• If you are having problems logging in please use the Contact Us in the lower right hand corner of the forum page for assistance.

Jefferson Davis & OT

Help Support Ranchers.net:

Mike

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 10, 2005
Messages
28,482
Reaction score
0
Location
Montgomery, Al
Not too long ago, Oldtimer spouted that the President of the Confederacy was captured while trying to ecape in women's clothing and eluded to him as being cowardly because of that.

The following picture is in the Smithsonian and is the clothing he wore when he was arrested. Do they look like women's clothing?

Was OT lying yet again or just writing what he really knew nothing about? Same thing in my book.



Uploaded with ImageShack.us

I would really be embarrassed if caught in as many lies as him. :roll:
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Davis was captured on May 10, 1865, at Irwinville in Irwin County, Georgia.[74] In the confusion, Davis put his wife's overcoat over his shoulders and attempted to flee the Union soldiers, leading to caricatures of him being captured while disguised as a woman.[75] Meanwhile, Davis' belongings continued on the train bound for Cedar Key, Florida. They were first hidden at Senator David Levy Yulee's plantation in Florida, then placed in the care of a railroad agent in Waldo. On June 15, 1865, Union soldiers seized Davis' personal baggage, together with some of the Confederate government's records, from the agent. A historical marker now stands at this site.

There is no doubt the history books of the south differ from those of the north... :wink:

Jefferson Davis was really a nothing...But that said- Robert E. Lee was a great man and deserves great recognition.....
 
A

Anonymous

Guest


A Thomas Nast Cartoon of Jefferson Davis
The 1865 cartoon shows Jefferson Davis disguised as a female. Many drawings and political cartoons from the North claimed that Davis was dressed as a woman at the time of his capture. Davis wrote that he had mistaken his wife's overcoat for his own, and that she had thrown her shawl over his head and shoulders for protection against a rainstorm.

Maybe his wife was built like a Russian foot soldier... Or he was a cross dresser :wink: Who knows...Anyway the story came out in the north that he was dressed as a woman...
 

Mike

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 10, 2005
Messages
28,482
Reaction score
0
Location
Montgomery, Al
It was made up by the press to keep him from seeming heroic.

But when you do a little research, you can easily see that it was a lie and a myth.

I guess you are just not interested in the truth and throw out the first thing you read.

Jeff davis was not nearly as much of a nothing as you, for sure.

Now comes the real truth. Do those look like women's clothes? Yes or no?

You knew it, or should have known it was a lie to begin with. If not, you are most ignorant.

To perpetuate a lie is the same as lying yourself.
 

Mike

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 10, 2005
Messages
28,482
Reaction score
0
Location
Montgomery, Al
There is no difference between the history books in the north and the south. :roll:
 

Mike

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 10, 2005
Messages
28,482
Reaction score
0
Location
Montgomery, Al
OT wrote:
In the confusion, Davis put his wife's overcoat over his shoulders and attempted to flee the Union soldiers, leading to caricatures of him being captured while disguised as a woman

Your very first attempt to legitimize your falsehood is so very telling here. Any embicile could see that it did not say he was disguised as but "leading to caricatures of him being captured while disguised as a woman".

Most educated people could see through that a mile away.......... :roll:

Just shows you like to make chit up as you go. You're a real tool, Fatman.

A person to be loathed.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Davis wrote that he had mistaken his wife's overcoat for his own, and that she had thrown her shawl over his head and shoulders for protection against a rainstorm.

Since old Jeff or his captors ain't around to tell us straight to our face- I guess we have to go with what was recorded in the history books- and what was written by those folks back then...

Anyhow it really doesn't matter as he was running like a turpentined dog- and if not for Johnsons carrying out Abes wishes not to seek reprisals against the rebels he would have been hung as a traitor....
 

Mike

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 10, 2005
Messages
28,482
Reaction score
0
Location
Montgomery, Al
Those are the clothes he was wearing in the picture.

If you had rather believe a myth and a lie, I understand as that is your type of piece of chit that you are.

Do they look like women's clothing?
 

Mike

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 10, 2005
Messages
28,482
Reaction score
0
Location
Montgomery, Al
THE REAL STORY IN THE HISTORY BOOKS AS TOLD BY A PERSON THERE:
As we have said, the President was already fully dressed. He hastily took leave of his wife, who threw over his shoulders a water proof cloak or wrapper, either as a protection from the dampness of the early morning, or in the hope that it might serve as a partial disguise, or perhaps with woman's ready and rapid thoughtfulness of its possible use for both these purposes. Mrs. Davis also directed a female servant, who was present, to take an empty bucket and accompany him in the direction of the spring -- his horse, on the other side of the camp, being cut off from access by the interposition of the assailants.
He had advanced only a few steps from the door of the tent, when he was challenged by a mounted soldier, who presented his carbine and ordered him to "surrender." The answer was: "I never surrender to a band of thieves." The carbine was still presented, but the man refrained from firing -- it is but fair to presume from an unwillingness to kill his adversary -- while the President continued to advance. This was not from desperation or foolhardy recklessness, but of deliberate purpose. I take the risk of going perhaps a little beyond the limits of the authorized use of information obtained in the freedom of personal confidence, in stating that, with the rapid process of thought and formation of design which sometimes takes place in moments of imminent peril, Mr. Davis recalled an incident of his own experience that had occurred many years before. On the field of Buena Vista, while riding along a ravine in search of a slope that his horse could ascend, he was fired at and missed by the whole front rank of a squadron of Mexican cavalry on the crest of the bank above.
Remembering this, and observing that the man, who was finely mounted, was so near as to be considerably above him, he had little apprehension of being hit, and believed that, by taking advantage of the excitement of the shot, he might easily tip him from the saddle and get possession of his horse. The feasibility of this design was not to be tested, however, for at this moment Mrs. Davis, seeing only his danger, and animated by a characteristic and heroic determination to share it, ran forward and threw her arms around his neck, with some impassioned exclamation, which probably none of the parties present would be able to repeat correctly. The only hope of escape had depended upon bringing the matter to an immediate issue, and, seeing that this was now lost, the President simply said, "God's will be done," as he quietly turned back and seated himself upon a fallen trees near which a camp fire was burning.
While these events were occurring, there had been some sharp firing around the camp. It appeared afterward that the assailants had been divided into two parties, and, approaching from different directions, had encountered and fired upon each other by mistake, killing and wounding several of their own men. In the confusion consequent upon this, some of the Confederate party escaped -- among them Colonel Wood, who afterwards accompanied General Breckinridge in his perilous and adventurous voyage in an open boat from the coast of Florida to Cuba.
After some delay, an officer with a paper, on which he was taking a list of the prisoners, approached the spot where the President was sitting, and asked his name. This he declined to give it telling the questioner that he might find it out for himself, but Mrs. Davis, anxious to avoid giving provocation as far as possible, gave the required information.
When Colonel Pritchard appeared upon the scene, President Davis, under the influence of feelings naturally aroused by certain indignities offered by subordinates, and by the distress inflicted upon the ladies of his family, addressed him with some asperity. It would probably be impossible (as it always is unclear such circumstances) for any participant, or even any witness, to recite with accuracy the conversation that ensued. I may say, however, that Mr. Davis has never made any complaint of the language or demeanor of Colonel Pritchard to himself, personally. Among the remarks made in that, or some subsequent conversation, by that officer, was one to the effect that, having refused to surrender, Mr. Davis had given the soldier who demanded the surrender the right to shoot him -- a right, under the laws of war, of which President Davis was well aware at the time, and which he did not deny. As to the conversation recited by Wilson, Colonel Johnston, in his very temperate, cautious, and conscientious statement, appended to this article, avers most positively that no such remark was made (about Mr. Davis' "garb," means of "rapid locomotion," &c.,) as is there attributed to Colonel Pritchard.
It would require too much space to point out in detail all the misrepresentations in General Wilson's account of this affair. I shall copy merely a paragraph. After quoting from the account of the capture given by Pollard, who, although one of the most virulent and unscrupulous of President Davis' enemies, has rejected the contemptible fiction of the "petticoat story," he says:
"Between the two explanations given above, nearly all the truth has been told, for Davis certainly had on both the shawl and waterproof, the former folded triangularly and pulled down over his hat, and the latter buttoned down in front and covering his entire person except the feet. In addition to this he carried a small tin pail and was accompanied by his wife and his wife's sister, one on each side, both of them claiming him as a female relative and both trying to impose him upon the soldiers as such. The articles of the disguise are now in the keeping of the Adjutant General of the army at Washington, and I am assured by him that they correspond in all respects to the description given of them. From the foregoing it will be seen that Davis did not actually have on crinoline or petticoats, but there is no doubt whatever that he sought to avoid capture by assuming the dress of a woman, or that the ladies of the party endeavored to pass him off upon his captors as one of themselves. Was there ever a more pitiful termination to a career of treachery and dishonor? What greater stigma was ever affixed to the name of rebel? Many loyal men have declared that Davis should have been tried by drum-head court martial and executed -- but what new disgrace could the gallows indict upon the man who hid himself under the garb of woman, when, if ever, he should have shown the courage of a hero?"
With regard to the exact form of the fold of the shawl and the extent to which the "waterproof" was "buttoned down," General Wilson's assertions may pass for what they have already been shown to be worth. I have no evidence, and have not thought it necessary to seek any, as to the shape of the one or the dimensions of the other. Those who are curious might possibly ascertain, something on the subject by inquiry and examination at the War Department, if permission can be obtained of the Adjutant General of the army, who, according to General Wilson, is the custodian of the stolen articles of Mr. Davis' wearing apparel. It is enough to know that they were both articles which he "had been accustomed to wear." Colonel Johnston testifies, in the letter subjoined, that he himself had a "waterproof" of exactly the same sort, except in color, and that he turned this over to Mr. Davis, who wore it, after his capture, to supply the place of that of which he had been robbed. The very name ("Raglan") by which Col. Johnston describes it, and by which it is commonly known, sufficiently indicates its origin and use as an article of masculine attire. Indeed, there was no female grenadier in the President's party, whose cloak would have been capable of "covering his entire person except the feet" - he being a man of nearly six feet in height. It is also positively untrue that he "carried a small tin pail". As already stated, there was a bucket in the hands of a colored female servant, whom the narrators seem to have indiscriminately confounded with President Davis, or with Miss Howell, (who was not in company with him,) as it might serve a purpose.
But why this persistent effort to perpetuate a false and foolish story, which seems to have been originally invented for sensational purposes by a newspaper correspondent?
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Heres another from one of the capturers..

http://query.nytimes.com/mem/archive-free/pdf?res=F60912FB3C541B7A93C2A81783D85F458884F9
 

Mike

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 10, 2005
Messages
28,482
Reaction score
0
Location
Montgomery, Al
Doesn't say he was wearing women's clothes at all. Back in those days many men wore shawls and wraps with or without their overcoats.

In fact, they still make them today.

You knew it was lie when you told it to make Davis look the coward.

Are you proud of being labeled a liar?

I have a large picture of R.E. Lee himself wearing a shawl, cape, or whatever you want to call it while on his horse. Was he wearing women's clothes too?
 

Lonecowboy

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 10, 2006
Messages
1,990
Reaction score
0
Location
eastern Montana
Myth: When Confederate president, Jefferson Davis was arrested after the Civil War, he was wearing his wife's clothes as a disquise in hopes of avoiding capture.
Fact: Although many today may not have heard this story, it was a popular myth at the time and was widely reported in the tabloids along with artists's depictions of Jefferson Davis wearing a variety of women's clothing. There was even a popular song at the time called "Jeff in Petticoats". The fact is, there is no truth to the story. Those actually present at the time of his capture, including Captain James H. Parker, stated that Jefferson Davis was wearing mens' clothing, including a mens' hat.
http://www.interestingushistory.com/Myth-When-Confederate-president,-Jefferson-Davis-was-arrested.html

liberal strategy 101- tell a lie often enough someone will start to believe it!
 

hopalong

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 12, 2006
Messages
8,019
Reaction score
0
Location
Az.
oldtimer tells so many lies and tells them so often he believes them himself.

Then he goes on to call the man a coward for trying to escape the enemy!!! Not know it is a soldiers sworn duty to attempt any and all means to avoid capture.
History has many stories of men escaping capture by using disguises, guess that makes them cowards,
Are you a coward for imitating a sheriff
EH
 

loomixguy

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 12, 2007
Messages
6,061
Reaction score
0
Location
The Dark Side
While reading this thread, I had a thought about the tin star and his Messiah. For being such a self-proclaimed "law & odor" guy, it appears to me that his Mulatto Messiah has done something during his tenure that all tin stars & weekend badge wearers should be mighty proud of and want to be sure to vote for more of. Since January, 2009, the Messiah, along with AG Holder, has done nothing but EXPAND criminal rights.

Be proud, Methuselah, be proud. Maybe you better check out all the gee-tars up in Valley County. Can't have any made from illegal wood, ya know...they might not sound quite right. Gotta enforce laws from India...it's a top priority.
 

Mike

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 10, 2005
Messages
28,482
Reaction score
0
Location
Montgomery, Al
OT is such a "Constitutionalist" he might want to check Buckwheat's wartime endeavors against the greatest usurper of all time; Abraham Lincoln.

In the 80 days that elapsed between Abraham Lincoln's April 1861 call for troops--the beginning of the Civil War--and the official convening of Congress in special session on July 4, 1861, Lincoln performed a whole series of important acts by sheer assumption of presidential power. Lincoln, without congressional approval, called forth the militia to "suppress said combinations,6 which he ordered "to disperse and retire peacefully" to their homes.7 He increased the size of the Army and Navy, expended funds for the purchase of weapons, instituted a blockade--an act of war--and suspended the precious writ of habeas corpus, all without congressional approval.

The previous threads here show that he knows little about American history except for the myths & made-up fallacies that fit a left wing agenda.
 

hopalong

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 12, 2006
Messages
8,019
Reaction score
0
Location
Az.
You mean lies like about Jefferson Davis that were just posted here????
Posted by someone who is trustworthy :roll: :roll: :roll: Someone who tells the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth ((((as he thinks it should be?)))

EH????? :wink:
 

redrobin

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 19, 2009
Messages
1,148
Reaction score
6
Location
arkansas
Oldtimer said:
There is no doubt the history books of the south differ from those of the north... :wink:

....
It's no wonder the north has your kind of people, the north doesn't have accurate history books. Of course if we sent you a copy of an accurate history book, you'd rewrite. The term windswept prairie has taken on new meaning to me you old wind bag.
 

Tam

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 10, 2005
Messages
12,759
Reaction score
0
Location
Sask
Let me get this right Oldtimer said Jefferson Davis tried to cowardly escape by disguising himself as a female by wearing his wife's clothing. which in all descriptions of such an action would lead one to believe he knowningly dressed up in his wifes clothes and left by the back flap of the tent as not to be seen by the approaching soldiers and leaving his wife to distract the enemy while he made his get away.

Then Oldtimer posts MR. Davis is a nobody that had mistaken his wife's overcoat for his own while running like a turpentined dog from the tent he shared with his wife. which again in all descriptions of such actions would lead one to believe he was surprised and in his haste of running from the tent he grabbed the wrong coat but still leaving he wife to the hands of the approaching enemy.

THEN you have the story of a guy wearing his own coat and his wife caringly wrapping his head with protection from the pouring rain leaving through the front flap of the tent and confronting the approaching armed enemy and refusing to surrender. which btw is backed up by pictures of the clothes he was wear upon surrender that do not look even remotely female.


Three completely different images
WOW this is a tough one to know who is telling the truth. But since actual historical PICTURES tell a bit more than a cartoon drawing I'm taking a big leap here and guessing Oldtimer not only suffers from BDS and PDS but he also suffers from Davis Deranged syndrome. :roll:
Time to get help Oldtimer as it seems to be a re-occurring pattern with you. :wink:
 

Latest posts

Top