Angus bull most responsible for breed improvement

[GTS]

If a sires worth is measured by his progeny, both male and female ,my choice would be RR Rito 707. Most of today's well known angus cattle go back to him one way or the other. This includes not only the Rito cattle but also the Band cattle.
The sire of Traveler 23-4 and Tehama Bando is Band of Ideal 234, commonly called band 105. 105's sire ,707 of Ideal ,is the son of RR Rito 707. Travelers maternal grandsire is PBC 707 IM F0203 whose sire is RR Rito 707.
Scotchcaps maternal grandsire is Band 105. Today's popular carcass sire, Precision, has 707 on both sides. Rito 9j9 is double bred 707. 6807 goes back to 707 on both sides. Both 6807 and 707 were bred by Dale Davis.

 

[Brad S]

What the hell is the consequence of loose skin?

 

[Faster horses]

GTS, I found your post quite fascinating!!

I remember reading a few years back in a magazine where some of the prominent Montana Angus breeders had been interviewed. One of the questions was, "what do you think is the best bull you have ever raised?" Dale Davis replied, "Rito 707."

That was profound for me, because Dale Davis (PAPA Prefix cattle most currently; RR before that and I think PBC before that) has raised alot of really good Angus cattle. Rito 707 is an OLD bull~been a lot of good ones since his day, yet Dale Davis picked him as the best he had raised.

Dale Davis was one of the Pioneer Breeders, among the first to performance test cattle~at least in Montana, if my memory serves me correctly. We have a Papa Durabull that goes back to Rito F0203, which I bought solely on pedigree. He was from Monte Howry, (a Kit Pharo cooperator) and he is far from the best looking bull in the pen. We have his first calves on the ground and they are good, so far. Young yet, of course.

Along the lines of the above mentioned article, I think it was the same article, but perhaps not~they asked Pat Goggins main man~Mr. Cook, I think it was~what he thought the best bull was that they had raised or purchased and his answer was "Leachman Right Time". He went on to say when Pat bought that bull for an unbelievable amount of money at Jay Leachman's sale, Mr. Cook thought he had 'lost it'. On the way home Pat said that bull would go down in history as one of the best bulls ever~and he was right on. Leachman Right Time does a lot of things really, really good. People that have used him LOVE the females~

 

[Northern Rancher]

Right Time DEFINATELY outbred his sire-I always felt sorry for the old gentleman when you'd see himin stud-I don't think he ever got out of there his last few years. Funny thing if this R-Calf thing would of been a few years earliar he probably wouldn';t of got much use up here. My buddy bought 400 units of him from Alta Genetics the year he died-gonna pop it in a bunch of good commercial cows this summer.

 

[Jason]

What the hell is the consequence of loose skin?

Loose skin around the navel/sheath of a bull can cause injury in areas where scrub brush is thick in breeding pastures.

Loose skin around the chin is more common to Simmental and exotic cattle, so having it in Angus is a cause for concern if the line is pure. Even if it is, buyers backing off the steers because they think they might have other traits is an economic reality.

And like I said not all traits are as important as others.

I had the opportunity to look through the replacement heifer pen of one of my customers in Idaho before this BSE fiasco. He was simply astounded that I could tell him the breed make-up of the dams of his heifers. They were second generation Angus from my bulls, but old Limo, Simmental and even the odd Brahman trait was evident to me.

My herd is founded on old line Marshall and Baros breeding. I was able to (had to depending on how you view it) sell down in 1989 to 35 cows all from the same sire, R&J Blastoff 2040. He was a big thick bull before thick was popular. From that re-start I have built on EPDs for moderate calving and high growth with an eye for carcass and milk. Scrotal has been important, as has structure and eye appeal. That bull was out of a cow dad raised in the 70's that Mac McKeag said was one the te five best cows the breed ever saw.

My theory has always been if a bull has an exceptional dam, he can look average and still be a good bull. How many times have the bulls that look awesome never produced, or ones that throw show winner after show winner never go on to produce (think Stockman 365 won every show but his offspring never produced much).

The other thing is a culling program. If a cow is a poor doer she should be culled no matter what her lineage. She can look tough as long as she is raising the average of your herd with her calves.

This BSE mess has changed my ability to do all I can to improve the breed, I have been forced to revert to selling bulls based on looks rather than true merit. Buyers are trying to survive as I am, and extra information costs. I have birth weights and a semen test and the buyer has his eyes. No other information is being provided this year. So far so good. My 2 yr old pen is empty and the yearlings are half gone. I might survive if we get a good summer, it is raining so that is a start.