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Cardon Credits

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MikeMcc said:
Hi
Does any one know about these carbon credits? What are the good and bad parts??
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You have to sell your credits threw a "Aggregater" as they sell lump or parcels of credits rather then individuals doing it. ie Farmers Union in some states. Most places have set rates for zero till, wetlands and some for enhanced range land. Some area can't seem to get it on native prairie just seeded perennials.
You need records for the practices that you use.
I have heard that carbon prices have come down with the price of oil and steel.

I look forward to others input and if anyone has got some sold.
 
In my opinion it is nothing but extortion!!!
they buy carbon credits from you (low price)
force a business to buy the credits (high price)
and pocket the difference--

and what difference does it make??
does only the grass and trees that are signed up sequester the carbon??
Do they sequester carbon at a higher rate than they already are??

it isn't a free check-- the businesses must raise their prices to stay in business and we all end up paying more for products.
Remember with the difference going into the pockets of people who produce nothing, just buy and sell credits.

The only thing accomplished is filling some fat cats pockets.
Don't be scared by all the global warming mumbo jumbo, this is only about money.
They haven't found a way yet, that I know of, to force us to sell, if we all hold out maybe we can stop this process.
to many times we feel helpless to stop this kind of thing, I think this is one time we can, if we just can look past the small check and hold to principles!!!

THINK IT THROUGH!!! Who stands to benefit the most from this??
who ultimatly pays for it??
 
Lonecowboy said:
In my opinion it is nothing but extortion!!!
they buy carbon credits from you (low price)
force a business to buy the credits (high price)
and pocket the difference--

and what difference does it make??
does only the grass and trees that are signed up sequester the carbon??
Do they sequester carbon at a higher rate than they already are??

it isn't a free check-- the businesses must raise their prices to stay in business and we all end up paying more for products.
Remember with the difference going into the pockets of people who produce nothing, just buy and sell credits.

The only thing accomplished is filling some fat cats pockets.
Don't be scared by all the global warming mumbo jumbo, this is only about money.
They haven't found a way yet, that I know of, to force us to sell, if we all hold out maybe we can stop this process.
to many times we feel helpless to stop this kind of thing, I think this is one time we can, if we just can look past the small check and hold to principles!!!

THINK IT THROUGH!!! Who stands to benefit the most from this??
who ultimatly pays for it??
Click to expand...

:agree: If they force this cr@p on me I will go to jail first.
 
I probably won't change anybodies mind but here goes.

The public as a whole benefits from good ranching practices. Every thing from erosion control to wetlands, providing habitat for endanger plants and animals and hunting, clean water,and air as well as carbon sequestration are results from sustainable ranching.
Why do ranchers have to provide to the publics greater good without recieving something back for their management skills.
I under stand carbon credits is political but credits are being traded and ranchers can qualify for payment for doing what they do best. Grazing cows.
 
Does anybody know what sorts of requirements our industry would be subjected to meeting under this program? I guess what I'm asking is would agriculture have to buy credits to offset any "global damage" our industry apparently creates? Would we be receiving some sort of payment and than turn around and have to buy credits to offset our so-called polluting practices? Would buying/selling these credits be an admission that global warming is an absolute truth?

I think is sounds like a bunch of BS myself, but I need to learn more about it. I think ranchers should be able to benefit from providing good natural resources and habitat for endangered species :roll: ... ranchers should be able to profit from good practices, but this sounds like it may lead to more problems in the future.

I look forward to more explanation on this as well :D .
 
I'm with you on this, Big Muddy. My understanding is that the carbon credit thing is going to be required of the businesses, whether we get involved or not. Right? Wrong? Who knows?

The sales of credits by ag producers has been talked about for many years now. Does anyone know a credible source for information about the process? Especially if, or how, aggies could sell them while also protesting that we do not buy the idea of man made polution being the only, or even the biggest contributor to global polution, ie, who are we to think humans contribute more to air polution than volcanoes???

When are we going to have credible, HONEST assessments of polution by ag, huge city populations, factories, wild life, cows in places where they are worshipped and move about and procreate at will while contributing nothing to the world, natural phenoma such as volcanoes, floods, earthquakes, and more???

I'm no fan of F.U., so am pleased that Farm Bureau is getting involved in carbon sequestration. Will try to lean more and post links to their info.

mrj
 
Big Muddy rancher said:
I probably won't change anybodies mind but here goes.

The public as a whole benefits from good ranching practices. Every thing from erosion control to wetlands, providing habitat for endanger plants and animals and hunting, clean water,and air as well as carbon sequestration are results from sustainable ranching.
Why do ranchers have to provide to the publics greater good without recieving something back for their management skills.
I under stand carbon credits is political but credits are being traded and ranchers can qualify for payment for doing what they do best. Grazing cows.
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BMR- I agree that everything benefits fron good ranching practices, no argument there. We are all called to be good stuards of the land.
Do carbon credits stop/slow pollution?? No
Do carbon credits make plants sequester more carbon than they already naturally are?? No

carbon credits can only be traded if we first sell them??
At first it seems like free money for what we are already doing, but think it through, who pays for it??
We all will with higher consumer costs, and then when will we be FORCED to buy carbon credits back for the pollution we produce.

WITH SOMEONE IN THE MIDDLE POCKETING THE DIFFERENCE

I know it is the history of agriculture to sell low and buy high and pay the freight both ways, but right now it seems like this is one time we don't have to. it is our land!!
If we sell out to this because it isn't our business today--
who will stand with us tomorrow when it's us??
Look past the small check of today, at the bigger bills coming tomorrow.
You're right it is political--they're trying to buy us off now, and getting it all back plus a whole lot more later!!!
the political part is making it legal!!
 
Lonecowboy said:
Big Muddy rancher said:
I probably won't change anybodies mind but here goes.

The public as a whole benefits from good ranching practices. Every thing from erosion control to wetlands, providing habitat for endanger plants and animals and hunting, clean water,and air as well as carbon sequestration are results from sustainable ranching.
Why do ranchers have to provide to the publics greater good without recieving something back for their management skills.
I under stand carbon credits is political but credits are being traded and ranchers can qualify for payment for doing what they do best. Grazing cows.
Click to expand...

BMR- I agree that everything benefits fron good ranching practices, no argument there. We are all called to be good stuards of the land.
Do carbon credits stop/slow pollution?? No
Do carbon credits make plants sequester more carbon than they already naturally are?? No

carbon credits can only be traded if we first sell them??
At first it seems like free money for what we are already doing, but think it through, who pays for it??
We all will with higher consumer costs, and then when will we be FORCED to buy carbon credits back for the pollution we produce.

WITH SOMEONE IN THE MIDDLE POCKETING THE DIFFERENCE

I know it is the history of agriculture to sell low and buy high and pay the freight both ways, but right now it seems like this is one time we don't have to. it is our land!!
If we sell out to this because it isn't our business today--
who will stand with us tomorrow when it's us??
Look past the small check of today, at the bigger bills coming tomorrow.
You're right it is political--they're trying to buy us off now, and getting it all back plus a whole lot more later!!!
the political part is making it legal!!
Click to expand...
Lonecowboy, I knew you were a smart guy when Kolo and knownothing thought so lowly of you! :wink: :wink: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Everyone, write this down and put it on your refrigerator...

HARD WORKING MIDDLE CLASS CONSUMERS PAY ALL TAXES!!!!!!!!!

mrj, surely you have seen where the environmental wackos claim that livestock produce more greenhouse gases than automobiles. You gonna have to kill all your cows before you can collect on any carbon credits!!!!!
 
So does this all mean we can be charged for breathing?
I mean after all we expel carbon dioxide when we exhale.

From what I have heard and read on this pile of BS is if you are rich, like Al Gore, you can buy off any critism of how big your house is and how much energy you use to live in it.
It just seems this pile of manure is getting bigger and bigger.

So what is next? Fines for breathing, driving, pets and other things?
 
Carbon Credits is a farce :!: Carbon credits is a Farce :!: :!: It does nothing for the enviroment. Its a stupid idea that some people are making buckets of money on. It is the easy way out for business to pollute and not change their habbits. Its one of the best legal CON games on the go right now :mad:
 
You get paid for sequestering carbon, it really is that simple. You can measure the tons per acre before and after a change in management, or predict what it would be based on a change in management. One example is switching from conventional tillage to low or no tillage. Switching from annual crops to grazed perennials will net the biggest gain, if you already intesively graze then you will find it difficult to have a big gain. The irony is that you could plow that intensively grazed land to release the carbon, so that you can return it to grazing and re-sequster the carbon. It is in fact quantifiable, and there is the prediction that one day the crop you raise may be insignificant to the check you get for carbon sequestered, although that was before talks of a depression.
 
Ben H said:
You get paid for sequestering carbon, it really is that simple. You can measure the tons per acre before and after a change in management, or predict what it would be based on a change in management. One example is switching from conventional tillage to low or no tillage. Switching from annual crops to grazed perennials will net the biggest gain, if you already intesively graze then you will find it difficult to have a big gain. The irony is that you could plow that intensively grazed land to release the carbon, so that you can return it to grazing and re-sequster the carbon. It is in fact quantifiable, and there is the prediction that one day the crop you raise may be insignificant to the check you get for carbon sequestered, although that was before talks of a depression.
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You just proved my point Ben . You may already have good management practises but not get much of a reward. So you plow up the North 40 and get it blowing onto the fenceline them seed it back down. All of a sudden we are great keepers of the land and can qualify for a cheque :lol: er minus the Broker Commission of course. :wink: Just one queston has anybody seen or received one of these cheques?
 
I've looked into it, there is a private company called The Chicago Carbon Exchange, I think that's what it's called. Not sure how it's working here, but it's huge in England and especially Austraila from what I understand.
I don't agree with the idea, but being a capitalist I can think of many ways to profit from it as a farmer.
 
Ben, you make the right point...getting the carbon credit check will mean you submitting to their management practices and if, like you and I, are doing things the right way already...we get no benefit!!!
Mankind being able to control climate change is a hoax!!!!
 
RobertMac, certainly I know what envirowacko's CLAIM about cattle and greenhouse gasses. Do you think mere claims are scientifically verifiable?

mrj
 
Just get a hold of Al Gore he will be able to set everybody straight on carbon credits and carbon trading. After all didn't he invent the internet and global warming!
 
WHile Gore may not have invented hot air, he sure does sprew plenty of it!!!

mrj
 
mrj said:
RobertMac, certainly I know what envirowacko's CLAIM about cattle and greenhouse gasses. Do you think mere claims are scientifically verifiable?

mrj
Click to expand...
mrj, there is a lot of "politically correct" and "industry purchased" science that is claimed to be verifiable. This is done by accepting a conclusion and then developing or selectively using only the data that supports the desired conclusion.

Man-made global climate change is the "PC" conclusion...nature's factors that cause climate change are the undesired and ignored data.

The war on saturated fats is another example...after thirty years of a campaign against eating saturated fats(stop eating red meat according to the MD's and diet dictocrats)and promoting eating more grain products to improve the health of the USA population, the population is more obese that ever!!!!!! The processed food industry that makes money using cheap grain products has "purchased" the science and being against using animals for food is "PC"!!!
 

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