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Time to shut down the border again?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Anonymous
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Anonymous

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I finally got a couple of days to check out some sales...Things going to hell in a handbasket fast...Calves that were selling for $800-$850- up to $900 on tops during border closure times are now selling for $600- $650- didn't depend much on the weight- same price...

Didn't matter if they had the fancy tags and birthdates- or just an affidavit- all the same price...As one fella said that had gone thru the problem, time, and expense of tagging his calves, "last time I do that"....Like he said the stress of headgating them during preconditioning, chance of them getting injured, extra time, and labor costs along with the tags was worthless...Just another line of BS being sold us by the USDA/NCBA/Packers....

Comment I heard most often was that if we have that much of an oversupply of cattle that the packers are cutting back on slaughter- why are we still importing :???: And even with this more parred up money and supposed more open trade rules with Canada- not a Canuck buyer anywhere to be seen- or a person that has seen one at all again this year- and these were sales within 60 and 100 miles of the Border... Sounds like it is still all southbound trade only that Canada wants... Some FAIR trade :???:

Naturally I had to make a comment about having to donate another $100 to R-CALF- which was immediatley followed by a couple of folks saying "$100 hell - I'll donate $1000 if they can get this border shut down again".... And I don't think NCBA is gaining any members by their undying support of USDA, which has kept us from opening any export markets for this glut of beef to go to... What is it Mike John said "we don't want to compete with them..." :roll: :???:
 
Why not tell the truth for once OT?

Fat steers going from the US into Ontario to kill.

Feed costs climbing, and red ink for feeders and packers.

Near record slaughter weights.

Consumer spending on beef declining.

Maybe those factors have more effect on the falling prices.

Sounds like the cycle has just caught up with everyone.
 
Hey OT why not note the cost of barley and corn? Barley that we could buy for our feedlot last year was $1.50 to a low of $1.20 this year we cant touch it for $3.00 . Double the cost. You and your R-calf tactics..... :wink:
 
Manitoba_Rancher said:
Hey OT why not note the cost of barley and corn? Barley that we could buy for our feedlot last year was $1.50 to a low of $1.20 this year we cant touch it for $3.00 . Double the cost. You and your R-calf tactics..... :wink:

.....feed and fall pasture shortages due to drought........ everybody and their dog hauling all their calves to town...........tight supplies of feedgrains worldwide................ Yup. Better send R-Calf at least a grand OT. Closing the border again will definitely put your feeder prices through the roof. :roll:
Long live R-Calf!!! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
 
Well Jason- No lie- exactly what I saw and heard...You may not like what folks are saying- but thats it...

Like I said 2 years ago- after the border was closed and we immediately saw RECORD across the board prices- its going to be very hard to convince a lot of people anymore that these imports aren't negatively effecting prices...

The border closure showed many, even some of the skeptics, the effects of these Canadian imports on US prices...

And it is definitely stirring the pot down here again....
 
Oldtimer said:
Well Jason- No lie- exactly what I saw and heard...You may not like what folks are saying- but thats it...

Like I said 2 years ago- after the border was closed and we immediately saw RECORD across the board prices- its going to be very hard to convince a lot of people anymore that these imports aren't negatively effecting prices...

The border closure showed many, even some of the skeptics, the effects of these Canadian imports on US prices...

And it is definitely stirring the pot down here again....

So OT, what do YOU believe is affecting feeder prices to the greatest extent?....... imports or other factors?(feed costs,drought, etc.)
You've already stated what other folks are saying..... what is your take on it????
 
Sandhusker says"You're not going to win any allies spreading misinformation like that. R-CALF was NOT formed to stop Canadian imports. They were formed to address what many people saw as unfair trade practices that threatened US producers. "

OT is whining again. Calf prices are down in Canada why would buyers go south and buy calves that will have more frieght then the calves at home. They would have to be cheaper down there. I don't think you'd want to see Canadian buyers cause things would be a whole lot worse
 
Farm groups from NY/Michigan/Ohio etc. are now complaining in Ontario that they think their packers are going to go under because the Better Beef plant got so much more efficient with the border closed/Cargill takeover that they're now sucking a pile of cattle north because the US packers in the Great Lakes region can't compete on efficiency.
 
TimH said:
Oldtimer said:
Well Jason- No lie- exactly what I saw and heard...You may not like what folks are saying- but thats it...

Like I said 2 years ago- after the border was closed and we immediately saw RECORD across the board prices- its going to be very hard to convince a lot of people anymore that these imports aren't negatively effecting prices...

The border closure showed many, even some of the skeptics, the effects of these Canadian imports on US prices...

And it is definitely stirring the pot down here again....

So OT, what do YOU believe is affecting feeder prices to the greatest extent?....... imports or other factors?(feed costs,drought, etc.)
You've already stated what other folks are saying..... what is your take on it????

All of the above- also big shortage in trucks since there is a big rush going on right now for contracted calves- all going about 2 weeks to a month earlier than normal because of the drought ( which is also really affecting contract calves because most I've seen are all coming in anywhere from 30- 125lbs lighter than what they were contracted at)...Fuel prices are apparently still affecting prices too- as the calves selling 200 miles closer to the feedlots are bringing around $5-7 cwt more- same buyers buying...

Personally the numbers I've heard and I think are about right is that the Canadian border closure amounted to about 20-25% of the price increase.... That would mean the 550's selling today for $1.10 or $605 would be bringing about $1.38 or $760-- Fats that are selling for $88 would be closer to $1.10... Kind of like when the border was closed/or when no live fats were allowed in to manipulate the markets with...
 
TimH said:
Oldtimer said:
Well Jason- No lie- exactly what I saw and heard...You may not like what folks are saying- but thats it...

Like I said 2 years ago- after the border was closed and we immediately saw RECORD across the board prices- its going to be very hard to convince a lot of people anymore that these imports aren't negatively effecting prices...

The border closure showed many, even some of the skeptics, the effects of these Canadian imports on US prices...

And it is definitely stirring the pot down here again....

So OT, what do YOU believe is affecting feeder prices to the greatest extent?....... imports or other factors?(feed costs,drought, etc.)
You've already stated what other folks are saying..... what is your take on it????


TimH:

I think OT is a lil bias because he uses the R-calf bible. Heck I even hear hes using R-calf toilet paper :shock: :lol: :shock: :lol:
 
Big Muddy rancher said:
Sandhusker says"You're not going to win any allies spreading misinformation like that. R-CALF was NOT formed to stop Canadian imports. They were formed to address what many people saw as unfair trade practices that threatened US producers. "

OT is whining again. Calf prices are down in Canada why would buyers go south and buy calves that will have more frieght then the calves at home. They would have to be cheaper down there. I don't think you'd want to see Canadian buyers cause things would be a whole lot worse

BMR- About a half dozen of the ones screaming the loudest today were some of your Daniels/Sheridan county neighbors....Apparently they are seeing the handwriting on the wall too...
 
Oldtimer said:
TimH said:
Oldtimer said:
Well Jason- No lie- exactly what I saw and heard...You may not like what folks are saying- but thats it...

Like I said 2 years ago- after the border was closed and we immediately saw RECORD across the board prices- its going to be very hard to convince a lot of people anymore that these imports aren't negatively effecting prices...

The border closure showed many, even some of the skeptics, the effects of these Canadian imports on US prices...

And it is definitely stirring the pot down here again....

So OT, what do YOU believe is affecting feeder prices to the greatest extent?....... imports or other factors?(feed costs,drought, etc.)
You've already stated what other folks are saying..... what is your take on it????

All of the above- also big shortage in trucks since there is a big rush going on right now for contracted calves- all going about 2 weeks to a month earlier than normal because of the drought ( which is also really affecting contract calves because most I've seen are all coming in anywhere from 30- 125lbs lighter than what they were contracted at)...Fuel prices are apparently still affecting prices too- as the calves selling 200 miles closer to the feedlots are bringing around $5-7 cwt more- same buyers buying...

Personally the numbers I've heard and I think are about right is that the Canadian border closure amounted to about 20-25% of the price increase.... That would mean the 550's selling today for $1.10 or $605 would be bringing about $1.38 or $760-- Fats that are selling for $88 would be closer to $1.10... Kind of like when the border was closed/or when no live fats were allowed in to manipulate the markets with...

Ya wanna stick with that Dick, or would you like to waffle on it before I pull your pants down and give everyone yet another look at your wrinkled old yellow bee-hind?? :D :D :D
 
Oldtimer said:
I finally got a couple of days to check out some sales...Things going to hell in a handbasket fast...Calves that were selling for $800-$850- up to $900 on tops during border closure times are now selling for $600- $650- didn't depend much on the weight- same price...

Didn't matter if they had the fancy tags and birthdates- or just an affidavit- all the same price...As one fella said that had gone thru the problem, time, and expense of tagging his calves, "last time I do that"....Like he said the stress of headgating them during preconditioning, chance of them getting injured, extra time, and labor costs along with the tags was worthless...Just another line of BS being sold us by the USDA/NCBA/Packers....

Comment I heard most often was that if we have that much of an oversupply of cattle that the packers are cutting back on slaughter- why are we still importing :???: And even with this more parred up money and supposed more open trade rules with Canada- not a Canuck buyer anywhere to be seen- or a person that has seen one at all again this year- and these were sales within 60 and 100 miles of the Border... Sounds like it is still all southbound trade only that Canada wants... Some FAIR trade :???:

Naturally I had to make a comment about having to donate another $100 to R-CALF- which was immediatley followed by a couple of folks saying "$100 hell - I'll donate $1000 if they can get this border shut down again".... And I don't think NCBA is gaining any members by their undying support of USDA, which has kept us from opening any export markets for this glut of beef to go to... What is it Mike John said "we don't want to compete with them..." :roll: :???:


If all of the calves are about the same price per head cost of gain must be high. Wow corn has gone up alot in the last couple months.

Maybe if the guys putting in those fancy tags would have tried to find a buyer that would pay more instead of just dumping them at the sale barn they would have seen the premiums that thay should see.
 
Timmy boy- about the only way your going to disprove those prices to those that saw them before are if the border was shut tight today and the prices didn't go to that-- Nothing else will show it.....

You have to remember that figures aren't the whole game here- much of it is the Packers Canadian captive supply (remember all those the Packer owned/controlled sold first that took all the BSE disaster funds, while everyone else took it in the shorts) which figures even more into the picture....
 
Oldtimer said:
Timmy boy- about the only way your going to disprove those prices to those that saw them before are if the border was shut tight today and the prices didn't go to that-- Nothing else will show it.....

You have to remember that figures aren't the whole game here- much of it is the Packers Canadian captive supply (remember all those the Packer owned/controlled sold first that took all the BSE disaster funds, while everyone else took it in the shorts) which figures even more into the picture....

So are you sticking to your " CDN imports are to blame for 20 to 25% of the price drop" or aren't you???
It's a simple question. :D
 
OT- you keep walking your way around mentioning anything about the barley and corn prices. From the way you talk we can tell that you know nothing about running a cattle feedlot. All you know is Close the border. If you wanna close it to our cattle then I say shut off all your neccessities that you use that come from Canada.
 
Maybe if the guys putting in those fancy tags would have tried to find a buyer that would pay more instead of just dumping them at the sale barn they would have seen the premiums that thay should see.

Andy- I've been watching a lot of contract cattle go this fall too-- that are being bought by several different buyers for a multitude of feedlots and owners- and I've only seen one that wanted the tags- and that producer probably lost money because he contracted way early before he knew how dry it was going to get and his calves came in 50-60 lbs light which cost him probably $10 cwt- which put them about the same price as the sale barn cattle...This was a branded beef program that buys back calves from guys that buy their bulls from him....

All others have preferred and are getting signed affidavits....Many of these calves I saw sell at the sale barn were lots of 50-200 that were selling with all natural certificates/ birthdate affidavits- that brought as much as the one tagged lot did....But I am seeing this year a whole lot more that want the affidavits- even with the sale barn lots...
 
TimH said:
Oldtimer said:
Timmy boy- about the only way your going to disprove those prices to those that saw them before are if the border was shut tight today and the prices didn't go to that-- Nothing else will show it.....

You have to remember that figures aren't the whole game here- much of it is the Packers Canadian captive supply (remember all those the Packer owned/controlled sold first that took all the BSE disaster funds, while everyone else took it in the shorts) which figures even more into the picture....

So are you sticking to your " CDN imports are to blame for 20 to 25% of the price drop" or aren't you???
It's a simple question. :D

If the border was closed- I believe prices would be 20 to 25% higher across the board......Thats about where they set with cull differences right now too....

And Manitoba- I did acknowledge all the other reasons (feed prices, fuel, truck shortages, etc)...But if we don't have as much demand and packers are cutting back slaughter- part of it lost because of all Canada's mad cow announcements-- then why should we need to import? Especially when we are not exporting to any real point yet.....

What necessity are you going to cut out? Oil- Yeah- maybe Montana oil can get into the pipeline then and bring more than $40 barrel :wink: ....
 
Geez I know alot of ranchers in Sheridan county too but none that are that damned dumb-but I guess if that's what helps you 'play ranchers' through the day whine on. If it isn't our wolves its our cattle-every crybaby rancher in Montana must be on this board because I've never met any down there that pee and moan as much as you do. I guess it's because I dealt with real ranchers not retired law dog wanna-bees.
 

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