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HATS OFF TO R-CALF

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Tommy

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HATS OFF TO R-CALF - 8/29/05
Posted on DTN by ProgressiveAg.com


R-Calf, the new kid on the block with cattlemen's groups, is deserving of a very special thank you from US cattlemen as they have been primarily responsible for 3 of the most profitable year's of cattlemen's careers!!! Their steps to prevent the Canadian border opening were of primary importance to keeping US cattle prices up almost 30% from prior levels FOR 3 YEARS!!! This was not only critical to pushing and keeping cattle prices at all time highs for 3 years, but also provided a glimpse into the real impacts of Canadian cattle imports into the US. This has far reaching implications not only for US trade policy on livestock, but also many other domestic issues concerning trade.

Not only is the group responsible for huge profits in cattle, but they also are inspirational examples of what can be done with limited resources, defying Presidents and large companies of the power plays common against smaller farm players. Lets review the impacts and their results on how the US looks at trade policy.

First, R-Calf defied the Bush administrations 'Big Boy' USDA tactics by not listening to their power plays, and instead pulling a power play of their own over the big, bad USDA. Its got to be inspirational to the little guy in the US, as they had the guts to stand up to supposedly insurmountable odds to hold cattle in Canada (much longer than this analyst ever expected!). Whether you agree with their views or not, you can't help but admit they accomplished much with their little guy mentality. In the course of their stubborn refusal to give up, they ended up teaching a lot of "know it all", PH. D. Economists (and market analysts) a few things new about economics. While most of us expected the Canadian border to open after 1-3 months (as USDA announced), instead R-Calf kept it closed for 3 years or more. Contrary to all the expert economist opinions, it kept cattle prices up 30% from previous levels for the entire period (and still prices are high). Even though they lost in the end (USDA did finally get the border opened), the money made by cattlemen during the 3 years was well worth the battle. After all, most cattlemen made more money in each of the past 3 years than they had in their entire careers to that point!!! Profits must have been up 1000% (yes, one thousand percent, not one hundred) or more in each of the past 3 years, and only 'creative accounting' for tax reasons can be much different than that. Remember, a 30% increase in price from a 1% profit margin is a 30x increase in profits!!! Yes, little price differences in small margin products are important!!!

2) While economists and the government likes to tell us that free trade is good for the US, there can now be no doubt in anyones mind that free trade is bad for cattlemen. Whether you’re a Land Grant University trained economist or not, you can't help but admit that all your professors were wrong, and the supposedly uneducated "cowboys" were right. Cattle imports from Canada are killing our US cattle price. A 9% cut in total US beef availability seems to have produced a 30% rise in prices. And this didn't just occur for a short period of time, instead it lasted 3 years!!! That puts the long term elasticity of demand at about 3.2 for cattlemen, meaning that for every 1% drop in supplies, there is a 3-4% rise in prices. Clearly, cattlemen are not better off by free trade. This not only has implications for cattlemen, but also groups such as sugar producers, steel mills, textiles, labor unions, and all other groups with an interest against free trade. This little cowboy insurgency could embolden special interest industry groups against free trade. Big time economists (even the likes of Allen Greenspan who lambasted trade protectionists last week) who speak out for free trade might not make as big an impact as before. Will the 'cowboys' of the world listen now when University economists (who have never seen a cow) try to explain how free trade benefits US consumers so much??? Will they care about US consumers when they are losing money on the farm??? It was almost laughable how some economists and government people tried to insist that high cattle prices would in the end be bad for cattlemen. Who are they trying to kid??? If the Sec. of Ag can convince cattle farmers that high prices are bad for them, they should be in sales (like selling eskimo's ice???), not government work!!!

3) Although economists are good at 'proving' that free trade is good for the US economy and consumers, will producers of competing goods with imports care as much in the future??? While this might embolden producer groups in import heavy industries, perhaps Mr. Greenspan is right, it could hurt the US economy in the end??? But still, the politics of free trade might have suffered a severe setback.

4) How many land grant economists will come out with research studies the next few years explaining "it wasn't the closed border" that pushed cattle prices higher for 3 years??? Odds are, lots!!! But no matter whether you claim Atkins diets, South Beach diets, new demand sources, changes in world markets or wealth, or whatever else economists can dream up - who will believe it? The facts are that cattle prices never were even close to recent 3 year price levels, and close the Canadian border (even with US mad cow cases shutting down US exports) and prices soar. Atkins diet crazes were started before the price surge, and ended long before the border opened. How can that be the reason for cattle price rises??? The odds of any other event catapulting cattle prices that much are slim to none, no matter how many economists try to refute it. Common sense is still common sense! Any other conclusion should be laughed out of existance!!!

5) Power in cattle groups may shift considerably toward R-Calf and away from other groups. Only incompetence at R-CALF for many years can cause them to lose the loyalty they so clearly deserve from cow-calf producers. It'll be interesting to see if they will be that incompetent. Perhaps it may not be a bad idea for R-CALF to hire their own economists, so they can gain credibility with the rest of the world like they have with cow-calf producers???

Hats of to R-Calf, responsible for the highest incomes for cattlemen ever!!! Now what will they do with their new found legitimacy???
 

HAY MAKER

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Tommy said:
HATS OFF TO R-CALF - 8/29/05
Posted on DTN by ProgressiveAg.com


R-Calf, the new kid on the block with cattlemen's groups, is deserving of a very special thank you from US cattlemen as they have been primarily responsible for 3 of the most profitable year's of cattlemen's careers!!! Their steps to prevent the Canadian border opening were of primary importance to keeping US cattle prices up almost 30% from prior levels FOR 3 YEARS!!! This was not only critical to pushing and keeping cattle prices at all time highs for 3 years, but also provided a glimpse into the real impacts of Canadian cattle imports into the US. This has far reaching implications not only for US trade policy on livestock, but also many other domestic issues concerning trade.

Not only is the group responsible for huge profits in cattle, but they also are inspirational examples of what can be done with limited resources, defying Presidents and large companies of the power plays common against smaller farm players. Lets review the impacts and their results on how the US looks at trade policy.

First, R-Calf defied the Bush administrations 'Big Boy' USDA tactics by not listening to their power plays, and instead pulling a power play of their own over the big, bad USDA. Its got to be inspirational to the little guy in the US, as they had the guts to stand up to supposedly insurmountable odds to hold cattle in Canada (much longer than this analyst ever expected!). Whether you agree with their views or not, you can't help but admit they accomplished much with their little guy mentality. In the course of their stubborn refusal to give up, they ended up teaching a lot of "know it all", PH. D. Economists (and market analysts) a few things new about economics. While most of us expected the Canadian border to open after 1-3 months (as USDA announced), instead R-Calf kept it closed for 3 years or more. Contrary to all the expert economist opinions, it kept cattle prices up 30% from previous levels for the entire period (and still prices are high). Even though they lost in the end (USDA did finally get the border opened), the money made by cattlemen during the 3 years was well worth the battle. After all, most cattlemen made more money in each of the past 3 years than they had in their entire careers to that point!!! Profits must have been up 1000% (yes, one thousand percent, not one hundred) or more in each of the past 3 years, and only 'creative accounting' for tax reasons can be much different than that. Remember, a 30% increase in price from a 1% profit margin is a 30x increase in profits!!! Yes, little price differences in small margin products are important!!!

2) While economists and the government likes to tell us that free trade is good for the US, there can now be no doubt in anyones mind that free trade is bad for cattlemen. Whether you’re a Land Grant University trained economist or not, you can't help but admit that all your professors were wrong, and the supposedly uneducated "cowboys" were right. Cattle imports from Canada are killing our US cattle price. A 9% cut in total US beef availability seems to have produced a 30% rise in prices. And this didn't just occur for a short period of time, instead it lasted 3 years!!! That puts the long term elasticity of demand at about 3.2 for cattlemen, meaning that for every 1% drop in supplies, there is a 3-4% rise in prices. Clearly, cattlemen are not better off by free trade. This not only has implications for cattlemen, but also groups such as sugar producers, steel mills, textiles, labor unions, and all other groups with an interest against free trade. This little cowboy insurgency could embolden special interest industry groups against free trade. Big time economists (even the likes of Allen Greenspan who lambasted trade protectionists last week) who speak out for free trade might not make as big an impact as before. Will the 'cowboys' of the world listen now when University economists (who have never seen a cow) try to explain how free trade benefits US consumers so much??? Will they care about US consumers when they are losing money on the farm??? It was almost laughable how some economists and government people tried to insist that high cattle prices would in the end be bad for cattlemen. Who are they trying to kid??? If the Sec. of Ag can convince cattle farmers that high prices are bad for them, they should be in sales (like selling eskimo's ice???), not government work!!!

3) Although economists are good at 'proving' that free trade is good for the US economy and consumers, will producers of competing goods with imports care as much in the future??? While this might embolden producer groups in import heavy industries, perhaps Mr. Greenspan is right, it could hurt the US economy in the end??? But still, the politics of free trade might have suffered a severe setback.

4) How many land grant economists will come out with research studies the next few years explaining "it wasn't the closed border" that pushed cattle prices higher for 3 years??? Odds are, lots!!! But no matter whether you claim Atkins diets, South Beach diets, new demand sources, changes in world markets or wealth, or whatever else economists can dream up - who will believe it? The facts are that cattle prices never were even close to recent 3 year price levels, and close the Canadian border (even with US mad cow cases shutting down US exports) and prices soar. Atkins diet crazes were started before the price surge, and ended long before the border opened. How can that be the reason for cattle price rises??? The odds of any other event catapulting cattle prices that much are slim to none, no matter how many economists try to refute it. Common sense is still common sense! Any other conclusion should be laughed out of existance!!!

5) Power in cattle groups may shift considerably toward R-Calf and away from other groups. Only incompetence at R-CALF for many years can cause them to lose the loyalty they so clearly deserve from cow-calf producers. It'll be interesting to see if they will be that incompetent. Perhaps it may not be a bad idea for R-CALF to hire their own economists, so they can gain credibility with the rest of the world like they have with cow-calf producers???

Hats of to R-Calf, responsible for the highest incomes for cattlemen ever!!! Now what will they do with their new found legitimacy???
[/
quote]

Make damn sure we are never decieved by the NCBA again,and never ever let packers controll the cattle industry......................good luck
 

Big Muddy rancher

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More BS from R-CALF. The border was only close for a little over 2 years so how could they claim . The border was open to UTM beef from Canada 4 months after it was closed.

With the opening statements of this article such a blatent lies how can you read any farther and expect to find any TRUTH.
 

HAY MAKER

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Big Muddy rancher said:
More BS from R-CALF. The border was only close for a little over 2 years so how could they claim . The border was open to UTM beef from Canada 4 months after it was closed.

With the opening statements of this article such a blatent lies how can you read any farther and expect to find any TRUTH.

Big dummie,every time I read one of your posts,I don't feel so bad about my 6th grade education. :D :D :D ....................good luck canuckle head.
 

Big Muddy rancher

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HAY MAKER said:
Big Muddy rancher said:
More BS from R-CALF. The border was only close for a little over 2 years so how could they claim . The border was open to UTM beef from Canada 4 months after it was closed.

With the opening statements of this article such a blatent lies how can you read any farther and expect to find any TRUTH.

Big dummie,every time I read one of your posts,I don't feel so bad about my 6th grade education. :D :D :D ....................good luck canuckle
head.



Names and ridicule. I see you couldn't back the article up with proof. Typical. Is that you just being vague again. :cowboy:
 
A

Anonymous

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Their steps to prevent the Canadian border opening were of primary importance to keeping US cattle prices up almost 30% from prior levels FOR 3 YEARS!!! This was not only critical to pushing and keeping cattle prices at all time highs for 3 years, but also provided a glimpse into the real impacts of Canadian cattle imports into the US. This has far reaching implications not only for US trade policy on livestock, but also many other domestic issues concerning trade.


If the Canadian border was the primary reason for 30% higher cattle prices, why hasn't cattle prices fallen 30% since the Canadian border is now open?

Why did fat cattle prices continue to rally when Canadian beef imports resumed which was about 50% of normal Canadian imports?


Those who operate on emotion and not fact (Hayseed, Tommy, Sandman, OT, etc.) will believe this article without reservations.

Those who know the facts of the cattle market can see what a pack of lies this really is.


Gosh would I love a chance to debate this clown on R-CULT's impact on our cattle prices.

The Canadian border is open now, WHERE ARE U.S. FEEDER CALF PRICES???? About $10 off the high, not 30% less as this clown claimed.


~SH~
 

HAY MAKER

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Big Muddy rancher said:
HAY MAKER said:
Big Muddy rancher said:
More BS from R-CALF. The border was only close for a little over 2 years so how could they claim . The border was open to UTM beef from Canada 4 months after it was closed.

With the opening statements of this article such a blatent lies how can you read any farther and expect to find any TRUTH.

Big dummie,every time I read one of your posts,I don't feel so bad about my 6th grade education. :D :D :D ....................good luck canuckle
head.



Names and ridicule. I see you couldn't back the article up with proof. Typical. Is that you just being vague again. :cowboy:

That's a little better, now what kinda proof do you wanna see? You might want to reread the article?................good luck PS is the border still closed?
 

Big Muddy rancher

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HAY MAKER said:
Big Muddy rancher said:
HAY MAKER said:
Big dummie,every time I read one of your posts,I don't feel so bad about my 6th grade education. :D :D :D ....................good luck canuckle
head.



Names and ridicule. I see you couldn't back the article up with proof. Typical. Is that you just being vague again. :cowboy:

That's a little better, now what kinda proof do you wanna see? You might want to reread the article?................good luck PS is the border still closed?



Have your prices collapsed? The border is open to UTM Beef, Fats and feeders. Maybe you hadn't heard that. Didn't R-CALF tell you?


You couldn't tell that the border was open by your prices? Come on Haymaker even Canadian sixth graders aren't as gulliable as you. :cowboy:
 

HAY MAKER

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Big Muddy rancher said:
HAY MAKER said:
Big Muddy rancher said:
Names and ridicule. I see you couldn't back the article up with proof. Typical. Is that you just being vague again. :cowboy:

That's a little better, now what kinda proof do you wanna see? You might want to reread the article?................good luck PS is the border still closed?



Have your prices collapsed? The border is open to UTM Beef, Fats and feeders. Maybe you hadn't heard that. Didn't R-CALF tell you?


You couldn't tell that the border was open by your prices? Come on Haymaker even Canadian sixth graders aren't as gulliable as you. :cowboy:


Just making a point,Big Dummie you were reading things into the post that were not there................good luck PS is the border still closed?
 

rkaiser

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Articles like this are why Rcalf will never become the voice of the informed American producer.

Drum beating chickenshit protectionist's like this guy may fool some people, but most see through the these advertizing campaigns and in the end Rcalf will be hurt by them. AGAIN.
 

Sandhusker

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How much Canadain cattle/beef was coming down before the closure and how much is coming down now?
 
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Sandman: "How much Canadain cattle/beef was coming down before the closure and how much is coming down now?"

If you have information to suggest that the amounts are not the same, PRESENT IT rather than creating your "SANDMAN ILLUSION" again that the amounts might be different.

Same-O "factually void" you again.


Good post Randy!



~SH~
 

Cattleman

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This article has to be one of the top for the most ourtrageous R-Calf related releases. I actually choked after the first two paragraphs. How can anyone able to type, even believe any piece of this.

As for trade, last numbers I saw Sandhusker, beef, was about the same even slightly higher, but live cattle was down a bit. Very small difference, especially related to the beef supply in the US. It proves nicely, how this article makes no sense.
 
A

Anonymous

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R-CULT knows that the only way they can increase their membership is to make up bullsh*t like this and unfortunately, ranchers.net is one of the few places this garbage is refuted.

R-CULT taking credit for a 30% increase in cattle prices? Good grief!

If R-CULT wasn't perpetuating the myth that having BSE in your native herd means your beef is contaminated, we might be trading with Korea and Japan and our prices would be higher yet.

One can only be thankful that the media did not see R-CULT as a credible source on BSE when they were risking the integrity of our U.S. beef production by lying about the safety of Canadian beef to stop Canadian imports.

R-CULT is the epitomy of arrogance and ignorance.



~SH~
 

Sandhusker

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This article was not written nor released by R-CALF. I guess the world is just full of liars and blamers.
 

Cattleman

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I just said R-Calf related, and then brought forward by an R-Calfer, that is all that I was talking about.
 

Northern Rancher

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Old Haystack only has grade 6 but he spent 4 years there-heck he could be the next R-Calf grand poobah. My buddies old Grampa had a perfect saying for yoU R-Calfers-'AS SMART AS TWO DUMB GUYS.'
 

agman

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Tommy said:
HATS OFF TO R-CALF - 8/29/05
Posted on DTN by ProgressiveAg.com


R-Calf, the new kid on the block with cattlemen's groups, is deserving of a very special thank you from US cattlemen as they have been primarily responsible for 3 of the most profitable year's of cattlemen's careers!!! Their steps to prevent the Canadian border opening were of primary importance to keeping US cattle prices up almost 30% from prior levels FOR 3 YEARS!!! This was not only critical to pushing and keeping cattle prices at all time highs for 3 years, but also provided a glimpse into the real impacts of Canadian cattle imports into the US. This has far reaching implications not only for US trade policy on livestock, but also many other domestic issues concerning trade.

Not only is the group responsible for huge profits in cattle, but they also are inspirational examples of what can be done with limited resources, defying Presidents and large companies of the power plays common against smaller farm players. Lets review the impacts and their results on how the US looks at trade policy.

First, R-Calf defied the Bush administrations 'Big Boy' USDA tactics by not listening to their power plays, and instead pulling a power play of their own over the big, bad USDA. Its got to be inspirational to the little guy in the US, as they had the guts to stand up to supposedly insurmountable odds to hold cattle in Canada (much longer than this analyst ever expected!). Whether you agree with their views or not, you can't help but admit they accomplished much with their little guy mentality. In the course of their stubborn refusal to give up, they ended up teaching a lot of "know it all", PH. D. Economists (and market analysts) a few things new about economics. While most of us expected the Canadian border to open after 1-3 months (as USDA announced), instead R-Calf kept it closed for 3 years or more. Contrary to all the expert economist opinions, it kept cattle prices up 30% from previous levels for the entire period (and still prices are high). Even though they lost in the end (USDA did finally get the border opened), the money made by cattlemen during the 3 years was well worth the battle. After all, most cattlemen made more money in each of the past 3 years than they had in their entire careers to that point!!! Profits must have been up 1000% (yes, one thousand percent, not one hundred) or more in each of the past 3 years, and only 'creative accounting' for tax reasons can be much different than that. Remember, a 30% increase in price from a 1% profit margin is a 30x increase in profits!!! Yes, little price differences in small margin products are important!!!

2) While economists and the government likes to tell us that free trade is good for the US, there can now be no doubt in anyones mind that free trade is bad for cattlemen. Whether you’re a Land Grant University trained economist or not, you can't help but admit that all your professors were wrong, and the supposedly uneducated "cowboys" were right. Cattle imports from Canada are killing our US cattle price. A 9% cut in total US beef availability seems to have produced a 30% rise in prices. And this didn't just occur for a short period of time, instead it lasted 3 years!!! That puts the long term elasticity of demand at about 3.2 for cattlemen, meaning that for every 1% drop in supplies, there is a 3-4% rise in prices. Clearly, cattlemen are not better off by free trade. This not only has implications for cattlemen, but also groups such as sugar producers, steel mills, textiles, labor unions, and all other groups with an interest against free trade. This little cowboy insurgency could embolden special interest industry groups against free trade. Big time economists (even the likes of Allen Greenspan who lambasted trade protectionists last week) who speak out for free trade might not make as big an impact as before. Will the 'cowboys' of the world listen now when University economists (who have never seen a cow) try to explain how free trade benefits US consumers so much??? Will they care about US consumers when they are losing money on the farm??? It was almost laughable how some economists and government people tried to insist that high cattle prices would in the end be bad for cattlemen. Who are they trying to kid??? If the Sec. of Ag can convince cattle farmers that high prices are bad for them, they should be in sales (like selling eskimo's ice???), not government work!!!

3) Although economists are good at 'proving' that free trade is good for the US economy and consumers, will producers of competing goods with imports care as much in the future??? While this might embolden producer groups in import heavy industries, perhaps Mr. Greenspan is right, it could hurt the US economy in the end??? But still, the politics of free trade might have suffered a severe setback.

4) How many land grant economists will come out with research studies the next few years explaining "it wasn't the closed border" that pushed cattle prices higher for 3 years??? Odds are, lots!!! But no matter whether you claim Atkins diets, South Beach diets, new demand sources, changes in world markets or wealth, or whatever else economists can dream up - who will believe it? The facts are that cattle prices never were even close to recent 3 year price levels, and close the Canadian border (even with US mad cow cases shutting down US exports) and prices soar. Atkins diet crazes were started before the price surge, and ended long before the border opened. How can that be the reason for cattle price rises??? The odds of any other event catapulting cattle prices that much are slim to none, no matter how many economists try to refute it. Common sense is still common sense! Any other conclusion should be laughed out of existance!!!

5) Power in cattle groups may shift considerably toward R-Calf and away from other groups. Only incompetence at R-CALF for many years can cause them to lose the loyalty they so clearly deserve from cow-calf producers. It'll be interesting to see if they will be that incompetent. Perhaps it may not be a bad idea for R-CALF to hire their own economists, so they can gain credibility with the rest of the world like they have with cow-calf producers???

Hats of to R-Calf, responsible for the highest incomes for cattlemen ever!!! Now what will they do with their new found legitimacy???

I don't expect the person who authored this article has even the slightest clue as to what happens when herd liquidation ends and herd rebuilding begins. If he or/she did know they would not have made such an asinine statement regarding the border closure and the claimed and misquided reason for successive years of higher prices.
 

Big Muddy rancher

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Agman it looks like R-CALF has taken responsiblity for the drought that has plagued the western states for so long. They must be taking credit for the loss of ag producers that are willing to run cattle and rural depopulation.
 

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