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New Here, need help with a NH 648 baler

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Hello everyone,

As I stated im new here and in need of some help/advice. Im 21yrs old and have been working with my best friends grandfather on his farm for many many years. 3 seasons ago, he purchased a Brand New, New Holland 648 Silage Special round baler...Net/Twine and has the Bale Command Plus system. Ive been doing all the round bale`n with the machine since it was brought out to the farm. We have been having problems with the twine tie operation, sometimes the twine wont catch, leaving sides untied, other times the twine wont feed at all, and still other times the twine somehow becomes wrapped around the front roll instead of the bale itself. We have had our dealer out to the farm on several occasions...4 that i can remember. Each time they have claimed to make adjustments to the twine wands and have yet to produce satisfactory results. Then the bomb fell, a month or two ago I was finishing up an 8 acre field of hay (1st cutting mix of alf alfa and orchard grass). On my very last bale, the machine tripped, went into auto tie mode, but when I looked back to view the operation, the wands went about 1/2 way from home position and stopped. Upon inspection I could see that the wands are actually stuck against the knife bracket on the sides of the machine. I am absolutely certain that there are no adjustments that can correct this "drooping" problem. Joe, my good friend and "boss" (lol) and I have been all over the machine, inspecting every piece. We simply can not find any mechanical failures or breaks anywhere within the system. It is our speculation that the bracket to which the twine wands are connected has been welded improperly to the frame of the baler, leaving the wands to droop below their normal position. Upon inspection of similar machines, we see that the wands pass directly through the knife bracket (after the knives are in the up position). Our wands strike the bracket on the lower piece. we assume that they have been out of allignment since we first got the machine, and have been "jumping through" during tie operation, until just recently when they finally gave up and refuse to go through anymore.

I apologize for being so long-winded but this problem really has us stumped. I was wondering if anyone has ever encountered such a problem? Know of any fix? Any input at all would be greatly appreciated!

Just to let you know, the baler is sitting in our NH dealers shop as I am typing this. I am leaving at 9am tomorrow to go to the shop and literally tear the machine apart with their mechanics. In the mean time I would greatly appreciate some input, and I will also post back with an update after i get home from the dealer.

Thanks again! :)
 

Big Muddy rancher

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This won't be much help but maybe you should change your name from JD man to NH man.

I was having trouble with my 664 HN Bale Command. the slots where the actuator for the twine arms were sticky so loosened them and oiled and it worked better then the right hand side twine would not cut. had to loosen up the pipe that the knife is on and adjust the springs that pulled the knife closed. This might not help at all but let us know what you find out. Good Luck as it can be frustrating.
 
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haha....no im no New Holland guy... i really havent been impressed by either the engineering or the customer service so far. I actually think this baler is jealous....its tired of being towed around by a green machine haha

we just got a JD 6420....comfortgard cab....the works......its like a cadillac but bigger and green! l :D

thanks for the input...ill check into those adjustments and see what that does. I know ive worked with the actuator arms and the "knife pipe" as wel, they didnt seem to have much effect on the tie or moreover the darn "drooping wands" We`ll see how things turn out.....
 

Big Muddy rancher

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We pull our 664 with a 7400 JD. not new any more but a pleasure to drive. Could it be a bushing gone or could the arms be bent. Mine have caught on the wind guard over the pick up and stuck until I pulled the wind guard out to free them.
 
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not as far as I can tell, all the bushings are in place, the wands are straight, they are just at the wrong angle i think, that being because that bracket that is attached to the large round tube-frame on the front of the baler is welded at the wrong angle or somthing. They just dont want to pass through the knife bracket in the middle, like EVERYONE elses. ??? Like i said, this problem is beyond aggrevating :twisted:
 

sp

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Does your baler use net wrap, if so, throw that wind guard in the iron pile and use net. All that wind guard does is plug you up. the baler works better without if only if you are using net.
 

Maple Leaf Angus

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This might sound a little too simple, but if it is at the dealer's shop, would there be another 648 there to which you could do a visual comparison? (maybe you have already) Take some measurements while you are at it. The arms would not have to be out very much to make trouble.

I have not encountered anything like you are describing with ours. Then again, it gets to roll behind a Massey! :wink: :D

Interesting idea about removing the wind guard for net. It sure can make trouble at times.
 

sp

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Maple Leaf -
If you use net try running w/out the windguard.
NH needs to redesign the placement of the little guide wheels on the pickup. On corners, in long grass, the wheels restrict the grass from moving properly and it overloads the augers. Taking the windguard off helps, plus you can bale much bigger windrows on the straightaway.

I am on my 4th NH baler what I state above is consistent w/ all of them.
You need the windguard if you are baling with string. Without it grass gets in the knives and won't cut the string or entangles in the string and pulls it into the bale.
 

Maple Leaf Angus

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sp said:
Maple Leaf -
If you use net try running w/out the windguard.
NH needs to redesign the placement of the little guide wheels on the pickup. On corners, in long grass, the wheels restrict the grass from moving properly and it overloads the augers. Taking the windguard off helps, plus you can bale much bigger windrows on the straightaway.

I am on my 4th NH baler what I state above is consistent w/ all of them.
You need the windguard if you are baling with string. Without it grass gets in the knives and won't cut the string or entangles in the string and pulls it into the bale.

"sp"Thank you for that advice. The windguard has caused us problems in heavy rows and I had thot about leaving it off but figured it would get me into bigger troubles. If I do any more baling with net this summer I will try it.

Do you know if it works with straw too? Straw might be to light and fluffy to feed in without it.
 
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made it home from the dealer....we installed a new style twine wand that just came out as an update....instead of the plunger end it has a clasp, with two pieces of spring metal pressing against each other. We also installed a new wand tube on the left hand side of the machine which coordinated the movement of the wands with the knives. Everything seems to be fine now. ALthough we wont know for sure until we try to twine tie 1st cutting hay next season. 1st cutting around this area is usually very dense and slippery, by the far the most difficult cutting for the machine to handle. Thanks for all the info everyone, you have been most helpful. Have fun, be safe, and i wish everyone a great season/harvest!
 

sp

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Maple Leaf - try leaving the wind guard off in straw, it should work. Once you take it off you won't ever put it back on until you trade in the baler.

Another thing I found that helps start the bale. When you open the tailgate you will see a bottom roller w/ 4 ribs running the length of the roller. Wrap some net wrap around it about 6-10 wraps and leave it. It adds enough friction to pull in dry grass and helps start it rolling.

When you have the tailgate open, be sure and closely inspect all the frame
areas where the outside belts run up against them, primarily on the right side way up high. The belt will cut a groove in the frame and eventally the frame will break ($1500 and 3 days downtime). When you find the groove, weld it back flush and you will be ok for a few years. The dealer will tell you it's the way you run the baler, but don't believe him. It's in the design.

Replace all the chains at 6,000 bales, either weld or tighten all the slip clutches 50% more than recommended and you should have a pretty good baler!!!!
 

Maple Leaf Angus

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sp said:
Replace all the chains at 6,000 bales, either weld or tighten all the slip clutches 50% more than recommended and you should have a pretty good baler!!!!

Oooww! Since mine has given me no trouble to this point, I think I will leave it at factory setting!
 

3words

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Why would you want to weld,or tighten all the slip clutchs 50% more then recommended?All you will be doing,is looking for problems!!There's a reason there called slip clutch's.If your new holland baler is giving you that kind of grief,that you need to do that.Try out a vermeer baler,you will never go back after that.
 

sp

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3Words - You may be right, but this equipment only breaks down or needs parts when you are using it. Our closest Vermeer dealer is about 100 miles away, too far to run for parts.

We used a new JD for awhile last year. I think that will be my next baler.
 

3words

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sp-i wouldn't let the 100 mile drive for parts,be the thing that makes you decide to buy a john deere baler.I bought a new vermeer baler this year,after checking out other baler's on the market.I don't have a single regret now that haying season is over,never had a break down.The neighbour has a 3 year old vermeer baler,and he didn't break down either.I baled beside 3 different farmers running 567 john deere balers.None of them could make as well a built bale,my landlord had me baling on one quarter,and a different quarter rented to another guy with a john deere 567,and he said to me.Why can't they make as good a bale as you,i told him to just go ask them why they couldn't.He figured he better not.The next time it is raining,go for a drive to that vermeer dealership,and check out how heavy they are built compared to any other baler on the market.The baler design is the simpliest,and then check out the new price of a vermeer,and compare it to a John Deere.Your wife will be thanking you,after you get back from taking her on a holiday,just from the money you save.They sure think,that green paint is expensive!!
 

Faster horses

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3Words, we would SECOND everything you wrote.

We got the new Vermeer M and my husband, who has hated baling hay with round balers, now wishes there was more hay to bale. He hates to quit.

The guys looked at a lot of balers before buying the Vermeer and they were convinced they are the heaviest ones made. Even the HITCH is much heavier. My husband is really happy with the monitor, too. It was easy to run and we didn't have any problems with it. Put 1300 bales through it. That might not be much where you are, but here it is quite a few bales, and they baled up really fast. We got the net wrap and it is amazingly fast.
 

Shelly

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One thing you have to watch with the Vermeers. You can easily make a bale that's a little too heavy and a little too big. Causes major havoc with the belts. I know, because we had all the lacing tear out of our belts and the baler is only been used for 2 and a half seasons. What a headache!

FH, we put through well over 1500 bales this year. Other than the belt problem, our Vermeer has been trouble free.
 

3words

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Shelly,the belt problem isn't because it's a vermeer baler.All baler's will do that,if the bale is made to big all the time.The belts weren't made to stretch that far,so it ends up pulling out the lacing.I had that happen on my old hesston baler also.You think it's a pain changing belts on a vermeer,the hesston had another 4 belts to do on top of that!
 

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