No one else has bothered......

[kolanuraven]

Kola, I just thought it was time to put the post to rest. That is why I turned it about the bulls. That way everyone could walk away from the post.

But someone has to be childish and post it on all the other boards after I called you on turning their deaths into a political football. You didn't post it on the other boards for the soldiers..................you posted it on them with a vendetta in mind. That vacation sure didn't help you unwind..........you are wound tighter than I have seen you. Out of respect for these soldiers.................let's just put it to rest.

I moved the post for you.

I've no vendetta.....


So you want to ' cut & run'.... ??????????????????

 

[kolanuraven]

so I will.


4,000 dead now in Iraq.

FOUR THOUSAND, that's 8, 000 parents minus a child.

That's 4,000 less that will go to an amusement park and have fun this summer.

4,000 that won't get to go to the beach, fishing, Sunday picnics with the family.

4,000 that will never have the chance to either have kids or see their kids again.


FOUR THOUSAND.....and probably by the time I get done typing this....the number has grown over amount. :cry2: :cry2: :cry2: :cry2: :cry2:


May they have a peaceful eternity!

These men will be remembered and honored just as the 300+ in Desert Storm, the 58,000+ in Vietnam, the 400,000+ in WWII, etc, etc.


May all the forces protecting U.S. who gave the ultimate sacrifice have a peacefull eternity.

Mike....that's my point. Thank you...as no one will jump in your face.

 

[passin thru]

You just showed how much you really care about the soldiers.

 

[Steve]

but the timing of Easter morning Numbers release was a media ploy.. and political..

Sooo....you mean to say that those kids drove across the IED just so they'd make the news on Easter????

NO, the Media added 8 civilian employees to make it to 4000, an impactful significant number on Easter..

if they were honest and posted the "REAL" number it would have been 3992.. which is awful, but it seems the media only cares when it is a landmark number on an eventful day such as Easter.. which is sad and pathetic..

 

[Mrs.Greg]

That's what happens in wars, Kolo. The dang liberals voted for war, but then when people actually die, they act surprised and dismayed; "Oh, God, people are shooting at each other and people are dying! I never would of thought in a million years this kind of activity happened in a war! We've got to cut and run now!" :roll:

Oh for crying out loud,theres no way you and your buddies think that liberals are the only ones sad to be losing soldiers in any war North America is fighting....thats just plain silly.I'm sad anytime one of our Canadian boys come home in a coffin and so is my super conservative hubby

War is horrible and death of young people to war is horrible,thats just the plain and simple fact!!!!!!!

 

[Sandhusker]

That's what happens in wars, Kolo. The dang liberals voted for war, but then when people actually die, they act surprised and dismayed; "Oh, God, people are shooting at each other and people are dying! I never would of thought in a million years this kind of activity happened in a war! We've got to cut and run now!" :roll:

Oh for crying out loud,theres no way you and your buddies think that liberals are the only ones sad to be losing soldiers in any war North America is fighting....thats just plain silly.I'm sad anytime one of our Canadian boys come home in a coffin and so is my super conservative hubby

War is horrible and death of young people to war is horrible,thats just the plain and simple fact!!!!!!!

I'm not endorsing war and I'm not saying there shouldn't be any grief. I'm saying it's rediculous to vote to go to war and then start wailing when people die. Just what the heck did they expect would happen? If they didn't want people to die, they shouldn't of voted for it.

Why is responsibility for one's own actions such a foreign concept for liberals?

 

[Blkbuckaroo]

This thread has probably outlived it's usefulness!But i wonder how many folks on here have lost a loved one in this particular war!!!And if so do you think the sacrifice was worth it :???:Truthfully are we any better off?Not to take away anything from them,i have family in the military over there also!!And they signed up and went of there own accord,but a awlful lot of those kids are'nt sure anymore. I do believe that when you sign up for the military,you take the risk of being cast off into some foreign land and having the possibility of not coming home in the same form or shape you left in,that's a volunteers decision.It's the policy of particular wars we get into that's at question.No one wants to see there kid and anyones kid over there dying for reasons they don't agree with.The saddest thing is there's no obvious way out of the mess whether opposed or for the surge,more kids are on the way there,some for there 5 and 6 tours of duty.Not sure how the hell where gonna' get our butts outta that mess???Keep all that have fallen and gotten injured,and all that are on there way over there in your prayers!I am!

 

[CattleArmy]

Nonothing. it just went right over your head didn't it. I se you didn't read or comprehend what I wrote.........oh well you are a lib......we understand.

One little hint.................look where this was posted .... Political Bull

I would have posted it here to not at making a political statement because for the most part I'm not into who's running for office or even what Bush has or hasn't done. I just would have thought this was the more apporopriate spot since I thought the coffee shop was to be a light mood and I don't see many go to everything else that often. Guess I wouldn't have got it either.

The outrageous thing to me about this whole post is how callus people can become about others losing people they love. 4000 are dead and it's sad, it's sad no matter if they are liberal, conservative, democrats, or republicans. They are humans, they are dead, and that's sad.

Instead of using this post as a pissing contest how about taking a moment and remembering the 4000 dead and the families they left behind to mourn them. Think of the others over there risking their lives daily for a cause they believe enough in to risk their life.

 

[kolanuraven]

This is the strangest bunch of people. I make a post wishing the dead a peaceful eternity and I get called all kinds of names for posting that.

If you people who supported the war CAN NOT face the consequences of your support...which happens to be over 4,000 dead & 20K+ maimed for life....that's your problem.

Some of you pointed out that some of the number were ' just' contractors added to the count. "Just" contractors...as if they didn't matter to the human race? They just as dead as the others.

Your administration won't even allow the coffins to be seen coming home....they are slipped in under cover. Now how prideful is that?

Try all you want to make yourself feel better by jumping on me.....but it won't work. It won't work.

END OF THREAD.

 

[Sandhusker]

Kolo, "If you people who supported the war CAN NOT face the consequences of your support...which happens to be over 4,000 dead & 20K+ maimed for life....that's your problem."

Tell that to Hillary and every other dang liberal who voted for the war in the first place but doesn't have the stones to stand behind that vote.

 

[Steve]

KolanuRaven

Some of you pointed out that some of the number were ' just' contractors added to the count. "Just" contractors...as if they didn't matter to the human race? They just as dead as the others.

I didn't say Just Contractors.. or denigrate their deaths in any way..
unlike the media and antiwar crowd that fudged the numbers to make a statement..

KolanuRaven
Quote:

Ya know I thought about deleting the post I placed...but since it seems that all you WarHawks can't stand the see the REAL numbers of the dead in print....

Steve

I feel that every death is a reason to mourn the loss of lives.. not just the significant numbers the media picks to make a political point..

but the timing of Easter morning Numbers release was a media ploy.. and political..

Quote:

e AP count of 4,000 deaths is based on U.S. military reports and includes eight civilians who worked for the Department of Defense.

Steve

So if the Media and anti war crowd was honest and posted "REAL" numbers or were really concerned about the deaths of our men and woman in uniform they would have honestly reported 3992.. in print.. but they wanted to rush to 4000, so they could make it more impactful and to coincide with Easter, and again using the deaths of our soldiers for their political gain.. that is sad and pathetic..

and I stand by my comment...

Can you honestly say that on Easter Morning, 4000 American soldiers had lost their lives in Iraq.. knowing that the media and the anti-war left fudged the numbers to make that statement.. ?

 

[aplusmnt]

so I will.


4,000 dead now in Iraq.

FOUR THOUSAND, that's 8, 000 parents minus a child.

That's 4,000 less that will go to an amusement park and have fun this summer.

4,000 that won't get to go to the beach, fishing, Sunday picnics with the family.

4,000 that will never have the chance to either have kids or see their kids again.


FOUR THOUSAND.....and probably by the time I get done typing this....the number has grown over amount. :cry2: :cry2: :cry2: :cry2: :cry2:


May they have a peaceful eternity!

I agree with you 100%

I also am sad for the loss of these men and the loss their families have endured!

I also am mad as you that these men had to fight and lay down there lives due to Radical Muslims that have declared war upon America.

I am grateful every day that my children and 300 million Americans have been safe these past years due to the sacrafice these men made for their country!

I am also grateful for those that are still fighting and risking their lives to fight the evil of this world so me and my children will remain safe.

I believe everyone on here prayers go out to these soldiers and their families, not just on Easter but every day that we live and breath freedom and remain safer in America!

 

[sdsu rancher]

I'd like to add a few comments to this topic.

I spent 11 1/2 months in Iraq (April '03 - March '04). I came home with all the guys and gals with whom I went over with, something I am incredibly thankful for. I also came home with a piece of an Iraqi mortar in my back. So my view of the war has been shaped by my time there, not just what Anderson Cooper or Bill O'Reilly say.

I think sometimes we forget there is more at stake than our troops and our tax dollars. The Iraqi citizens future is in the balance. What happens now will affect how many of them die as their country gets on its feet. Saddam was a cruel dictator - something that many people have already forgotten. I heard many stories from Iraqi people who lost family members at the hands of him and his sons. There was no noble cause, much less simple justification, for the majority of those deaths. To me it is illogical to accuse the US of war crimes, as some have done, without at least accepting that our cause is noble. Don't spin me any conspiracy theories here - going after WMD's (even if mistakenly) that could harm the US was a noble cause in my opinion. I think most clear-thinking people have to agree. Going to war when you think there is a legitimate threat to your people's safety is noble. Killing entire villages for dissension is not noble.

I will make a few assumptions here...correct me if I am wrong in these. The liberal worldview is that everyone deserves a fair shake, no matter race, gender, sexual preference, religion, whatever. And if someone isn't getting a fair shake, then we as a society (usually via the government) should do something about it. I am often confused then why the vast majority of liberals are so against this war - a war that ended the reign of a cruel and unfair dictator, and is in the process of creating a government that will give Iraqis many of the same rights that we have as Americans. I mean, isn't that were we are now? Giving the threatened and underprivileged a fair shake? Forget about oil and WMD's and al-Qaiada for a second. The Iraqis have been oppressed and held back for decades - is not the liberal mindset to help people like this?

We are past the time for arguing why we went there. It is worth discussing for the next time this sort of situation arises, but that's all.

While deployed, I thought of myself as not only serving my country but also serving the people of Iraq. They are humans too. Just like the soldiers who have sacrificed.

In response to the original post in this thread, many HAVE bothered. I find it offensive that you think that "no one else has." I'll tell you what would be better than posting that message (which I suspect you knew would gather this sort of response - but I may be wrong). Seeing a soldier in uniform and shaking his or her hand and thanking them for volunteering to defend you and your family. Saying a prayer for their safety when you thank God for your food at the dinner table. Sending a letter to a hometown soldier who is overseas. Maybe you do these things. That is outstanding if you do. But please do not make the mistake of thinking that nobody else cares. The only people who do not care are the ones trying to kill us in the first place.[/i]

 

[Faster horses]

Wonderful message. Thank you for taking the time to share your thoughts with us. I'm one person who believes we are there for the right reasons.

I have 2 nephews who are Marines in Iraq and they volunteered to go back for more duty. One stepped on a mine and received 75 stitches in his face. He could have gone home, but would not because he knows our job there is not finished. I'm proud of both of them as I am all the other military who are over there.

In defense of Kola, she does way more than her share for the fighting men and women in Iraq. I admire her for that; but I do not believe the way she does. We more or less agree to disagree. But I will tell you this; she has done more for the soldiers there than I have.

Anyway, thank you so much for your post. And please, if you have more to add, please do so.

 

[Hooks]

to SDSU RANCHER..... :tiphat: thank you sir

 

[Clarencen]

Thanks sdsu rancher.

You have brought up several things we should all think about. I have always been hesitant about sending our troops into foreign lands. I had mixed feeling about going there and thought it likely we were getting into something where we might be there for years as we are in Korea.

There are many reasons why we are there but, one of them is that the people of Iraq deserve a better and more secure life than what they had.

One of my neighbors boys was home the last couple of weeks from Iraq. He said that we are doing a lot of good over there. I admire those young people who have volunyeered to give some years of their lifetime to serve there.

 

[sw]

Thank you so much sdsu rancher, not only for your service, but for replying to this and putting down in writing some things that needed to be said. Too many people just do not get it. There hatred of our President has blinded them and they just refuse to look at the truth.
BTW, we got a call from Falluja yesterday at noon, LCpl John says that it is so quiet there now that he had to go out and target practice with his machine gun to make sure it was working . I said that that is a good thing isn't it? He said yeah, that is what he keeps telling the newbies, that it was not alot of fun on first deployment when those old cars would blow up in front of you and then the towel heads start shooting at you.
Kola, you are plain nuts if you think no one else cares, you just did this to cause a fight which you did. Do you have the pictures and names of the 23 Marines from 2/3 WPNS CO who did not come home? I do, and I have a shirt given to me by the returning Marines with all of their names. Don't you think for a minute that I don't remember them and what they did for this country.

 

[kolanuraven]

Thank you so much sdsu rancher, not only for your service, but for replying to this and putting down in writing some things that needed to be said. Too many people just do not get it. There hatred of our President has blinded them and they just refuse to look at the truth.
BTW, we got a call from Falluja yesterday at noon, LCpl John says that it is so quiet there now that he had to go out and target practice with his machine gun to make sure it was working . I said that that is a good thing isn't it? He said yeah, that is what he keeps telling the newbies, that it was not alot of fun on first deployment when those old cars would blow up in front of you and then the towel heads start shooting at you.
Kola, you are plain nuts if you think no one else cares, you just did this to cause a fight which you did. Do you have the pictures and names of the 23 Marines from 2/3 WPNS CO who did not come home? I do, and I have a shirt given to me by the returning Marines with all of their names. Don't you think for a minute that I don't remember them and what they did for this country.

Mr. sw I'm not gonna get in a braggin match with you about who knows the most soldiers in Iraq.. who's got the most t shirts, etc.......that is not important.



And you're wrong again...I DID NOT post that for a fight.

You should know by now that I won't & don't go around corners for a fight...if I want one...I'll just out and out start one!!

I honestly don't think many of the WarHawks actually realize that there is blood and death involved in war.....too many old men are living " what would have been" or " if I'd have been there......" syndrome.


I never once, in my post, mentioned politics, money, taxes or political parties...I mourned their loss and wished them a peaceful eternity.


It's the rest of ya'll who started slingin' the shite!!

 

[Blkbuckaroo]

I'd like to add a few comments to this topic.

I spent 11 1/2 months in Iraq (April '03 - March '04). I came home with all the guys and gals with whom I went over with, something I am incredibly thankful for. I also came home with a piece of an Iraqi mortar in my back. So my view of the war has been shaped by my time there, not just what Anderson Cooper or Bill O'Reilly say.

I think sometimes we forget there is more at stake than our troops and our tax dollars. The Iraqi citizens future is in the balance. What happens now will affect how many of them die as their country gets on its feet. Saddam was a cruel dictator - something that many people have already forgotten. I heard many stories from Iraqi people who lost family members at the hands of him and his sons. There was no noble cause, much less simple justification, for the majority of those deaths. To me it is illogical to accuse the US of war crimes, as some have done, without at least accepting that our cause is noble. Don't spin me any conspiracy theories here - going after WMD's (even if mistakenly) that could harm the US was a noble cause in my opinion. I think most clear-thinking people have to agree. Going to war when you think there is a legitimate threat to your people's safety is noble. Killing entire villages for dissension is not noble.

I will make a few assumptions here...correct me if I am wrong in these. The liberal worldview is that everyone deserves a fair shake, no matter race, gender, sexual preference, religion, whatever. And if someone isn't getting a fair shake, then we as a society (usually via the government) should do something about it. I am often confused then why the vast majority of liberals are so against this war - a war that ended the reign of a cruel and unfair dictator, and is in the process of creating a government that will give Iraqis many of the same rights that we have as Americans. I mean, isn't that were we are now? Giving the threatened and underprivileged a fair shake? Forget about oil and WMD's and al-Qaiada for a second. The Iraqis have been oppressed and held back for decades - is not the liberal mindset to help people like this?

We are past the time for arguing why we went there. It is worth discussing for the next time this sort of situation arises, but that's all.

While deployed, I thought of myself as not only serving my country but also serving the people of Iraq. They are humans too. Just like the soldiers who have sacrificed.

In response to the original post in this thread, many HAVE bothered. I find it offensive that you think that "no one else has." I'll tell you what would be better than posting that message (which I suspect you knew would gather this sort of response - but I may be wrong). Seeing a soldier in uniform and shaking his or her hand and thanking them for volunteering to defend you and your family. Saying a prayer for their safety when you thank God for your food at the dinner table. Sending a letter to a hometown soldier who is overseas. Maybe you do these things. That is outstanding if you do. But please do not make the mistake of thinking that nobody else cares. The only people who do not care are the ones trying to kill us in the first place.[/i]

SD,Thanks for weighing in on this topic,just want to make clear no matter what differing views most of us have,we appreciate your service and all the men and women like you!!Enough said!!!

 

[MoGal]

Kola: Ran across this and you may be interested. If only 1 in 10 deaths are reported we've lost many more than 4000 and this is from 04/2007, a year ago.

. As Cutting Edge has been saying for four years now, the American military command in Iraq has been dramatically under-reporting soldier's deaths. We based our original analysis upon Col. David Hackworth's testimony, but this confirming report is based upon the eyewitness testimony of an American journalist.

NEWS BRIEF: "Green Zone Follies", TBRNews, April 23, 2007

"Baghdad, 21 Apr 07 -- "Six days ago, I was in an armed convoy driving through the McCain-safe streets of Baghdad when a non-existent rocket, made right here and not in Tehran, blasted into a truck carrying fifteen GI's. We had to stop, could not turn around because there were vehicles behind us, frantically trying to flee in all directions, and so I saw what were the shredded remains of all fifteen soldiers littering the street and smoldering ... There was not a word of this in our media at home and the official casualty lists, posted on the net didn't mention any of them. There are fifteen (dead soldiers) that never got reported."

This is vintage Col. Hackworth! The Colonel always said that the actual numbers of dead/wounded/injured was far, far higher than the official military command was reporting. In December, 2004, Col. Hackworth was reporting that the total number of soldiers who had to be evacuated from the war zone was at least 50,000 men! The official list of dead soldiers is still less than 4,000, and now we know why! (Read our Newsletter, December 18, 2004, Paragraph II)

Our military command is only reporting one casualty out of ten! Let us go back to this article for more information. This journalist knew the Army clerk in the Green Zone HQ who was responsible for publishing the list of dead American soldiers, so he went to talk to him.

"Fellow in the next building from me does the casualty reports for transmitting back to the States and he says they publish the names of one in ten. This has been a very bad month with over 300 known dead!"

This information is truly hot! While we have known all along that this kind of non-reporting was going on, we are still shocked to see someone verifying that our government is truly hiding the numbers of dead by 90%!

NOTE: Your Assistance Is Needed

We would like to call for your assistance on this matter. The Army Times maintains an official list of all Army dead at: http://www.militarycity.com/valor/honor.html

If Col. Hackworth, and this journalist, are correct, then a great number of American dead are not on this list. If you have lost a relative in Iraq, please go to this Army Times site to see if that name is on the list. If you know of anyone in your Sphere of Influence who has lost a loved one in Iraq, his or her name should be on this list.

If your deceased loved one is not on this list, email us at: [email protected]

We would really like to get to the bottom of this situation.



Now, this journalist tells us how bad matters truly have gotten in Iraq.

"This place has become a living hell, what with occasional snipers shooting our men inside the 'really safe' Green Zone, setting off bombs in the 'heavily guarded' Iraqi government compound and blowing up the hand puppet legislators at lunch, mortar rounds from the 'defeated insurgents' slamming down at all times of the day and night, and so on. This crazy Bush 'surge'is not working because we have had to withdraw all our troops from outlying provinces and they have been replaced with local religious crazies who shoot anything that moves. The insurgents have virtually destroyed the power grids so Baghdad gets electric power a few hours a day (at the very best) ..."

http://www.cuttingedge.org/newsletters/index.html