Measures taken to warm cattle/protect from cold?

[JoeShanahan]

Hi there,

I probably live 2,000 miles from the nearest ranch, but I saw multiple saddening articles about many dead cattle this winter.

I am curious to hear what measures are taken to warm and protect cattle from deadly temperatures.

I am interested in building a prototype cattle warming wrap as I gain knowledge about this industry.

Please feel free to message/respond for me contact details!

Joe

 

[PureCountry]

I fear you may be a few hundred years too late:

http://www.ansi.okstate.edu/breeds/breeds/cattle/galloway/index.htm

Kidding aside, there is very little profit margin in a beef calf for ranchers to afford a blanket on a beef animal, like something you see on horses. Buying it, and the time to put it on and maintain it, kills the notion for me.

And there is much to be said for the old adage, "If you're gonna have livestock, you're gonna have dead stock." **** happens that cannot always be helped. You can plant trees as shelterbelts, build wind fences, use cattle with thicker hair, etc, etc. Mother Nature will still hit you with curve balls from time to time.

I'd like to think you're well intentioned, and trying to help livestock and ranchers. If you're just trying to sell something and make money, you'd be better of to start in a wealthier industry where they throw money at prototype ideas, like the oilpatch.

 

[gcreekrch]

I fear you may be a few hundred years too late:

http://www.ansi.okstate.edu/breeds/breeds/cattle/galloway/index.htm

Kidding aside, there is very little profit margin in a beef calf for ranchers to afford a blanket on a beef animal, like something you see on horses. Buying it, and the time to put it on and maintain it, kills the notion for me.

And there is much to be said for the old adage, "If you're gonna have livestock, you're gonna have dead stock." s*** happens that cannot always be helped. You can plant trees as shelterbelts, build wind fences, use cattle with thicker hair, etc, etc. Mother Nature will still hit you with curve balls from time to time.

I'd like to think you're well intentioned, and trying to help livestock and ranchers. If you're just trying to sell something and make money, you'd be better of to start in a wealthier industry where they throw money at prototype ideas, like the oilpatch.

What PC said.

 

[Anonymous]

Good windbreaks (natural or manmade), full tummies ( I like some roughage to generate heat during cold spells), the right genetics, and the cows can come thru some very drastic weather in good shape...

I think we are 100+% ahead of what we were 50 years ago on ability for preparation just because of the progress made in meteorology and weather forecasting..... Which has accounted for lots both for cattle and human welfare.....

 

[Silver]

Might be a small market with the vet clinics. I had the misfortune of taking a heifer to town for a C-section a couple of weeks ago. It was about -25 C that night. For the ride home the vet put the calf in a bag like a really heavy black plastic garbage bag with a drawstring on it. Put the calf in and did the drawstring up around the calf's neck. I had a square bale of hay to bed it in also. When we made the 1 hour trip home and I opened the bag I could feel the warmth coming out, so I guess it did it's job. You might be able to improve on that idea a bit.
I can't imagine a wrap or blanket having any place on an actual working ranch, but you never know maybe there are some hobbyists out there that would be interested. But then I never thought I'd see the day folks put ear muffs on their calves either :???:

 

[Mike]

Good windbreaks (natural or manmade), full tummies ( I like some roughage to generate heat during cold spells), the right genetics, and the cows can come thru some very drastic weather in good shape...

I think we are 100+% ahead of what we were 50 years ago on ability for preparation just because of the progress made in meteorology and weather forecasting..... Which has accounted for lots both for cattle and human welfare.....

Energy is what keeps cattle warm in cold weather. Carbohydrates.

 

[mrj]

First, I believe some ranch women have developed a little jacket for baby calves, even ear protectors! However, due to the facts way the animals are structured, elimination can be a problem, with any blanket type thing getting dirty awfully fast. That would likely cause illness if not changed daily. The laundry COULD be a problem! Fact is, cattle are designed to withstand the elements very well except in special circumstances such as newborns. As others mentioned, full stomach, a little shelter from the wind, and cattle are very durable.

If it was the Atlas storm in SD which turned you to this idea, that was a VERY unusual storm in that October is quite early for a severe blizzard. And the weather had been unusually warm for October, at 70 to 80 degrees as the rain started. Then, it rained several inches (three to four on our ranch) before the snow started. Then it was a wind driven mix of rain and snow, later turning to snow. Even when cattle were in good shelter from the wind, the very fine snow drifted into the protected areas, filling the air, AND the lungs of the cattle. The difficulty of just breathing, the stress of the extreme cold which came soon after the snow started, with temperatures dropping by 70 to 100 degrees from what it had been just two or three days earlier. That stressed the hearts of the cattle, and caused something similar to congestive heart failure in humans. Some of them moved with the wind, falling into dams, creeks, and ditches full of water and drowned. Some literally drowned from the moisture they inhaled.

That was a very rare type of storm, with some older folks having never seen one like it. And we certainly hope we never do again!

We only lost three head in that storm, while others whose cattle were in even better locations, terrain and windbreaks, lost many. Just depended on the way they moved with the storm. There have been longer lasting, blizzards when we did lose cattle on a few occasions over the 125 years our family has raised cattle in SD. It always hurts, and has sometimes taken us years to recover from. Keeping them in a barn isn't feasible, and for some, even sheds or good windbreaks was no guarantee of ending up with live cattle. The real miracle of that storm was that no one died while out trying to save their cattle. It has happened in the past, and it is really hard to stay in the house instead of risking ones' life trying to save the cattle.

Really, the best thing to do to protect cattle from storms is to have them in good condition, and feed them as the storm is starting.

mrj

 

[Faster horses]

"Really, the best thing to do to protect cattle from storms is to have them in good condition, and feed them as the storm is starting."

I second this. And have them in some protection, if possible.

Dry cattle, even baby calves, can withstand a lot due to their haircoat and hide thickness. When they get WET and cold, it's a different story.
Then hypothermia sets in. Luckily, for must of us in the west, that's not a common occurrence.
Nature can do a wonderful job, and she also can have no mercy.

I appreciate your idea, Joe, but if you took a trip out west in the wintertime,
you would see for yourself your idea just isn't feasible.

 

[jodywy]

Probably saw pictures of last Fall Blizzard and all the dead livestock in SD.

 

[Soapweed]

God gave animals their hair and fur coats for a reason. They are meant to live outside. Blankets on horses might be alright in some cases, as in show horses, or for traveling, but most of the time a horse is much better off not wearing a blanket. With a blanket, the horses stays slick-haired. This might look pretty, but there is no protection from cold weather with the blanket off. The blanket is itchy, and if you could ask the horse, they would opt for going the natural way. Mother nature has provided equally well for cattle and other animals.

Protection from the wind is something that man can provide. Windbreaks are often even more desirable than having livestock in a building. When many animals are in a barn, without proper ventilation, condensation makes the inside of a building steamy. When the livestock is let back outside, there is often substantial shock to their system from the warm foggy barn to the cold outside air, and sickness or death can occur.

Livestock get by very well under most natural conditions with just slight tweaking by those of us who are their caretakers. Sometimes there is a very fine line between doing what is right for livestock, or trying "too hard" or not nearly hard enough.

 

[JoeShanahan]

Hi everyone!

This forum is great! Excellent responses all around and I appreciate the welcome. I agree with many of the things said above.

I will keep my response short to see if there is any real feasibility:

I specialize in rechargeable heating pads and making them more efficient. The only real variables are:

1. Cost of materials (silicon circuits, wrap material, charging connector [USB or wall outlet])

2. Assembly (circuit design, sewing)

3. Usage of electricity in watts

4. Heat generated


I can get the first three of those down to pretty damn near free, but I need a friendly cattle to test it on.

Is there someone on here who would like to volunteer a cattle for fitting?

If so please contact me at jtshana92 at gmail dot com .


In the meantime I will respond point by point to the issues raised above in my next post.

 

[JoeShanahan]

PureCountry:

Haha! Always one step behind genetics...

you said:

Kidding aside, there is very little profit margin in a beef calf for ranchers to afford a blanket on a beef animal, like something you see on horses. Buying it, and the time to put it on and maintain it, kills the notion for me.

I'd like to think you're well intentioned, and trying to help livestock and ranchers. If you're just trying to sell something and make money, you'd be better of to start in a wealthier industry where they throw money at prototype ideas, like the oilpatch.

I do appreciate your help; I certainly come here with well intentions. If I was looking for more money, I probably would be making clothing for dudes out on the bakken instead!

I simply see very cheap technology out here where i work that could be repurposed out west. People in the east view the heat that electrical circuits generate as a nuissance, not a potential benefit. So they often spend money to get rid of it!

Could you detail the margins on a beef calf and how much time goes into it? From birth to market, what is the time a rancher spends per cattle? If a calf fetches x price, what is that price and what is the percent margin the rancher takes home?

Do ranchers have insurance on their livestock? Do they hedge their cattle price ahead of time?

Oldtimer:

Thank you for your post. How much time do ranchers spend relocating/grazing/protecting cattle when news of a freeze gets out?


Silver:
I'm glad it worked! Your post is really interesting as well. What I think happened there is that the bag trapped in the heat the heifer was generating biologically. If that wasn't enough, say if it was -35C (which wasn't unseen this winter), I think a small heating pad in that bag (for say $15) would have guaranteed its survival further.



mrj:
I sincerely thank you for your post. It has been impossible for me to find any on the ground information about the storm or the harsh winter in general out in the plains. I am understanding your points about this being a rare and dangerous storm. I am happy to hear no ranchers were injured as well.

Does cattle insurance exist out there at all? Forgive me for being entirely ignorant on the issue. I'm of the opinion that a little cheap technology could go a long way in generating just enough heat to improve cattle survival rates. BUt there is no way for me to estimate for sure without sending a few prototypes for ranchers to try for themselves.


Faster horses, jodywy, and soapweed, I thank you all as well. I think I've answered the issues you've all raised above, but if there's something I missed then please do let me know.

Happy to help and interested to see if there's anything I can send out there for free. Field testing is the only way this could get done.

Joe

 

[DejaVu]

"Does cattle insurance exist out there at all? Forgive me for being entirely ignorant on the issue. I'm of the opinion that a little cheap technology could go a long way in generating just enough heat to improve cattle survival rates. BUt there is no way for me to estimate for sure without sending a few prototypes for ranchers to try for themselves."


What I've been reading are the ones who had insurance are finding it won't pay, or doesn't want to pay. There are conflicting determinations of the term "drowned". Figures doesn't it?

To put a blanket on a 1300lb cow, you would need to restrain her (put her in a chute). She'd probably have the thing torn off in about 24hours as this is something not in their nature. There's also a possibility of stampeding the rest of the herd because of appearance and an unfamiliar sound of the material.

Some years ago, I read somewhere that to warm a baby calf a guy poked a hole in a big black trash bag and stuck it over the baby. The hole was for it's head. When the calf was warm enough he (theoretically) would stand up and tear the trash bag away. Holy Batman. Did I ever have a mess with that first calf in a trash bag. Never again. The sight of 300+ cows headed south at a high rate of speed wasn't good. :shock: Mom wasn't interested in claiming a calf in a trash bag either.

 

[Big Muddy rancher]

"Does cattle insurance exist out there at all? Forgive me for being entirely ignorant on the issue. I'm of the opinion that a little cheap technology could go a long way in generating just enough heat to improve cattle survival rates. BUt there is no way for me to estimate for sure without sending a few prototypes for ranchers to try for themselves."


What I've been reading are the ones who had insurance are finding it won't pay, or doesn't want to pay. There are conflicting determinations of the term "drowned". Figures doesn't it?

To put a blanket on a 1300lb cow, you would need to restrain her (put her in a chute). She'd probably have the thing torn off in about 24hours as this is something not in their nature. There's also a possibility of stampeding the rest of the herd because of appearance and an unfamiliar sound of the material.

Some years ago, I read somewhere that to warm a baby calf a guy poked a hole in a big black trash bag and stuck it over the baby. The hole was for it's head. When the calf was warm enough he (theoretically) would stand up and tear the trash bag away. Holy Batman. Did I ever have a mess with that first calf in a trash bag. Never again. The sight of 300+ cows headed south at a high rate of speed wasn't good. :shock:

So your the guy that tried that trick. :wink: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[DejaVu]

I usually learn the hard way. Sometimes, I forget and do it all over just for the fun of it but not the trash bag deal. :lol:

 

[Anonymous]

"Does cattle insurance exist out there at all? Forgive me for being entirely ignorant on the issue. I'm of the opinion that a little cheap technology could go a long way in generating just enough heat to improve cattle survival rates. BUt there is no way for me to estimate for sure without sending a few prototypes for ranchers to try for themselves."


What I've been reading are the ones who had insurance are finding it won't pay, or doesn't want to pay. There are conflicting determinations of the term "drowned". Figures doesn't it?

To put a blanket on a 1300lb cow, you would need to restrain her (put her in a chute). She'd probably have the thing torn off in about 24hours as this is something not in their nature. There's also a possibility of stampeding the rest of the herd because of appearance and an unfamiliar sound of the material.

Some years ago, I read somewhere that to warm a baby calf a guy poked a hole in a big black trash bag and stuck it over the baby. The hole was for it's head. When the calf was warm enough he (theoretically) would stand up and tear the trash bag away. Holy Batman. Did I ever have a mess with that first calf in a trash bag. Never again. The sight of 300+ cows headed south at a high rate of speed wasn't good. :shock: Mom wasn't interested in claiming a calf in a trash bag either.

:lol: :lol: I have a tough time even keeping duct tape on their ears very long - as the mama's don't want it there and get it licked off... But usually its on long enough to get ears dried and warmed and circulation going good....

 

[JoeShanahan]

"Does cattle insurance exist out there at all? Forgive me for being entirely ignorant on the issue. I'm of the opinion that a little cheap technology could go a long way in generating just enough heat to improve cattle survival rates. BUt there is no way for me to estimate for sure without sending a few prototypes for ranchers to try for themselves."


What I've been reading are the ones who had insurance are finding it won't pay, or doesn't want to pay. There are conflicting determinations of the term "drowned". Figures doesn't it?

To put a blanket on a 1300lb cow, you would need to restrain her (put her in a chute). She'd probably have the thing torn off in about 24hours as this is something not in their nature. There's also a possibility of stampeding the rest of the herd because of appearance and an unfamiliar sound of the material.

Some years ago, I read somewhere that to warm a baby calf a guy poked a hole in a big black trash bag and stuck it over the baby. The hole was for it's head. When the calf was warm enough he (theoretically) would stand up and tear the trash bag away. Holy Batman. Did I ever have a mess with that first calf in a trash bag. Never again. The sight of 300+ cows headed south at a high rate of speed wasn't good. :shock: Mom wasn't interested in claiming a calf in a trash bag either.

It doesn't surprise me that an insurance firm won't pay. The amount of fly by night insurance salesmen out there disgusts me, and it stigmatizes an otherwise useful tool- protecting yourself from losing money due to unfortunate risk.

It sounds like everyone here is adamant, for good reason, in saying no to wrapping cattle in any way!

Is there a time when cattle can be kept stationary during a storm without them stampeding? I envision at least a heating zone, with heating pads buried in the dirt, to at least generate some ambient heat. I assure you it can be done on the cheap. Just need to understand the way cattle react to being penned in for a few nights in a row.

 

[Broke Cowboy]

"Does cattle insurance exist out there at all? Forgive me for being entirely ignorant on the issue. I'm of the opinion that a little cheap technology could go a long way in generating just enough heat to improve cattle survival rates. BUt there is no way for me to estimate for sure without sending a few prototypes for ranchers to try for themselves."


What I've been reading are the ones who had insurance are finding it won't pay, or doesn't want to pay. There are conflicting determinations of the term "drowned". Figures doesn't it?

To put a blanket on a 1300lb cow, you would need to restrain her (put her in a chute). She'd probably have the thing torn off in about 24hours as this is something not in their nature. There's also a possibility of stampeding the rest of the herd because of appearance and an unfamiliar sound of the material.

Some years ago, I read somewhere that to warm a baby calf a guy poked a hole in a big black trash bag and stuck it over the baby. The hole was for it's head. When the calf was warm enough he (theoretically) would stand up and tear the trash bag away. Holy Batman. Did I ever have a mess with that first calf in a trash bag. Never again. The sight of 300+ cows headed south at a high rate of speed wasn't good. :shock: Mom wasn't interested in claiming a calf in a trash bag either.

It doesn't surprise me that an insurance firm won't pay. The amount of fly by night insurance salesmen out there disgusts me, and it stigmatizes an otherwise useful tool- protecting yourself from losing money due to unfortunate risk.

It sounds like everyone here is adamant, for good reason, in saying no to wrapping cattle in any way!

Is there a time when cattle can be kept stationary during a storm without them stampeding? I envision at least a heating zone, with heating pads buried in the dirt, to at least generate some ambient heat. I assure you it can be done on the cheap. Just need to understand the way cattle react to being penned in for a few nights in a row.

LOL

Funny thread

Joe - if you really are in New York I am only a few hours north of you in Canada.

Bury heat pads in the dirt?

I let the cow schitte pile up - it heats naturally at even the coldest temperatures.

The cattle lay on it and keep warm - if you can beat that for pricing we can talk - but I get it for free and it is natural!!

bc

 

[Big Muddy rancher]

Joe maybe heating pads for dog beds might be a place to start your marketing.
Something the dog couldn't chew up and get electrocuted.

 

[mrj]

I believe no one has explained that cattle and other livestock are wonderfully designed to thrive in many climates, with breeds which do very well in very hot climates, such as the brahma influenced breeds, and the English and European breeds do better in even very cold climates. The cattle develop much heavier hair coats as cold winter starts in the fall, and lose that extra hair in the spring to withstand the heat of summer.

In fact, many cattle do not stay healthy if kept in barns which are too warm and not well ventilated, which allows excessive moisture to build up. As others stated, if they can stay dry, cattle will withstand severe cold very well. They can even have a build-up of snow on their backs and suffer no ill effects, especially if they are adequately fed.

Re. your 'heat pad' invention, we do use a heating pad designed for large dogs to warm baby calves born in cold weather, quite effectively, but that is only needed for short periods of time until they are eating well and if they are generally healthy.

I feel the major problem with your idea of some sort of coat, or even heating apparatus on the ground is that they cattle are normally not tame, retaining their wild animal characteristics when raised in range conditions. They would not tolerate, or at the least, would be definitely stressed, by having something strange attached to their bodies.

Logistics would be a problem, too. There are often hundreds of acres in pastures stocked with cattle at a rate of about 20 to 25 acres of native grass pastures per cow/calf unit, for instance. We might have a herd of 200 cows in a pasture and might not see them more than a couple of times a week in winter, and less often in other seasons. That herd of 200 head might be in a 2000 acre pasture. An acre is about the size of a football field. And the cattle are often quite widely dispersed across that pasture in small groups or even individually, so that would be a LOT of territory to warm!

It seems like a nice idea, but not practical, and very likely not beneficial to the animals, is my educated guess.

I don't want to discourage the flow of ideas, just pointing out the practical problems of this one.