Faster horses
Well-known member
Then you need to build taller fences...
hereford bulls...horned or polled
- Thread starter Justin
- Start date
Faster horses
Well-known member
Then you need to build taller fences...
Our neighbors in W. Montana have been there, done that
with Chiangus...it didn't work...HUGE cows... and I think the
cow that jumped over the moon was a Chiania cross... :wink:
Our neighbors in W. Montana have been there, done that
with Chiangus...it didn't work...HUGE cows... and I think the
cow that jumped over the moon was a Chiania cross... :wink:
Justin
Well-known member
katrina said:
not interested....
i've been around my share of chi-x cows, several years ago i bought some bulls from Deiter Bros....bad experience all the way around.
leanin' H
Well-known member
Pretty sure chi cattle have some elk cross bred into them along with a touch of ticked off grizzly bear! Other than that, their are peaches. When i worked for Utah State University on an extension ranch in the early 80's we ran lots of different bulls. Limo, Tarantaise, Simmetal, Horned Herefords, Angus, Chi and Charolais. The Chi cattle were snorty and had the kind of manners that didnt mind showing you. :wink:
RobinFarmandRanch
Well-known member
yall need some hybrid vigor in ya'lls life. 
get yall some brafords and cross them with angus. you can have all the black baldies ya'll want. :lol: :mrgreen:
get yall some brafords and cross them with angus. you can have all the black baldies ya'll want. :lol: :mrgreen:hillsdown
Well-known member
Grassfarmer said:
Denny , Holstein does add to a beef herd especially in milk and temperment, plus they are well marbled. I think grazing them would not be a problem as you would not have the same "type" that high end dairy producers need. They actually are quite hearty and thrifty if you are not pushing them to milk 100 lbs a day.
1/4 or even half Holstein would not be enough for me to worry about food consumption or frozen udders.
roger dodger
Well-known member
Question? If The Horned Hereford is so great and has so much over the Polled Herefords, why are so many horned breeders are switching to polleds or at least running both. Rausch 's ,K&B, Hoffman's Ravine Creek and others just in South Dakota. I am sure there are many more in the north central USA. Just a question.
roger dodger
Well-known member
Question? If The Horned Hereford is so great and has so much over the Polled Herefords, why are so many horned breeders are switching to polleds or at least running both. Rausch 's ,K&B, Hoffman's Ravine Creek and others just in South Dakota. I am sure there are many more in the north central USA. Just a question.
roger dodger
Well-known member
Question? If The Horned Hereford is so great and has so much over the Polled Herefords, why are so many horned breeders are switching to polleds or at least running both. Rausch 's ,K&B, Hoffman's Ravine Creek and others just in South Dakota. I am sure there are many more in the north central USA. Just a question.
Big Muddy rancher
Well-known member
roger dodger said:Question? If The Horned Hereford is so great and has so much over the Polled Herefords, why are so many horned breeders are switching to polleds or at least running both. Rausch 's ,K&B, Hoffman's Ravine Creek and others just in South Dakota. I am sure there are many more in the north central USA. Just a question.
maybe because they are getting older and are willing to sacrifice performance for not having to dehorn. Just an opinion.
Big Muddy rancher
Well-known member
roger dodger said:Question? If The Horned Hereford is so great and has so much over the Polled Herefords, why are so many horned breeders are switching to polleds or at least running both. Rausch 's ,K&B, Hoffman's Ravine Creek and others just in South Dakota. I am sure there are many more in the north central USA. Just a question.
maybe because they are getting older and are willing to sacrifice performance for not having to dehorn. Just an opinion.
roger dodger
Well-known member
Question? If The Horned Hereford is so great and has so much over the Polled Herefords, why are so many horned breeders are switching to polleds or at least running both. Rausch 's ,K&B, Hoffman's Ravine Creek and others just in South Dakota. I am sure there are many more in the north central USA. Just a question.
WyomingRancher
Well-known member
I've got a quick question Justin, what are you specifically hoping to improve in your herd by changing sire breed? Would you want to keep heifers out of this cross?
We all know there can be big benefits to crossbreeding, and I definitely utilize those perks in this herd. Just looking at your cattle pics, they sure look like a solid bunch of cattle the way they are. Not saying improvements can't always be made in any herd, I'm just curious what you'd like to see different in your cattle .
We all know there can be big benefits to crossbreeding, and I definitely utilize those perks in this herd. Just looking at your cattle pics, they sure look like a solid bunch of cattle the way they are. Not saying improvements can't always be made in any herd, I'm just curious what you'd like to see different in your cattle
.Justin
Well-known member
WyomingRancher said:I've got a quick question Justin, what are you specifically hoping to improve in your herd by changing sire breed? Would you want to keep heifers out of this cross?
We all know there can be big benefits to crossbreeding, and I definitely utilize those perks in this herd. Just looking at your cattle pics, they sure look like a solid bunch of cattle the way they are. Not saying improvements can't always be made in any herd, I'm just curious what you'd like to see different in your cattle
thanks WR, but i only post pics of the good ones :wink: and i've been asking myself why fix something that isn't broke? i'm in no way saying that there aren't any improvement to be made in my herd because there are. but at the same time, i've been pretty happy with performance. trying to do to much can sometimes backfire. but to answer your question, replacement is my #1 priority as it always as been. so i guess having some of those good ol black baldy mommas would rank #1. and adding a few pounds to the steers is always welcomed
the only thing that would concern me is getting some red/red baldy calves. every year i seem to get a couple red calves out of black cows that were bred to black bulls. so how many would i get using hereford bulls... there is only one way to find out :???: there are a fair amount of cows around here, and i wouldn't bet the ranch they are all 100% angus....most of them are, but i'm certain that not all of them are.SMN Herf
Well-known member
I know this has been talked about before on this site and I think that it is a little bit like argueing wether a blue chevy is better than a red chevy. :wink:
I think it is deceitfull for a Hereford breeder to make blanket statements about horned vs polled herefords. If you want to discuss one horned bull vs another polled bull then we can have a serious discussion. My opinion is based upon experience, not based on some old stereotype from the stone ages.
I grew up with commercial horned herefords. Dad picked top end bulls from a lot of the well know breeders around the area. I have been around Angus, Amerifax, Charolais, horned herefords and now I use polled bulls on my registerd cows. I would not go back to the days of the cows I grew up with. Calf vigor, udder quality, fleshing ability, birth weights, and mothering ability aren't even in the same ball park with todays genetics.
Justin,
Don't base your decision strictly on polled vs horned. Instead buy from a program that will help you reach your goals. I sell polled bulls and some dehorned bulls too and there is more difference within the two gene pools than between them. My customers see no advantage with horns and actually prefer a polled bull so they don't have to dehorn calves. No matter how close they check at birth, there are some that slip through.
A lot of them don't want to have to handle horns on their bulls either. They have one heck of an advantage at the feedbunk in the winter time if they are wintered with Angus or even younger bulls.
I provide complete data on my bulls, from birth to yearling, carcass ultrasound, individual feed conversions and RFI data and cow weights and bcs scores at weaning. I will also provide the data on the steer mates to these bulls from performance to carcass. Basically any claim that has been made in previous posts can be disproved with through my data.
Hereford is a great compliment to an Angus based cowherd.
Brian
I think it is deceitfull for a Hereford breeder to make blanket statements about horned vs polled herefords. If you want to discuss one horned bull vs another polled bull then we can have a serious discussion. My opinion is based upon experience, not based on some old stereotype from the stone ages.
I grew up with commercial horned herefords. Dad picked top end bulls from a lot of the well know breeders around the area. I have been around Angus, Amerifax, Charolais, horned herefords and now I use polled bulls on my registerd cows. I would not go back to the days of the cows I grew up with. Calf vigor, udder quality, fleshing ability, birth weights, and mothering ability aren't even in the same ball park with todays genetics.
Justin,
Don't base your decision strictly on polled vs horned. Instead buy from a program that will help you reach your goals. I sell polled bulls and some dehorned bulls too and there is more difference within the two gene pools than between them. My customers see no advantage with horns and actually prefer a polled bull so they don't have to dehorn calves. No matter how close they check at birth, there are some that slip through.
A lot of them don't want to have to handle horns on their bulls either. They have one heck of an advantage at the feedbunk in the winter time if they are wintered with Angus or even younger bulls.
I provide complete data on my bulls, from birth to yearling, carcass ultrasound, individual feed conversions and RFI data and cow weights and bcs scores at weaning. I will also provide the data on the steer mates to these bulls from performance to carcass. Basically any claim that has been made in previous posts can be disproved with through my data.
Hereford is a great compliment to an Angus based cowherd.
Brian
novatech
Member
What is your end goal? What is your buyer willing to pay the most for? Are you going to sell F1 replacements or terminals?Justin said:WyomingRancher said:I've got a quick question Justin, what are you specifically hoping to improve in your herd by changing sire breed? Would you want to keep heifers out of this cross?
We all know there can be big benefits to crossbreeding, and I definitely utilize those perks in this herd. Just looking at your cattle pics, they sure look like a solid bunch of cattle the way they are. Not saying improvements can't always be made in any herd, I'm just curious what you'd like to see different in your cattle
thanks WR, but i only post pics of the good ones :wink: and i've been asking myself why fix something that isn't broke? i'm in no way saying that there aren't any improvement to be made in my herd because there are. but at the same time, i've been pretty happy with performance. trying to do to much can sometimes backfire. but to answer your question, replacement is my #1 priority as it always as been. so i guess having some of those good ol black baldy mommas would rank #1. and adding a few pounds to the steers is always welcomed
Make yourself a list of questions. Answer them. Then formulate a plan on how to get there. Or you can be indecisive and just go around in circles.
As far as horned/poled I have herd more old wives tales on here than one could have ever imagined. At one time the poled cattle had a fairly small gene pool to chose from. This is no longer true. Figure out what you need that will complement your herd the most. Forget about what is growing out the top of their head and go for it.
If you decide you are going to sell replacement heifers I would lean toward the poles. It gives your buyer more assurance of no horns. If you are going to sell terminals then it really makes no difference as you already have primarily Angus so the odds of horns are limited. If you don't mind dehorning a few then who cares.
er herf
Member
Won't see a horned bull dragging his tool threw the weeds. Most of the bulls I sell go on black cows and these customers wont use polled bulls. Wonder why????
I've always been under the impression that the Horned cattle were raised by ranchers. And polled were raised by hobby farmers and show people. I've seen alot of the biggest longest established herds are of the horned variety. I prefer horned but that does'nt make me right. My plan is if we get red baldie heifers keep them and breed them black. Steers may take a bit of a hit but I think the value of the females to me should be worth more than the discount on a couple steers. If we end up with some horns we'll just spoon them out when we fall work.
novatech
Member
So are you saying all poled bulls have bad sheaths? Are you saying all horned bulls have good sheaths? I didn't realize there was any connective tissue between the two. :lol: If you are, put in the list of old wives tales.er herf said:
If your customers won't use poled bulls it's because they still live in the dark ages and listen to people that still live in the dark ages.