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Bell Ranch, An uncertain future

Denny said:
southwestcwby said:
If you didn't get any big snow and didn't put up any hay what would a place that size run year around . I am talking strictly cattle no farming or irrigating?
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Most likely 150 the grass grows fast here then it dies and the heavy fall rain's beat all the leaves off it and all you would have is stem's.Most guy's take a cutting of hay they pasture the hay fields from August 15th until its gone.Also there are no wide open spaces here and no BLM or Government land you have to make due with all private owned grond.

What guy's like you don't understand is that for every ranch that can get by on no hay or farming there's alot more that need to.I would love to not ride a tractor but here it is not practical.It snow's and it rain's in December and January some times and we get a sheet of ice on everything last winter it was 3" thick.Alot of times it makes more sense finacially to say plant corn and chop it for silage 40 acres here can put up 15 ton per acre 600 ton of silage will go along way's here.I would have about $6000 into the whole pile how much range cake would that buy?We in turn bale alot of lowground meadow hay which produces well but you cant get a cow to eat it in the summer and it would be very poor if left until fall to graze.You had better like chaseing cows because they will crawl fences before they would eat it.If you bale it they will eat it once the snow comes.We all make due with what we have it does'nt make one of us wrong or right.

To tell the truth if I had to get up every day and saddle a horse It would get old after a while.And I like rideing horse alot.
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Denny, your MN winters remind me of the '96-'97 winter here. Everything was iced in from early Nov until spring. No grazing here that winter! Was more of a chore to plow out the trails and haystacks than it was to feed the hay. I got pretty good at switching from the bale unroller to the snowblower that winter. Thankfully I had a lot of hay that year and carryover from previous years. Many folks here had to buy hay and battle the weather to get it in.

Put about 300 hrs on the tractor that winter where normally I'd probably only get about 50 hrs.

I think being only being used to the arid and sunny SW climate our "new" friend might freeze off certain body parts in a northern plains winter! :wink: :lol:
 
Soapweed said:
kolanuraven said:
It's no different than, for example, the man who might own the local feed store, whom you'd support with your purchases, owing his own herd of cattle.


Competition makes a healthly market!


I know...I know...you didn't ask ME!!!! :lol:
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It is a public forum, so any input is encouraged. :wink:

To my way of thinking, any church's main calling is to feed people spiritual nourishment. The duty of their congregation is to pursue the day-to-day obligations of life, make an honest living, and with their tithes and offerings support the church.

Yes, sometimes it is necessary to feed peoples' bodies first, so that their hunger pangs aren't standing in the way of them receiving spiritual nourishment. This can be done with donations of food and money to buy food. It doesn't mean that the Church should have to own ranches, to raise calves, that become fat cattle, to be butchered and processed for meat, to have meat to feed spiritually hungry people.

A church owning ranches is akin to the government owning ranches. It almost becomes a communistic enterprise. It is as if the church (or the government) doesn't think individual ranching enterprises are smart enough to know how to run their own outfits.

With the church having so much money from so many resources, they are able to afford to buy ranches that ordinary hard-working private ranchers can't. It is a trend that I don't think is in the best interest of America.

I wouldn't want the Methodists, the Baptists, or the Catholics to own ranches, and I don't think the Mormons should feel the need to do so, either.
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The LDS Church is a lay church there is no paid clergy. Allot of the ranches the Church own was given to them members. Lot of ranches they have sold off like the half of the Pitchfork in Wyoming.
A lot of t farms the Church own the products are used in the Church Welfare system, as is a lot of the monies received from the ranches. We believe we should take care of our self's before the government dose! And they just don't hand out welfare, family should help first, and then you probably will have to do some thing to, like help chop wood for a widow, clean the church house.
Some welfare money ends up in Catholics international aid programs and other international aid programs.
Used to be each ward here had a Church Farm and the members did all the work. Most all have been sold and the asset put into other property, whose income pays for buildings, maintains, and the welfare program
 
I think I live in the land of either Turner or Mormons. The biggest difference I will say is the fact the Mormons encourage their workers to be a part of the community. They are involved in school activities and even some are in the local organizations.

I have family that does big business with the Mormon church and have been so far happy with the business dealings. As I type this who knows what might be going down. :wink:

I don't really have an educated opinion of the Mormons as I haven't invested the time to study their practices. Many say they are cult like and we had a neighbor who divorced and according to her had one heck of a time leaving the church. Does it make me wonder yes. I'm an average human and curiosity runs through me.

I will say they like Turner have the advantage of a multitude of various ways to have income flowing in to help buy land and sustain their agriculture endeavors.

Just my thoughts not at all trying to change anyones.
 
I don't have much problem with the churches doing this. I have more of a problem with people donating to a church and they deduct their contribution. Then the church pays for a ski trip, in essence a tax deductible trip.
 
Maybe I'm more opened minded than most here but:

I don't care who buys/owns/leases land.

I don't care what they raise on it or buisness they may have on it

I don't care what their religion or sexual preference might be with said business

I don't care if they donate to the church, the local orphanage or school or their 3rd cousin 4 x's removed.

I don't care if they do take the tax deduction for doing that donation (cause I would take and 99.99% of you would also.)



If anyone wants to get into the cattle/land business and can afford to nowadays....good for them and I wish them the best!



It's America...it's not my business to get into theirs nor them into mine.


I don't know why everyone wants to single out Mormons...maybe it's just the lack of knowledge creates fear and suspicion ( kinda like what people do about Islam and other belief systems/religions also)....but in my dealing and friendships,relations with them...they're great folks!!!


Me, my cousins and about 14 Morman school teachers floated down the Salmon River one summer...about 6 days....we had a blast!!! I nearly had a break down for lack of Mt. Dew, :lol: :lol: :lol: but one the best trips in years.
 
The LDS Church has been in the livestock business a long time. When they first settled in Utah, tithing was paid with what you grew, weather it was vegetables, hay, cattle, sheep or wool. You took 10% of that years increase to the Bishops Store House, from which it was redistribute to those in need. Now in the 1870s US Government sent in troops to seize Church property. The Churches cowboys moved herd of cattle to the Arizona Strip to the south and into Bear lake Idaho and Star Valley Wyoming to hide them. Some of the first cattle to graze some of those ranges.
 
Mrs.Greg said:
A tad overboard when we feel we have the right to attack a persons church :(
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Apparently didn't read shortgrasses sermon- or else don't take it to heart.. :???: :wink: :?
 
My questions were fairly well answered. I don't necessarily like the fact that all of these great reputation Sandhills ranches are being bought up by Ted Turner and the Mormons, but realize there is not too much that can be done about it. Maybe I should just sell out to Turner and become a Mormon. Then everything would be hunky-dory. :? :wink:

I agree that whoever has the bucks buys the ranches. One thing that would not be justifiable (in my book :roll: ) would be for Mr. Turner to introduce prairie dogs, wolves, or mountain lions to his properties just because he has the "right" to do so. His ranches have excellent buffalo proof fences, but I'll guarantee they would not stop prairie dogs, wolves, or mountain lions from becoming a problem to his neighbors.

Carry on, folks. Don't mind me. :-)
 
Maybe Ted will hire you as a "wolf trainer" to teach the wolves not to like beef- like he did here in Montana....
Didn't work here-but maybe it will on Nebraska beef.... :wink: :lol:
 
Must be great life if all you have to worry over is Ted Turner and Mormons!!! :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:
 
John SD said:
Denny said:
southwestcwby said:
If you didn't get any big snow and didn't put up any hay what would a place that size run year around . I am talking strictly cattle no farming or irrigating?
Click to expand...

Most likely 150 the grass grows fast here then it dies and the heavy fall rain's beat all the leaves off it and all you would have is stem's.Most guy's take a cutting of hay they pasture the hay fields from August 15th until its gone.Also there are no wide open spaces here and no BLM or Government land you have to make due with all private owned grond.

What guy's like you don't understand is that for every ranch that can get by on no hay or farming there's alot more that need to.I would love to not ride a tractor but here it is not practical.It snow's and it rain's in December and January some times and we get a sheet of ice on everything last winter it was 3" thick.Alot of times it makes more sense finacially to say plant corn and chop it for silage 40 acres here can put up 15 ton per acre 600 ton of silage will go along way's here.I would have about $6000 into the whole pile how much range cake would that buy?We in turn bale alot of lowground meadow hay which produces well but you cant get a cow to eat it in the summer and it would be very poor if left until fall to graze.You had better like chaseing cows because they will crawl fences before they would eat it.If you bale it they will eat it once the snow comes.We all make due with what we have it does'nt make one of us wrong or right.

To tell the truth if I had to get up every day and saddle a horse It would get old after a while.And I like rideing horse alot.
Click to expand...

Denny, your MN winters remind me of the '96-'97 winter here. Everything was iced in from early Nov until spring. No grazing here that winter! Was more of a chore to plow out the trails and haystacks than it was to feed the hay. I got pretty good at switching from the bale unroller to the snowblower that winter. Thankfully I had a lot of hay that year and carryover from previous years. Many folks here had to buy hay and battle the weather to get it in.

Put about 300 hrs on the tractor that winter where normally I'd probably only get about 50 hrs.

I think being only being used to the arid and sunny SW climate our "new" friend might freeze off certain body parts in a northern plains winter! :wink: :lol:
Click to expand...

Sound's like thursday morning she'll be a bit chilly -3 for a high they say with no wind chill should be -25 at 7 am.I can't waite.
 
Soapweed said:
My questions were fairly well answered. I don't necessarily like the fact that all of these great reputation Sandhills ranches are being bought up by Ted Turner and the Mormons, but realize there is not too much that can be done about it. Maybe I should just sell out to Turner and become a Mormon. Then everything would be hunky-dory. :? :wink:

I agree that whoever has the bucks buys the ranches. One thing that would not be justifiable (in my book :roll: ) would be for Mr. Turner to introduce prairie dogs, wolves, or mountain lions to his properties just because he has the "right" to do so. His ranches have excellent buffalo proof fences, but I'll guarantee they would not stop prairie dogs, wolves, or mountain lions from becoming a problem to his neighbors.

Carry on, folks. Don't mind me. :-)
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His fences are buffalo proff but somehow not cow proff. A few months ago one of the neighbors cows made it on to Turner. The gates are locked and there was no water. The neighbor called up to the manager and only got his wife. The manager wasn't taking calls today as it was his day off. The neighbor then told about his cows being in that pasture and not only were they in on Turners grass but there was no water and so he knew he needed to get them out. The managers wife told him once again it was not a working day. The neighbor said they had an hour to get down there and unlock the gate or his John Deer was going through the fence. Evidentally Turners help can go out on a nonwork day. :wink: Evidentally what holds buffalo in doesn't hold cows who want in bad enough out. :?
 
Oldtimer said:
Maybe Ted will hire you as a "wolf trainer" to teach the wolves not to like beef- like he did here in Montana....
Didn't work here-but maybe it will on Nebraska beef.... :wink: :lol:
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Wolf "sensitivity training" definitely wouldn't work if the wolves were tempted to sample SD beef. They couldn't possibly resist. :wink: :D :lol:
 
Soapweed said:
Mrs.Greg said:
A tad overboard when we feel we have the right to attack a persons church :(
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Everyone looks at things a bit differently. I can't even think it is particularly "sinful" to haul a horse with the saddle on. :wink: :-)
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Good memory...not "sinful" just wrong...... :wink:
 

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