Rule 2 Blockage may be Expedited

[Sandhusker]

Q, "Prove how many positives will be sent down to the US when the border reopens. the problem here is you have to find a positive before you can say there are more. "

The USDA estimated 19, I think. But then again, they're the ones who say your ban was effective in 1999, too, so you need to take a fat pinch of salt with any of their numbers.

We don't need to find any more down here to prove you have BSE in your herd. 10 have already been found - therefore, it's been proved 10 times. For you to say Dorgan and R-CALF are wrong, you have to prove that either you won't be sending any more down, or that we will certainly catch them down here. Can you do that?

 

[QUESTION]

PROOF not estimates or guesses. Actual positive animals ? Answer my other questions. To be honest the only animal that can be age verified are PB cattle and those ones born after 2003 all others cannot be verified. I would guarentee all my animals there is no BSE in my herd all older animals i have had slaughtered in the past 3 years have come back negative when tested for BSE, so yes i can guarentee all my animals negative. I do not feed animal based supplements only plant based supplement. It is a nice start now keep going and answer the rest of my previouse questions unless you want to change the subject then i will take it that you accept that i am right.

 

[Sandhusker]

PROOF not estimates or guesses. Actual positive animals ? Answer my other questions. To be honest the only animal that can be age verified are PB cattle and those ones born after 2003 all others cannot be verified. I would guarentee all my animals there is no BSE in my herd all older animals i have had slaughtered in the past 3 years have come back negative when tested for BSE, so yes i can guarentee all my animals negative. I do not feed animal based supplements only plant based supplement. It is a nice start now keep going and answer the rest of my previouse questions unless you want to change the subject then i will take it that you accept that i am right.

The topic is whether or not BSE can be spread in the US under the USDA's new rule. If you can't prove BSE won't be spread via the new rule, you're just flapping your lips.

However, your proof is that you have BSE in cattle of the same age that the USDA plans on letting into our country. It is an undeniable fact.

 

[Tam]

PROOF not estimates or guesses. Actual positive animals ? Answer my other questions. To be honest the only animal that can be age verified are PB cattle and those ones born after 2003 all others cannot be verified. I would guarentee all my animals there is no BSE in my herd all older animals i have had slaughtered in the past 3 years have come back negative when tested for BSE, so yes i can guarentee all my animals negative. I do not feed animal based supplements only plant based supplement. It is a nice start now keep going and answer the rest of my previouse questions unless you want to change the subject then i will take it that you accept that i am right.

The topic is whether or not BSE can be spread in the US under the USDA's new rule. If you can't prove BSE won't be spread via the new rule, you're just flapping your lips.

However, your proof is that you have BSE in cattle of the same age that the USDA plans on letting into our country. It is an undeniable fact.

What stopped the spread of BSE in the US when there was open trade and no RULES? After years of open trade the US was not infected with classic BSE so what makes you think you will be NOW?

 

[Sandhusker]

PROOF not estimates or guesses. Actual positive animals ? Answer my other questions. To be honest the only animal that can be age verified are PB cattle and those ones born after 2003 all others cannot be verified. I would guarentee all my animals there is no BSE in my herd all older animals i have had slaughtered in the past 3 years have come back negative when tested for BSE, so yes i can guarentee all my animals negative. I do not feed animal based supplements only plant based supplement. It is a nice start now keep going and answer the rest of my previouse questions unless you want to change the subject then i will take it that you accept that i am right.

The topic is whether or not BSE can be spread in the US under the USDA's new rule. If you can't prove BSE won't be spread via the new rule, you're just flapping your lips.

However, your proof is that you have BSE in cattle of the same age that the USDA plans on letting into our country. It is an undeniable fact.

What stopped the spread of BSE in the US when there was open trade and no RULES? After years of open trade the US was not infected with classic BSE so what makes you think you will be NOW?

I don't know what stopped BSE. Neither do you, Question, OT, Haymaker, or anybody else.

What we all know is that you have BSE, that you have BSE in the age range of cattle the USDA will allow, and that we have holes in our feed ban. I give you the opportunity to deny any bit of that statement. If you can, do it. If not, you don't have a leg to stand on.

We also also know that you can't show that the new rule won't spread BSE as Dorgan and R-CALF fear.

 

[QUESTION]

What makes me wonder is there is no way to tell if a live animal definatively has BSE. Yet with thousands of cattle going south prior to 2003 from the herd you guys say has a epidemic of BSE none was carried in to the US. :roll: Maybe you should put the BSE zapper in texas or alabama insterad of beside the weather machine :shock: You asked me to guarentee my cattle are free of BSE i can do that for my cattle, because i know what has been fed to them but i can't speak for others. My mirade of questions was posted earlier but it just comes down to this, prove the US doesn't have a worse problem with BSE than Canada. That is what the rest of the world thinks canada is being open and honest disclosing positives and has enhanced the feedban to eliminate the disease. The US on the other hand is still allowing cows to eat cows and point fingers saying it is worse everwhere else and we don't have a problem because we haven't found that many positives so the US is decreasing testing level even thought the results have been proven to be unreliable as young animals were tested and submitted as older cattle. Basically in terms of BSE the US operates lika a banana republic and the rest of the world knows it. On Tams point NO BSE came in th the US from canada prior to 2003 from thousands of cattle what has changed? Why would it now.

 

[Anonymous]

On Tams point NO BSE came in th the US from canada prior to 2003 from thousands of cattle what has changed? Why would it now.

Why does one cow in a herd get BSE- while all the others eating the same feed do not?
We don't know...

So why did no US cattle get BSE from Canada before?
We don't know...

But we do know the facts that Canada has found many more BSE cattle than the US (12 in a herd 1/8th the size compared to 2 )--and that CFIA admitted in July the Canadian feedban didn't work and that the disease was still manifesting and expanding in Canada...We do know that the US CDC says Canadian cattle are 26 times the risk to have the disease than US cattle... We do know that Dr. Cashman (Canadas leading TSE/BSE expert) made the statement of as many as 50 BSE infected cattle in Canada...

We do know that just the known facts increases the risk to US consumers, the US cattle herd, and the US product demand...We also know that US cattlemen have nothing to gain from the border to open-- but everything to lose......

 

[Sandhusker]

What makes me wonder is there is no way to tell if a live animal definatively has BSE. Yet with thousands of cattle going south prior to 2003 from the herd you guys say has a epidemic of BSE none was carried in to the US. :roll: Maybe you should put the BSE zapper in texas or alabama insterad of beside the weather machine :shock: You asked me to guarentee my cattle are free of BSE i can do that for my cattle, because i know what has been fed to them but i can't speak for others. My mirade of questions was posted earlier but it just comes down to this, prove the US doesn't have a worse problem with BSE than Canada. That is what the rest of the world thinks canada is being open and honest disclosing positives and has enhanced the feedban to eliminate the disease. The US on the other hand is still allowing cows to eat cows and point fingers saying it is worse everwhere else and we don't have a problem because we haven't found that many positives so the US is decreasing testing level even thought the results have been proven to be unreliable as young animals were tested and submitted as older cattle. Basically in terms of BSE the US operates lika a banana republic and the rest of the world knows it. On Tams point NO BSE came in th the US from canada prior to 2003 from thousands of cattle what has changed? Why would it now.

Q, most of your problem is with the USDA, not me, Dorgan, nor R-CALF. Funny how you don't trust their judgement on BSE in their own country, but you trust their judgement on your country. That sure makes a lot of sense. :roll:

Tam's point has no bearing on the topic of the rule. Dorgan and R-CALF aren't speculating on the past, they're making educated predictions on the future. Tam thinks it was OK yesterday, so it'll be OK tomorrow. That's beyond weak. If the local watering hole called Tam tonight and told her that BM was drunker than a skunk and talking about driving home, do you think she would say, "That's OK, he made it home that way last week, let him have his keys"? What if somebody called you and told you your neighbor's cow killer was in with your heifers. Would you say, "That's fine, he didn't breed any last year when he got in, I don't see why he would breed any now". :roll:

 

[QUESTION]

Macarthyism. :roll: It just doesn't make any sense it is completely illogical and statistically as improbable as an albino aberdeen angus that so many canadian cattle prior to 2003 were imported by the US and none were bse positive and none made it to the food chain human or otherwise without infection. Anyone looking at this logically would say with all those canadian cows coming into the US prior to 2003 there were some that passed BSE into the US cow herd thru contaminated feed as MBM is still being fed to cattle in the US. Thus where are the positives Typical BSE cattle in the US? The only assertainable conclusion is that the US has been hiding positive animals or missing positives thus further contanimating the US cowherd. So how would importing more otm canadian animal increase the risk to the consumer. As for the cdc numbers they are based on the number of confirmed positive animal in both countries. What about all the presumptive positive animals reported to the USDA that go missing before the can be definitively tested that estimate is flawed. Acchording to the last numbers in 2003 close to 500 head of PP cattle were not tested check the numbers with the USDA reports. So it follows that the best predictor of future behavior is past behavior. The US has been ignoring presumptive positive animals so why stop. It could mean that closed to 500 positives per year are hidden that is not scary it is neglegent. That will destroy the US cattle industry faster than anything else. Here is my solution kill every bovine OTM as of today in north america none of it can be used in any animal feed and test every one of them but, the UKand US tests animals from canada. Canada and the UK test the US animals. So there is no false results. I can hear the cry babies right now This would hurt too much, too bad people don't have the balls to do what is needed they would rather complain about how bad things are rather than fix them.But that won't happen US producers won't let it. What WILL happen is r-calf will file a court injunction to keep the border closed to OTM cattle but will fail as they have had the opportunity to present during the comment period and counldn't present a defendable position to keep the border closed. But this will delay the inevitable. OTM canadian cattle going into the US to be processed. SH my problem is with people in denial about BSE in the US of which you and r-calf are part of.

 

[RobertMac]

Question, do you understand how many people would be involved in a conspiracy to cover-up all the BSE cattle you claim we have????

How many herd cohorts to Canada's BSE cases also tested positive????

You need to come back to the real world. :hat:

 

[HAY MAKER]

Question, do you understand how many people would be involved in a conspiracy to cover-up all the BSE cattle you claim we have????

How many herd cohorts to Canada's BSE cases also tested positive????

You need to come back to the real world. :hat:

And since we are talking conspiracy,I find it very strange that canada had a run going on BSE positives,till Mexico went on record saying one more positive and no more canada beef would be allowed in their country,after that statement BSE seems to have dried up,or the canucks finally got diesel for their backhoes.................good luck

 

[HAY MAKER]

:shock: Come on Haymaker you can do better than that to divert the topic. If you can't, just answer the question what was protecting the US cattle herd from the threat of BSE while you were openly importing from not just Canada but other BSE effected countries before they actuallly found they had BSE??

NO the post I was refering to was the fruit cake Marsh Bull Sheist..............good luck

PS some of the questions you ask are kinda like me asking you............what are you going to do Miss Tam if one day you decide to hook up a shetland pony to your little minature stagecoach and on your trek to Montana your little pony spooks,you fall off and skin your fat ash ?

Well when you quote a part of a persons original post that is usually the part you are talking about Haymaker. And since you quoted the great way to sell beef part of my post to you I would have to think that was the post you were talking about.
And it sure is funny how you and Oldtimer will believe any crap that comes out about Canada and our BSE scientific based or not but when someone posts a twenty year old Scientific prediction that was right on the money about the US and their BSE problem it's pure BULL SHEIST


PS. More diversion Haymaker, the answer to your question, first don't you remember the Deadwood pictures my ash isn't fat :wink: but I would probably get up dust myself off and take a look at the damage, repair it and GET ON WITH LIFE. I wouldn't roll all my hard work into the coulee, shoot the stetland pony and stand there kicking at the dirt bitching until someone came along to give me a ride home.
They say what doesn't kill you only makes you stronger. Kind of like BSE and the Canadian Beef industry We had some trouble, but we picked our asses up off the ground and did something about it and we are trying to get on with life.

Now answer my question what was protecting the US herd from all those years of open trading that can't protect you now?

I dont know,maybe you can tell me,you seem to have all the answers ?
good luck

 

[QUESTION]

I know Us cattlemen would rather cover up than admit a problem as montana rancher said on cbc when canada found BSE " don't them canucks know how to shoot, shovel and shut up" un quote. I know it seem improbalbe but how else can it be explained?

 

[Anonymous]

I know Us cattlemen would rather cover up than admit a problem as montana rancher said on cbc when canada found BSE " don't them canucks know how to shoot, shovel and shut up" un quote. I know it seem improbalbe but how else can it be explained?

That was after the Alberta Premier- Ralph Klein promoted it as a Provincial policy-eh :???: :wink: :lol:

 

[Sandhusker]

Question, "SH my problem is with people in denial about BSE in the US of which you and r-calf are part of."

You've got to be flipping kidding me. :shock:

 

[QUESTION]

OT - Ralph was quoting the montana rancher interviewed by the CBC. SH you and r-calf are part of the problem or do you admit that there are cases of BSE positive cattle in the US that are running around right now. If not prove that the US is BSE free. I'm sure you think you can. But you have no idea.

 

[Anonymous]

OT - Ralph was quoting the montana rancher interviewed by the CBC. SH you and r-calf are part of the problem or do you admit that there are cases of BSE positive cattle in the US that are running around right now. If not prove that the US is BSE free. I'm sure you think you can. But you have no idea.

BULLPUCKEY-- YOU DREAM UP HALF OF WHAT YOU POST....EITHER THAT OR YOU ARE AN OUTRIGHT LIAR !!!!!

So much for the credibility of Question mark :wink: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

In 2003, mad cow disease was discovered in a cow in Alberta. The cow was inspected, found to be substandard and removed so that it would not be fed to animals or humans. The carcass was turned to oils and the head sent to the United Kingdom where the case of mad cow was confirmed.[4] Klein would say, "I guess any self-respecting rancher would have shot, shovelled and shut up, but he didn't do that," referring to the farmer in northern Alberta whose animal was found to have the disease when it was taken to a slaughterhouse. Exports of Canadian beef cattle had already been stopped at the US border, with other countries already following suit.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ralph_Klein

 

[Anonymous]

Questionable-- heres a Canuck source for you too:

"I guess any self-respecting rancher would have shot, shovelled and shut up, but he didn't do that."
Klein's 2003 advice to an Alberta farmer on what he should have done after finding a BSE-infected cow in his heard.
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20061030/klein_quotes_061030/20061031/

"You would have to eat 10 billion meals of brains, spinal cords, ganglia, eyeballs and tonsils."
Klein in 2005 on the risk being infected with bovine spongiform encephalitis, or mad cow disease.

An example of the scientific leadership of the Canucks :roll: :roll: :wink: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[QUESTION]

Listen DICK Check out- fourcountries.onlinedemocracy- Re:shoot shovel and shut up. The first unidentified man saying it on tape was a montana rancher who wanted to remain unidentified in billings. Check the facts with the CBC. So get your facts straight DICK. And in fact ralph was sarcastically responding to the show shoot, shovel and shut up. It is all about context . Maybe you should look it up in a dictionary. I would say so much for your crediblity. But everyone know you haven't any to start with. You only use partial quotes and half truths taken out of context as you don't have a leg to stand on DICK. And you wonder who cuts your wires and let those hayburners run down the road, does it really suprise you that someone would do that. There are reprecussions for acting like a DICK.

 

[Anonymous]

Listen DICK Check out- fourcountries.onlinedemocracy- Re:shoot shovel and shut up. The first unidentified man saying it on tape was a montana rancher who wanted to remain unidentified in billings. Check the facts with the CBC. So get your facts straight DICK. And in fact ralph was sarcastically responding to the show shoot, shovel and shut up. It is all about context . Maybe you should look it up in a dictionary. I would say so much for your crediblity. But everyone know you haven't any to start with. You only use partial quotes and half truths taken out of context as you don't have a leg to stand on DICK. And you wonder who cuts your wires and let those hayburners run down the road, does it really suprise you that someone would do that. There are reprecussions for acting like a DICK.

Another of your unidentified persons--eh :wink: :lol: :lol: :lol:

I'll let folks judge on their own....


Are you confessing? Just so you know when it is commited to influence a person-- it no longer is a misdemeanor...It then becomes a felony...And if you do it in my official capacity-- then it becomes a terrorist act....

45-5-221. Malicious intimidation or harassment relating to civil or human rights -- penalty. (1) A person commits the offense of malicious intimidation or harassment when, because of another person's race, creed, religion, color, national origin, or involvement in civil rights or human rights activities, he purposely or knowingly, with the intent to terrify, intimidate, threaten, harass, annoy, or offend:
(a) causes bodily injury to another;
(b) causes reasonable apprehension of bodily injury in another; or
(c) damages, destroys, or defaces any property of another or any public property.
(2) For purposes of this section, "deface" includes but is not limited to cross burning or the placing of any word or symbol commonly associated with racial, religious, or ethnic identity or activities on the property of another person without his or her permission.
(3) A person convicted of the offense of malicious intimidation or harassment shall be imprisoned in the state prison for a term not to exceed 5 years or be fined an amount not to exceed $5,000, or both.

I will see to it that the Sheriff gets your IP number....I've already notified folks on the threats you PMed me on cattletoday.com....