One problem we seem to have during calving : calves being born with the sack around their head and body. If the cow doesn't get up immediately, the calf suffocates if you're not there to physically break it or pull it off. Is this a problem for anyone else? I've been told it's feed related - any thoughts on this?
Calving Problems
- Thread starter Vic in NE
- Start date
Big Swede
Well-known member
I've never heard that theory about feed. It is very disheartening though when it happens.
Faster horses
Well-known member
I don't think anyone knows for sue what causes it and it seems like
some years are worse than others for it to happen. And it happens to
everyone, at one time or another. You just can't be right there for
every one born.
some years are worse than others for it to happen. And it happens to
everyone, at one time or another. You just can't be right there for
every one born.
Yes, it sure is disheartening, because we do about live with them. One theory was because the cow's protein (being good for the cow and her health, but possibly causing a stronger sack). Thank you for your replies, let me know if you hear more.
A
Anonymous
Guest
One of the reasons I prefer low birthweight/calving ease bulls in both heifers and cows....If the cow isn't tired out from a long calving duration- she is much more apt to be up/or get up and go to work on that calf right away...
I'm still a believer in what little you lose in weaning weight by using lower birth weight/CED bulls- you more than make up for in weight from having more live calves....
I'm still a believer in what little you lose in weaning weight by using lower birth weight/CED bulls- you more than make up for in weight from having more live calves....
Big Muddy rancher
Well-known member
Oldtimer said:
I feel the same way but was told by a breeder one time that a little more birth weight would make the cow work harder and probably break the sack before the calf was all the way out. Those little calves come out intact sack and all. :?
Mike
Well-known member
I have seen this to be true. Especially first calf heifers that don't know what's really going on.Big Muddy rancher said:
Plus, by breeding to have very small calves and keeping the heifers, one day you'll wake up and have a herd that ain't big enough to birth a goat. :wink:
Lot's of variables to easy calving. Not too thin & not too fat. Gestation length. Pelvic sizes. And the list goes on.............
Like everything else.
Moderation.
Our average birth weights on our heifers are 60-70 pounds and on the mature cows 75-85 pounds...we only breed to linebred genepools to ensure consistency in this very thing! I agree with low birth weights totally, but our maternal linebred angus are fairly low birth when compared to breed averages. Average calving period from time of sac showing through vulva and when the calf hits the ground is about 1 hr to 1.5 hours. It's just frustrating when you check your cattle every couple of hours and stilll lose a handful to sacs! Right now were having about 30 a day, and even though we check them often, its sometimes hard to be right there for every one.
A
Anonymous
Guest
Mike said:
Right there is the answer... And I know of ranchs that have been around for 100 years that use that theory- that calve out on the prairie with no/little oversight on their calving herd...
badroute
Well-known member
I can relate to what you are going through. Although I beleive it could be somewhat of a nutrition issue.
My wife bought some hereford heifers a few years back from a big country outfit that were a touch on the green side. I think she bought them in a late January sale and they were calving by the middle of March. We were able to get some weight on them but they still had rough hair coats and really stuck out like sore thumbs when compared to our own. To make a long story short when they would start to calve the waterbag would be just black in color and the bag was extremely thick. It literally took a knife to break the water bag a finger wouldn't even get close to puncturing it. We learned this the hard way after we lost on with the sac over the head. Since she only bought a trailer load we made sure we were right there when they all calved. We never had this porblem on our own.
I made her sell them that fall so I don't know if 6 months on a good mineral program cure them.
My wife bought some hereford heifers a few years back from a big country outfit that were a touch on the green side. I think she bought them in a late January sale and they were calving by the middle of March. We were able to get some weight on them but they still had rough hair coats and really stuck out like sore thumbs when compared to our own. To make a long story short when they would start to calve the waterbag would be just black in color and the bag was extremely thick. It literally took a knife to break the water bag a finger wouldn't even get close to puncturing it. We learned this the hard way after we lost on with the sac over the head. Since she only bought a trailer load we made sure we were right there when they all calved. We never had this porblem on our own.
I made her sell them that fall so I don't know if 6 months on a good mineral program cure them.
Well, where to start. A heifer that could not birth a goat, would indeed be a small heifer. That's not our problem. Please don't be offended by my remarks, but my son is 5th generation rancher, we've survived during the '78 foreclosures that many went thru- we've been here 'forever' and know the disposition and background of every cow, and during calving they are in close (but not barn confined) and checked, fed, and made sure general health is in top condition. We have discussed this with our vets, trying to see if there is something that can be done, or if it's 'just the way it is'. One thing that was brought to our attention; if the sacks could possibly be stronger due to excellent nutrition value of the cows, (say good protein, mineral program) that would explain why some people have no problems with sacks, the sacks are not 'strong' and tear easily. No, as far as we can tell, there really hasn't been any studies on such a thing.
Added: I am not saying if you have no problems with sacs, you aren't taking care of your animals with a good mineral program, etc. I could be the feed, who knows. One thing to add, our cattle are not excessively fat, but they are fed well.
Added: I am not saying if you have no problems with sacs, you aren't taking care of your animals with a good mineral program, etc. I could be the feed, who knows. One thing to add, our cattle are not excessively fat, but they are fed well.
flyingS
Well-known member
So is their water breaking or is it too tough as well? Is the placenta just over the head or is the whole calf covered? It's pretty frustrating to have bad luck and not be able to explain it other than just plain old bad luck.
Soapweed
Well-known member
One thing about the sacks, when you do get there right in time to save a calf, you feel rather heroic and like you've done a good deed for the day. 
milkmaid
Well-known member
I've heard abnormally thick sacs linked to fescue... Different source of feed this year?
Mike
Well-known member
milkmaid said:
Yep. Endophye infected Fescue.
Last week I had a cow calving for 2 hours with no luck , just the bag showing so I caught her & checked her the calf was coming right but the bag I couldn't tear . I cut it with my knife I have never seen a sack like that before . I got the calf easy after that . The vet said he has seen half a dozen like that this year .
C Thompson
Well-known member
Hello Vic, 30 calves per day sounds like lots of cattle calving. Are the total number of cows high or are these synchronized? Is this just the odd one out of many meaning that percentage wise is it that significant? Are these heifers, cows, both? Don't have any opinion but am curious on these details.
river rat
Well-known member
I know it is different from year to year here, so I'm sure that feed, or enviromental conditions will make them more pliable from year to year. The only problem is, I don't know what the feed, or enviromental change is. 
We've had years when the waterbag would completley cover calves and not break, and I even had a heifer one year push so hard, that when I cut the waterbag, the calf came squirting out so fast, that the heifer prolapsed. I'll agree that it's very disheartening, and I wish I knew what caused them to get thicker, and tougher in different years. I haven't had to remove hardly any this year, they have been real easy and they push right through them.
We've had years when the waterbag would completley cover calves and not break, and I even had a heifer one year push so hard, that when I cut the waterbag, the calf came squirting out so fast, that the heifer prolapsed. I'll agree that it's very disheartening, and I wish I knew what caused them to get thicker, and tougher in different years. I haven't had to remove hardly any this year, they have been real easy and they push right through them.