• If you are having problems logging in please use the Contact Us in the lower right hand corner of the forum page for assistance.

i need some nutrition help

T

tlakota

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 7, 2007
Messages
209
Location
aberdeen,sd
I just got some of my crappy first cutting tested. It got about 2 inches of rain on it and i thought it was going to be worthless. I unroll 2 bales for 145 cows everyday plus fill feederrs with ground hay. It looks like the protein is pretty good on this first cutting. Im just curious if this hay is providing most of the nutrients they need and how much of it i should actually be giving them everyday. They are in their last trimester. Ill post the results and i want to hear what any of you have to say.

Moisture, % 12.7 0.0
Dry Matter, % 87.3 100.0
Crude Protein, % 17.6 20.2
Acid Detergent Fiber, % 44.1 50.5
Neutral Detergent Fiber, % 53.7 61.5
Digestible NDF 48, % 20.3 23.3
Lignin, % 9.24 10.58
Crude Fat, % 0.96 1.10
MINERALS: Ash, % 5.86 6.7
Phosphorus (P), % 0.23 0.26
Calcium (Ca), % 1.26 1.44
Potassium (K), % 0.86 0.99
Magnesium (Mg), % 0.09 0.10
CALCULATED VALUES: Neutral Detergent Fiber Digestibility, % of NDF 37.9
Non Fiber Carbohydrates, % 11.0 12.6
TDN, % 39.1 44.8
NE/Lactation, Mcal/lb 0.39 0.45
NE/Maintenance, Mcal/lb 0.31 0.36
NE/Gain, Mcal/lb 0.10 0.11
TDN 1X, % 40.9 46.8
Relative Feed Value(RFV) 75
Relative Feed Quality(RFQ) 67
CC:


One set of numbers is 100 percent dry matter and the other is figured as is.
 
I will attempt to answer your question.

First of all, what do the bales weigh?
My calculations are based on two 1250 lb. bales.
Now if the bales weigh more or less, this throws my calculations all off.
Moisture contains no nutrients so we figure it on a Dry Matter basis.

2500 lbs. of hay as fed at 87.3% DM=about 17 lbs of DM
Times 17.6 Protein=2.99 lbs. of crude protein per head per day
2 lbs. of crude protein is generally enough for a cow even in the third trimester, so you are pretty safe there.
Times 39.1 TDN=6.7 lbs of energy

Also, the ADF is pretty high, meaning the hay is not easily digested.
(The lower this number, the higher the digestibility).

I have never seen an analysis that provided the Protein and TDN on DM basis, so I hope I've used the right numbers. Stearns, the lab we use for our customers, just provides one number, the 'AS FED' number, which is what I attempted to do.

Anyway, this tells me your cattle are short of Dry Matter and short on energy. They have plenty of protein. Which supports what we have told our customers. Protein requirements are easily met, but in this north country we are generally short of energy. So I would tell you to feed them another bale of hay.


We have done a lot of forage sampling and we have found that rained on hay doesn't lose protein. When it turns yellow from rain, it means the vitamins and minerals have leached out, so be sure to provide access to free-choice minerals.

Hope this helps! I don't have my book right at hand because I'm not home right now, or I could tell you the requirements of cattle. Also, of course, weight of the cow and temperature has a lot to do with nutrition requirements. Amazing when you see that chart, how much more a 1350 lb. cow requires over an 1100 lb. one.
 
actually that stuff is not too bad. For mature cows it should work just fine. Add some 2:1 mineral and salt and you should be ok. If you really want to make sure add a little protein, but I don't think you need it.
 
The bales weigh 1300 pounds. At those tests how many pounds a day will they need? Seems like tdn is quite low.
Im providing free choice mineral and also about 2000 of ground alfalfa/cornstalks.
 
You should see what my cows are eating cattails and willow's..

DRY BASIS 6.60%crude protein T.D.N...55.18%

Dry Basis 5.67% crude protein T.D.N...49.98%

This is'nt very good hay it is green but all slew grass is green for the most part.We have been feeding Wet distillars grain or the distillars syrup since mid november and the cows look just fine.We feed 25#s of hay and 15#s of wet cake or syrup daily.

If I had your feed I would'nt worry one bit.
 
You are correct. The TDN is low. What are your temperatures and what
stage of gestation are your cows in. That all plays a factor.

You are feeding 2000 lbs. of ground alfalfa, corn stalks?
That is probably enough more feed to meet their dry matter needs.
Do you have any ideal of the dry matter % of the ground alfalfa/corn stalks; or the TDN of that feed?

Do you cows act hungry? I've learned that the natural grazing pattern of a cow is that she lays down about noon--give or take an hour (and unless the wind is really blowing). Are your cows laying around chewing their cud for part of the day, or are they up and looking for something to eat? Another thing I didn't take into consideration is the amount of grass they have access to.

Meeting DM requirements is really important and is often overlooked.

Another thing I have learned is that we are 90-120 days BEHIND our cattle on what we feed. In other words, what you feed now will show on your cattle 90-120 days down the road. It takes 80 lbs. to chage a body condition score on cattle.
 
You are correct. The TDN is low. What are your temperatures and what
stage of gestation are your cows in. That all plays a factor.

You are feeding 2000 lbs. of ground alfalfa, corn stalks?
That is probably enough more feed to meet their dry matter needs.
Do you have any ideal of the dry matter % of the ground alfalfa/corn stalks; or the TDN of that feed?

Do you cows act hungry? I've learned that the natural grazing pattern of a cow is that she lays down about noon--give or take an hour (and unless the wind is really blowing). Are your cows laying around chewing their cud for part of the day, or are they up and looking for something to eat? Another thing I didn't take into consideration is the amount of grass they have access to.

Meeting DM requirements is really important and is often overlooked.

Another thing I have learned is that we are 90-120 days BEHIND our cattle on what we feed. In other words, what you feed now will show on your cattle 90-120 days down the road. It takes 80 lbs. to chage a body condition score on cattle.
 
You are correct. The TDN is low. What are your temperatures and what
stage of gestation are your cows in. That all plays a factor.

You are feeding 2000 lbs. of ground alfalfa, corn stalks?
That is probably enough more feed to meet their dry matter needs.
Do you have any ideal of the dry matter % of the ground alfalfa/corn stalks; or the TDN of that feed?

Do you cows act hungry? I've learned that the natural grazing pattern of a cow is that she lays down about noon--give or take an hour (and unless the wind is really blowing). Are your cows laying around chewing their cud for part of the day, or are they up and looking for something to eat? Another thing I didn't take into consideration is the amount of grass they have access to.

Meeting DM requirements is really important and is often overlooked.

Another thing I have learned is that we are 90-120 days BEHIND our cattle on what we feed. In other words, what you feed now will show on your cattle 90-120 days down the road. It takes 80 lbs. to chage a body condition score on cattle.
 

Latest posts

Back
Top