because more blood flows to the uterus.
Selk explains, "During hot weather blood is shunted away from internal organs toward outer extremities to dissipate heat, while the opposite is the case in very cold weather with blood flow directed toward internal organs in an effort to conserve heat and maintain body temperature."
The result, he says, is the change in maternal blood flow may affect fetal growth in a small way, but "result in a measurable difference."
Other research from the University of Georgia attribute the increase in fetal weight during winter to increased feed intake from supplemental feeding by the cow.
Whether it is redirection of blood or supplemental feeding, or a little of both, researchers found calf weights did increase after a cold winter.
The Nebraska research shows calves averaged 11 lbs. heavier with a 22 percent increase in calving difficulty when temperatures and wind chills were 10 to 11 degrees colder.
To help cattle producers estimate potential problems associated to weather, the researchers concluded calf birth weights will increase one pound, and calving difficulty will increase by 2.6 percentage points for each 1 degree reduction in average temperature
Faster horses
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One more little thing....you said "Vets claim cows will put extra protein above and beyond what they need for their own use into the calf, kinda makes sense. I not talking about calves with larger frames than normal, I'm talking big, thick, fat calves."
Protein makes calves strong, not necessarily fat....same as with other animals....and people. It's energy that tends to fatten.
I know in our country you can't get enough energy into range cattle. It is easy to meet the protein needs, not so easy to meet
the energy needs.
Protein makes calves strong, not necessarily fat....same as with other animals....and people. It's energy that tends to fatten.
I know in our country you can't get enough energy into range cattle. It is easy to meet the protein needs, not so easy to meet
the energy needs.
Those are wonderful studies but I doubt they were done in a climate anything like we have here so I will reserve judgement on that for now. I don't believe it's genetics, maybe it's not the weather. I'm open to possibilities. Could be just an odd year.
I was out in the tractor today thinking about this deal and came up with a theory I like. Nearly all of these large calves this year came from those older easy keeping cows. They are cows that always come out of a tough winter in good shape. This winter was the warmest anyone around here has ever seen and this spring these easy keepers came in fat. I noticed that after pulling these calves there was actually fat pieces laying on the floor amongst the afterbirth.
These types of statistics may well work in typically more warmer climates than here, but I do have enough experience to put no stock in them for up here. At least not to the degree quoted here.
Protein makes muscle. Like I said, these calves are thick. Therefore it is logical to agree with the vet, extra protein has went to the calf and added size. Fat is another deal.
I was out in the tractor today thinking about this deal and came up with a theory I like. Nearly all of these large calves this year came from those older easy keeping cows. They are cows that always come out of a tough winter in good shape. This winter was the warmest anyone around here has ever seen and this spring these easy keepers came in fat. I noticed that after pulling these calves there was actually fat pieces laying on the floor amongst the afterbirth.
These types of statistics may well work in typically more warmer climates than here, but I do have enough experience to put no stock in them for up here. At least not to the degree quoted here.
Protein makes muscle. Like I said, these calves are thick. Therefore it is logical to agree with the vet, extra protein has went to the calf and added size. Fat is another deal.
Nesikep
Well-known member
The C section heifer I had this year wasn't fat, it was just a darned big calf (and there's no history of big calves in that maternal or paternal line)
I have other big cows that routinely make huge calves, no matter what they're bred to, and my climate is far warmer than Silver's... We had a mild winter this year too, only used 2 cords of wood to heat the house, and yet here I am, I had a couple 130 lb bulls and several 110 lb heifers.
There was ONE bull calf that was born FAT, momma wasn't fat, BCS of 5 or so, which is what I aim for. As long as the cows can handle the calf, I don't care how much they weigh, the calves born big are always bigger in the fall if they have the milk, and on heavy milking cows, their udders suffer less from being over inflated when they have a bigger calf with a bigger appetite.
I have other big cows that routinely make huge calves, no matter what they're bred to, and my climate is far warmer than Silver's... We had a mild winter this year too, only used 2 cords of wood to heat the house, and yet here I am, I had a couple 130 lb bulls and several 110 lb heifers.
There was ONE bull calf that was born FAT, momma wasn't fat, BCS of 5 or so, which is what I aim for. As long as the cows can handle the calf, I don't care how much they weigh, the calves born big are always bigger in the fall if they have the milk, and on heavy milking cows, their udders suffer less from being over inflated when they have a bigger calf with a bigger appetite.
I am down to 1 cow ( #16 ) left to calve - - - the oldest cow in the herd but she is not late till June 1st . 17 calves on the ground, 13 heifers and 4 bull so far. I went about 4 years where I could not get at least 10% heifers on a bet! But # 16 has never had a bull so most of my herd is her daughters or grand daughters.
I feel she will make the June 1st cutoff but I am just ready to be done.
I feel she will make the June 1st cutoff but I am just ready to be done.
Nesikep
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I have 2 left to go (they're pretty close), 12 heifers and 9 steers so far.. I have an entire cow 'family' that had ONLY heifers this year (7 out of 7).. It's a good family, and I think 4 of them are going into the replacement pen
Really TAME calves this year, all of them are sucks for attention.
Really TAME calves this year, all of them are sucks for attention.
All finished here. oh yeah, except for the 3 heifers that I couldn't tell last year if they were short bred or not bred. Put them in with the bull for one cycle thinking they could go to the fall herd. Yep..they're going there IF they ever calve. They're bagged up but that's it. Now, the calves on heifers are having lots of eye trouble. Isn't it early for pink eye? I was almost evicted when I came home with a PneuDart rifle but that thing has been wonderful for treating these calves. Lots of heifers here this year also. Bull turn out this week and it all starts over :tiphat:
Knock on wood, but I have not had a case of pink-eye since I went on a year round mineral program and I also rotate pastures - - - this keeps the weeds down since I mow the pastures after the cows have eaten what they want. If you keep the cattle off about 6 weeks from the time you clip the weeds the good grasses will go to seed and the cows will eat the seed heads of their liking and reseed for you.
I held my bull out till June 20th last year and probably will again this year - - - my vet also raises cattle and is going to hold his bulls out till the middle of July, feels the calves get a better start when on strong grass - - - this year it would have been a good option here as the April weather was terrible but the calves are all doing good. March was good this year so you just roll the dice and do the best you can.
I held my bull out till June 20th last year and probably will again this year - - - my vet also raises cattle and is going to hold his bulls out till the middle of July, feels the calves get a better start when on strong grass - - - this year it would have been a good option here as the April weather was terrible but the calves are all doing good. March was good this year so you just roll the dice and do the best you can.
George, the way things are going for me this year, if I kept my bulls home until June 20th, my damn neighbor's bulls would have all my cows bred. They were in with my cows last week. I penned them and called the guy. He apologized and picked them up BUT he turned them back out and today, there they were again. It was more difficult to pen them today but I got'er done. Called 'the neighbor'-that term is stretched thin- and told him I was tired of it and didn't want to find his bulls in my pasture again. This guy is an order buyer and these are sale barn bulls...you bet I'm mad Too many diseases to have this happening.
Too many diseases to have this happening.I have no neighbor with fence line contact - - - one of the advantages of buying all the ground from one road to the next. Sometimes my son and I have paid more than we could justify to get adjoining ground and more than that to keep others out.
The last 38 acres we decided not to pay more than $5,000 per acre but when a large farmer from the county south started bidding we paid $6,500 to keep him from getting a toe hold in this area. Don't know if it was wise or not but on that small an acreage it will not break the bank.
The last 38 acres we decided not to pay more than $5,000 per acre but when a large farmer from the county south started bidding we paid $6,500 to keep him from getting a toe hold in this area. Don't know if it was wise or not but on that small an acreage it will not break the bank.
You need to get a more than adequate fence charger on at least the top wire. Just put the existing wire(s) on insulators and check regularly. You'll be glad you did.DejaVu said:George, the way things are going for me this year, if I kept my bulls home until June 20th, my damn neighbor's bulls would have all my cows bred. They were in with my cows last week. I penned them and called the guy. He apologized and picked them up BUT he turned them back out and today, there they were again. It was more difficult to pen them today but I got'er done. Called 'the neighbor'-that term is stretched thin- and told him I was tired of it and didn't want to find his bulls in my pasture again. This guy is an order buyer and these are sale barn bulls...you bet I'm mad
Yes Traveler, that's my next step. The wire is ready. I'll have to put in a few posts along the way. I have a 12 volt solar. I expect to have it done by the weekend. It's a little over a mile. I don't see any other way to put an end to this short of building new fence and the absentee owner won't go for that. I hate to get too nasty with this guy as I live 35 miles from my pasture and he does keep an eye on things for me. Besides, I never know when the tables will be turned.
# 16 held true to form - - - 14 heifers and 4 bulls to finish out the season, #16 has just had her 12th calf and every one was a heifer. I have her and 2 half sisters of her and they are the oldest cows in the herd, doing great but I know it is time to replace them.
gcreekrch
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47 official days of calving, 14 left.