Larrry
Well-known member
Oldtimer said:its a little late for me to be talking honesty and morality to you...
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What a laugh
Bred cow sale.
- Thread starter 3words
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What a laugh
Oldtimer said:Silver said:
If at your age now- if you don't see the fraud and dishonesty of taking a product born, raised, and processed in another country-- and slapping a USDA stamp on it to pass it off to consumers as a US product as packers do/have done for years - its a little late for me to be talking honesty and morality to you...
And You are correct- I do believe that we in the US should be doing everything in our power to make a dollar for the producers/business owners of our country- even if its at the expense of foreign owners ...
http://ranchers.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=67733&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0
At least the product should be labeled to give the consumer an honest choice....
So you are telling us that a beef animal killed and processed in the US is not a product of USA? Just answer that one question and quit babbling about all the other nonsense please.
You're not worried about consumer choice, you are worried about raking your neighbours over the coals and putting every road block possible in their way so you can have a chance at making an extra nickel at their expense.
gcreekrch said:
Well, probably not but little Joe's comment got my dandruff up and now OT has got me feeling righteously indignant! :lol:
It's pretty hard to argue with someone who has an agenda and will only look for arguments to support that agenda rather than keeping an open mind. Kinda ironic considering he likes to preach that he's an independent thinker with an open mind......
A
Anonymous
Guest
Silver said:Oldtimer said:Silver said:
If at your age now- if you don't see the fraud and dishonesty of taking a product born, raised, and processed in another country-- and slapping a USDA stamp on it to pass it off to consumers as a US product as packers do/have done for years - its a little late for me to be talking honesty and morality to you...
And You are correct- I do believe that we in the US should be doing everything in our power to make a dollar for the producers/business owners of our country- even if its at the expense of foreign owners ...
http://ranchers.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=67733&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0
At least the product should be labeled to give the consumer an honest choice....
So you are telling us that a beef animal killed and processed in the US is not a product of USA? Just answer that one question and quit babbling about all the other nonsense please.
You're not worried about consumer choice, you are worried about raking your neighbours over the coals and putting every road block possible in their way so you can have a chance at making an extra nickel at their expense.
Yes- a beef animal born, raised, killed and processed in the US is a product of the USA- and so is a beef animal born, raised, killed, and processed in Canada, Mexico, Uruguay, or Brazil in they eyes of the US consumer... All are stamped with a USDA stamp and passed off as domestic product... Without the M-COOL law the packers/processors/retailers had/have no obligation to tell consumers the truth- and for years have passed off foreign product as domestic...
Which is wrong in my eyes....And in the eyes of many is flat out FRAUD...
Like I said earlier- I think Canadian beef (if honestly/correctly labeled) could stand on its own as much of the problems perceived by consumers come from products from Mexico and the other 40 countries we import meat from... BUT give the consumers an informed and honest choice and then leave it to them....
You and I will never agree on this- BUT I don't know why USA cattlemen/ranch owners should be any different than any other US business owner when it comes to supporting/promoting their product first to the consumers of the US ! And why US consumers that support US products can't have an easy opportunity to purchase a totally US produced (born, raised, and slaughtered) product....
http://ranchers.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=67733&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0
But without the truth in labeling required by M-COOL they don't have that opportunity...
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Anonymous
Guest
Silver said:
NO... Its a product of both countries...In fact If it was born and spent its entire life in Canada- and then hauled across the line to get its head cut off-- I'd say its life/background has been influenced more by Canada then the US...
That is the reason I like the current truth in labeling law that would show this as a product born and raised in Canada and slaughtered in the US.... Leave the choice to the consumer...Same as the Mexican cattle that come into the country to be slaughtered... Show them as born and raised in Mexico and slaughtered in the US... Leave the decision to the consumer if they want their families eating animals raised in Mexico...
I like the new rule because it actually gives the consumer more info and transparency than before the WTO challenge/ruling...
Those born, raised, and slaughtered in the USA would be so labeled... So the consumer would have the information before them to make a choice on whether to support and BUY USA or not......
leanin' H
Well-known member
As a proud American, i do try and buy American made items. I do not want my dollars going to China or Mexico. I have no problems buying Canadian products. They have been wonderful neighbors, stood next to us through world wars and should be a major trade pardner. Why ship our doohickeys to chumbawamba where they hate us when we could trade with Canada who only mostly hate us thanks to idiotic laws like mcool. Any consumer worth his salt can find out where their food comes from and buy accordingly. Why not treat our northern neighbors like the ALLIES they are instead of being worried about losing a penny or two. Last time i checked cattle are at historic prices. Atleast here in the states. But laws like mcool have a ripple effect and this website has many many examples of Canadian producers recieving less money for an equal (or God forbid, Superior) product. They are not mexico and should never be treated the same. I am with ya Canadian brothers! I wish i had a stronger voice than just a desert dweller with no connections.
Oldtimer said:
And that is where of course you are dead wrong. End of story. If you want to be right you need to change the whole NAFTA agreement. Until you are just pissing and moaning, and your government is breaking the law.
On a side note, I see your vehicles down there say "Made in USA" on them. You must be quite indignant about that considering so much of the vehicles originate elsewhere.
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Anonymous
Guest
leanin' H said:
I agree with you H as far as Canada and Canadians go- BUT the fact is we import meat products from a lot more countries than just Canada... And some of those countries (Mexico, Uruguay, and southeast Asia come to mind first) have questionable environmental and drug usage issues- as well as major problems with government inspectors that receive the majority of the wages thru graft... Mexico's (along with some other countries) history of sending tainted and contaminated products is not good..
For those reasons the Congress of the US said they want the US consumers to be allowed to know where their meat products come from and passed a law requiring such... And the WTO says we can't pick and choose which countries we require to label- all must be treated the same...So we either require ALL or NONE...
And to me its better to have MORE transparency and truth in labeling than it is to have less...
leanin' H
Well-known member
Oldtimer said:
I agree with you H as far as Canada and Canadians go- BUT the fact is we import meat products from a lot more countries than just Canada... And some of those countries (Mexico, Uruguay, and southeast Asia come to mind first) have questionable environmental and drug usage issues- as well as major problems with government inspectors that receive the majority of the wages thru graft... Mexico's (along with some other countries) history of sending tainted and contaminated products is not good..
For those reasons the Congress of the US said they want the US consumers to be allowed to know where their meat products come from and passed a law requiring such... And the WTO says we can't pick and choose which countries we require to label- all must be treated the same...So we either require ALL or NONE...
And to me its better to have MORE transparency and truth in labeling than it is to have less...[/quote
So you want to protect American interests and American beef but also give up sovernty by following the WTO? How can you have it both ways. Your either totally for American rights for our products or for the WTO who limits our options. Why anyone would lump Canada in with mexico is beyond me? And to stand by while the WTO tells us how we will trade is assinine. Mexico has a horrible and well earned reputation as does china. We have every right as a nation to pick and choose our trade pardners, the hell with the WTO. Lets stand with our allies and neighbors! Stand with folks who have a wonderful country and deserve to be treated fairly and honestly! Stand with a nation who has earned our respect and trust! No UN or WTO ruling should be worth the paper its written on.
littlejoe
Well-known member
Silver said:
A product of Canada, processed in U.S.
Stay in school.
littlejoe
Well-known member
Big Muddy rancher said:
That's up to you. Personally, I take it off mine before eating. (this is kinda like the 'Do not Remove!" tag on a mattress---the guy who buys it can take it off w/o getting in trouble, 'eh?) But it's there when sold, the consumer can tell where it came from.
Hey--I take the 'dole' sticker offa bananas too---but that's also up to you.
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Anonymous
Guest
leanin' H said:
Leanin H- our sovereignty was given up when we signed all the world trade agreements starting with GATT, then WTO and including NAFTA-- which incidentally includes Mexico just like Canada as part of the North American trade act ..... Canada further lumped itself in with Mexico when it sued and challenged the US Congress and got the last WTO ruling-- Which we've now had to make M-COOL more stringent in order to meet the consumers request, Congress's law, and still pass WTO muster... And if you look at the post I put on the Bull Session thread you will see that our current rules are now similar to the ones the European Union is also going to....If you check out the rules of many other countries- they have long had Country of Origin Labeling laws and our beef/meat sent to those countries have had to be labeled... Why should consumers of every other country have the country of origin of their food products (including US imports) easily identified- and the US consumers not :???:
littlejoe
Well-known member
Silver said:
"Well, probably not but little Joe's comment got my dandruff up and now OT has got me feeling righteously indignant! :lol: "
Here's my comment:
I got lots of Canadian friends and relatives and always figured they divided our countries wrong---shoulda drew the line north to south and left the back easters and left coasties together.
That being said---our markets never were completely closed to you--even during worst of bse. Even though our own markets overseas have never completed recovered--and perhaps not even our domestic demand---we let you back in. You are the ones where the bse cattle originated that started this whole mess---long after any any cow fed byproducts shoulda died of old age---thank yourselves. As far as cool---you can buy a bag of apples and every damn one of them says where it's from--really shouldn't be that tough and people got a right to know where their food comes from.XXXXXXXXXXX
What part of it got yer "dandruff" up?
Any part of it you care to dispute?
Accepting the logical consequences of your own actions is generally considered sane adult behavior.
ps--the comment about 'does it still have it's sticker on after it's peeled?" was pretty cute--and I didn't answer it earlier 'cause I only saw it tonight.
psss---But--I see Old Timer has responded to a few---and shore as clockwork, the homely schoolyard bully gurls showed up in droves---guess I've never read this board intensly enough to savvy the hatred----I do know I hate mobs, bullys and cowards---hmmm...repeating myself on last phrase.
leanin' H
Well-known member
If your calling me a coward and a bully you need your damn head examined. 
Just cause somebody disagrees with you doesnt make them a coward or a bully. But it does make you a total jackass.
Just cause somebody disagrees with you doesnt make them a coward or a bully. But it does make you a total jackass.littlejoe
Well-known member
leanin' H said:If your calling me a coward and a bully you need your damn head examined.
You're overreacting, sport---and---unlike you---I never called YOU nothing~~
OT posted a while back on leaving the political board----this brought out about 100 moronic posts, basically trying to bait him back, one little gurl chiming in with others---picking on the unpopular kid, dontcha' know, it's ok if everybody's doing it? ....I despise this sh#T---I don't ever recall seeing you in this menagerie---but it you choose to designate yerself as one of the gang, so be it
leanin' H
Well-known member
littlejoe said:leanin' H said:If your calling me a coward and a bully you need your damn head examined.
You're overreacting, sport---and---unlike you---I never called YOU nothing~~
OT posted a while back on leaving the political board----this brought out about 100 moronic posts, basically trying to bait him back, one little gurl chiming in with others---picking on the unpopular kid, dontcha' know, it's ok if everybody's doing it? ....I despise this sh#T---I don't ever recall seeing you in this menagerie---but it you choose to designate yerself as one of the gang, so be it
Throw generalizations around you call everyone out! I dont like political bull for the reasons you just spouted. But you sure as hell arent winning many points by playing by the same rules you claim to despise.
gcreekrch
Well-known member
Larrry said:Oldtimer said:its a little late for me to be talking honesty and morality to you...
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What a laugh
Sad that a human ? that doesn't live by those words would even try to use them.