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Irrigation in the sandhills

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BlackCattleRancher

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Seeing soaps pictures of the heifers running on irrigated corn stalks, I have a few questions not being from that area. My understanding has always been that the low areas in the sandhills have a very high watertable and allow subirrigation of the grasses in those areas. The higher areas are just very light sand and have very rich grasses with low yields that require a very low stocking density. Talking with a few guys from that region, I have been told that it is a very self sustaining system fertility wise and good grazing management is all it takes to have sustainable grazing. My understanding is the guys who have tried to fertilize or plowed up the native sods for improved forages have been very unsuccessful achieving better levels of productivity from what is native. Also, I've been told with the abundant water it seems a no-brainer to put up pivots and irrigate grains, especially with the recent corn excursions to $8/bushel, but a majority who have tried it have been unsuccessful as the soils were not conducive to the high levels of management and a return to more native ecosystem was not a quick process, many, many years. Everything I know is hearsay, so I'm interested in what I can learn for those familiar with the are.
 
You are basically correct. Only part you omitted was the involvement of the fed govt in both direct crop subsidy payments while cultivated and crp payments after they ruin the ground...
 
There's a lot of idiot's around here that are doing it. If they grow a crop their yield's are poor, the low spot's drowned out and the high spot's burn up and blow.It's mostly people from out of town or state, they think they bought some cheap farm ground. After they farm it for a year or two they put it back on the market, cause it don't work. If they wan't to farm then they need to buy farm ground.

They need to pass some sort of sodbusters law so they can't do it anymore. This ground is too fragile once you till the existing sod it almost never return's back to the quality it was previously and it take's year's and year's.

God made this ground for livestock and everything he made is perfect. I don't know why anyone would ruin good sandhill's grass! :mad:
 
DCM said:
You are basically correct. Only part you omitted was the involvement of the fed govt in both direct crop subsidy payments while cultivated and crp payments after they ruin the ground...
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It seems irrigated alfalfa would do quite well on those sands, is there any alfalfa production in the sandhills. It baffles me as to the reasoning why an improved crop can't successfully be gr0wn when abundant fertilizer and water are applied.
 
loomixguy said:
Wasn't a perp named Foxley trying to farm hell and half the sandhills years ago?
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I think Foxley was going in the late 70's early 80's. Story I heard was, was one of the hired men buried a brand new 8340 JD tractor under the silage pile.
Its pretty frustrating to me that people are still breaking out sod. I sorta figured anything that was at all farmable, was torn up the last time cowmen thought they were going to get rich in the corn business. Most of them either went belly up, or had the government bale them out.
Now here we are 30 years later, and they are doing the same thing all over again. I will grant with the improvements in crop production, fields that made 90 or 100 bushels an acre, are now doubling that, but I'm still not sure a person can break even on it, with $5 corn.
I for see another government bale out coming, all because cowmen thought they were grain farmers.
 
Some people have alfalfa but stand's don't last very long if you can establish it at all, to sandy and the water table is too high.
 
when I was a kid, my dad ran heavy equipment. he spent a summer up in the Thedford area knocking down hills and filling draws for a guy to irrigate a lot of acres..... rumor is, that has all been turned back to grass.
 
It's sort of a mixed bag. There are some areas of the Sandhills where a center pivot or two works out well. Not al sandhill ranches have sub-irrigated meadows. Alfalfa or alfalfa grass mixtures is grown on some.
I live just north of the sandhills, there has got to be quite a few irrigation systems here. Our soil here is a bit heavyier. I don't have one, but by now they seem to be doing allright. When you start to irrigate you always need to invest in something new in order to pay for your last investment. This fell right in line with what the land grant colleges and the extension people preached during the early 1980's. They told us to do like other businesses, not to worry about paying for the farm and burning the mortgage, but to re-invest the value of our assets. Well we saw the results.

I know a sandhill rancher who put in a number of center pivits and hired farmer to farm them, it apparently didn't work. He told me "you can make a rancher out of a farmer but you can't make a farmer out of a rancher".
 
Sandhills boy said:
jigs, have any idea where from thedford or who the guy was? I live in the area and have for a while have some ideas who but curiosity is killing me. Thanks Brent.
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it was30 years ago... I remember going up on weekends to see him, and remember the place, but not a lot more.... it was 2 sections of ground they re worked for pivots.
 
A local family here plowed up a few ranches in the Arthur area. I knew several of the sons pretty well. Some of what they tried to farm was so steep you couldn't safely keep tractors on it. Basically it became a pyramid scheme. They borrowed money to turn grass into irrigated ground. It looked good on paper until it had to start making a return. I know they couldn't leave their equipment unattended at night and weren't very welcome. I never saw any of it but a few people that did said it would make you sick to your stomach. This had to of been in the late 70's.
 
I remember seeing pictures of Colorado ranches covered in blow dirt from the "neighbors" breaking up and trying to farm land that should never have seen a plow. If I remember right they were getting a government payment to do it. :?

I know of farmed land in Sheridan County MT that was seeded back to grass for CRP and those very same farmers went to other places like central MT and South Dakota and broke up native grass. :x
 
In 1994, we bought a ranch in Eastern Colorado which they had broken up. They plowed up 16000 acres on a 19000 acre ranch. Half of it was sandy, the rest heavy soil.

Large parts were put into CRP. The government paid a lot more in CRP payment than I paid for the ranch, Over 14 years, we had all but a couple sections in CRP. Since we sold the ranch, the rest has been put into CRP.

There sure was a lot of stupid put into that place. However, in a good year, they raise 60 - 70 bushels of wheat. Most of the time, the wheat was pretty poor and a couple of years there was nothing.

But, with the helpful government, the CRP and crop insurance made the land payments and the cattle operation was OK.

I keep telling the new owners they need to put more rain on the place.

After the CRP contracts run out, the ranch will run about 900 pairs - including some 4-5000 acres we added onto it.

I guess that if the ranch would never been broken up, we wouldn't have been able to afford it!!!

CP
 
looking at satellite view on Google maps, I see a lot of green circles, several in very condensed areas. Are those heavier, flatter soils and what types of crops are growing under that irrigation, (corn, alfalfa, sudan, native hay??)
 
Sandhills boy said:
thanks for the reply I think I know who, I have lived here all my life except for about 10 year while I work construction doing commercial wiring. Brent.
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So who do you think it was? I grew up at Purdum, and can think of a few around there, and the ones that Ewolt's put in south of Thedford.
 
BlackCattleRancher said:
looking at satellite view on Google maps, I see a lot of green circles, several in very condensed areas. Are those heavier, flatter soils and what types of crops are growing under that irrigation, (corn, alfalfa, sudan, native hay??)
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Most of them are corn. A few are ranchers raising feed, but where they are all condensed, they are grain crops. Around here potatoes are the big get rich quick scheme.
I have been on this place 7 years, and in that time there are 7 new pivots, that you can see from the highway. With in a 20 mile radius of me, I will bet there have been 30 new pivots put in in that time frame.

It won't be long before they are begging for help. GRRR
 
My error...it was Aurthur that the work was done...Thedford was where Dad went to rope..... I was 8 or 9 at the time, and got them confused.....
 

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